Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

James D. Macdonald said:

Myself, I take filecards (one per character) and write details about the character on 'em as I learn more about the person in the writing of the book.

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I like this as a concept, but those have gotta be some big-*** cards or some Lilliputian penmanship.

You use as many filecards per character as necessary.

:Smack: D-oh! That's why you get the big bucks.

As I plot my next project, I have been writing out their bios sort of as an attempt at backstory, first in a notebook, then transferred all of them to a Word file. I have to be largely paperless or else I would not survive with three children! Plus the whole "taking everything with me" thing doesn't work without my USB drive.

Anyway, as I was writing their bios, I found I was actually writing the story itself. So I am certain that as I begin writing and the story evolves, then my characters will evolve. The Bios will be disposed of as soon as the stories are written. It has been an extraordinary organizational tool for me. Plus, since I generally stick with third-person focused, it helps keep the POV's in their own little world. The individual motivations become clear.

Tools

I, too, use a separate Word file for character bios and notes on inspirational musings. I can have the file open at the same time as my ms file and refer to it as needed for consistency.

Another tool I use is a small digital recorder that I keep in my van. Works great for those lightbulb things that happen as I drive down the road.

J. Y. (Jean) Moore

J. Y. Moore said:

Another tool I use is a small digital recorder that I keep in my van. Works great for those lightbulb things that happen as I drive down the road.

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I have one of those, too, but I rarely use it. Most of the time I just use my cell phone to call home and leave the idea on my voicemail.

I tend to use my memory. That way if I forget an idea, I'll know that my subconscious didn't think much of it.

De Profundis

A good thread, recently dredged from the depths in the Bewares Board: Agents Charging Fees

Jim,

Forgive me for not boning up on the previous 4569 or so posts, but I am reading this at my day job. Writing, these days, is my night job. That beng said, what would be the next step in my recent cycle of continuously rewriting my novel (first for adults; I've published 12 other books, and three YA novels).
Admittedly, I love rewriting and sometimes feel I've just scratched the surface of my novel's potential (after a mere two years). But at other times I wonder if I have the ability at this point to really know how to identify and/or confront the main problems of the book.
Two editors who've read portions had some nice things to say before rejecting it. I'm not sure how much they read, but one had a problem with the voice, the other with the plot. Does that mean the book is doomed.
Is this where a Beta reader should step in? But I'm reluctant to approach even published friends with such a monumental task.

If you haven't had a beta reader (someone who can be brutally honest) read your book, yes, now's the time.

And, after two years of rewriting, now might be the time to start your next book.

I congratulate you on your earlier publication. All you really need is to work on the slightly different skillset you'll need for novels intended for adults. I wouldn't neglect YA while all this is going on, though.

Jim,

I remember reading somewhere or maybe I'm making it up that the first draft is just to get it all out, the second is for voice, the third character, the fourth plot, etc. So I could just be getting started!

Actually, I spent a year on the first draft of 120,000 words. Then I spent almost a year waiting for my agent to respond and send it around. He finally sent it to a grand total of one place before I took it back. In the interim I published a collection of interviews and have a second edition of a reference book I did in 1997 coming out this summer. In the last few months I've trimmed it to under 100,000 words. But I keep finding new and fascinating areas to explore.

To me, anyway, rewriting is the best part. After that it's sending it around, getting rejections, insufficient advances, inadequate promotion, reviewers who don't get it, friends who only want free copies, etc.

As far as YA, I think I was probably ahead of my time (these were done around 1980, when I was probably 9 years old myself). I'd love to see a couple of them reprinted.
But I do think a Beta reader would be a godsend.

Those YAs -- I presume they've reverted? Did they have decent sales figures?

Jim,
I wish there were some way I could get on bookscan and see some sales figures. Who can figure out royalty statements?
The first book got a great review in the Horn Book and a paperback sale. The second got a great review in Kirkus and made a Library Best of the Year List.
One reviewer said of the third that my likely audience was "literate, sophisticated and cynical 16-20 year olds," which I thought was probably right. I'll bet there are a lot more of them these days.
My original editor (only on the first book) was Melanie Kroupa, who has her own line of books at Farrar Strauss now.

popmuze said:

My original editor (only on the first book) was Melanie Kroupa, who has her own line of books at Farrar Strauss now.

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Are you agented?

This might be time to get in touch with Ms. Kroupa (assuming you had a decent relationship with her).

We had a good relationship. She was the one left me after all (as have all of my previous editors and all but one of my previous agents. Luckily my wife has stood by me...)I do have an agent at this point, who has been avoiding my fiction like the plague but has had success with my non-fiction.
Are you saying that Ms Kroupa might
A) read my adult fiction
B) Get Farrar Strauss to reprint my YA titles
C) Be good to approach with a new YA idea.

By the way, all those "literate, sophisticated and cynical 16-20 year olds" would now be 41-45 and the perfect age to enjoy my new fiction!

See if she's interested in reprint rights.

Uncle Jim, I've run into a bit of a problem since I've finished my current WP.

When finished, a better idea for storyline and plot for this book popped into my mind.

The two original ideas I put together for the plot line were good. I finished the book and a new plot that I thought would be much better for the storyline came to mind. The ending jiggled it to the fore. I thought, wow, this would be so much better if I were to follow this new plot to reach the same ending.



What are your thoughts on the above?

1. Re-write what I have and keep the same plot?

2. Re-write with the new plot?

3. Write a new book with the same premise and the new plot?

4. Other?

Thanks, Ken

If I were in your position, Ken, I'd write a new, better, different book. That is to say, choice 3.

Meanwhile:

Fame, sweet fame!

http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/blogspotting/archives/2005/07/out_of_the_dark.html

Sorta. I'm almost kinda mentioned by BusinessWeek. Now to see if maybe next time they'll spell my name right.

James D. Macdonald said:

If I were in your position, Ken, I'd write a new, better, different book. That is to say, choice 3.

Meanwhile:

Fame, sweet fame!

http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/blogspotting/archives/2005/07/out_of_the_dark.html

Sorta. I'm almost kinda mentioned by BusinessWeek. Now to see if maybe next time they'll spell my name right.

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I thought you might say that. I felt the same but wondered what others may have done when confronted with this conundrum.

I've already started. The nice thing about it is I can pull scenes from the previous work and insert them in the new story.

The realization of this new storyline's evolution will make a better book.
It also gives me clear, more defined direction to the story.

Good for you on the mention, Jim. I hope it reaps beneifits.

Ken

It's something I've done before: take a novel that I'm not happy with, use its major plot points as the starting points for an outline for an entirely new novel and see what happens. Improved it a lot.

How do you guys go about reviewing and revising your novel?

At what point to you give it to a betta reader? (Have you ever given just the chapter-by-chapter synopsis/outline to a betta reader? Or do you think that is a spoiler and takes away the gist from reading the whole novel)

Is it any way to ensure that an idea is good enough to be exploited in a novel? (Yeah, probably you'd say the idea does not count as much, as with the same idea one could write a good novel, while someone else could write a bad one) Stilll we have to make decisions with regard to the priority of ideas: which to keep and which to discard...

Thanks,
Pencilone

Pencilone said:

How do you guys go about reviewing and revising your novel?

At what point to you give it to a betta reader? (Have you ever given just the chapter-by-chapter synopsis/outline to a betta reader? Or do you think that is a spoiler and takes away the gist from reading the whole novel)

Is it any way to ensure that an idea is good enough to be exploited in a novel? (Yeah, probably you'd say the idea does not count as much, as with the same idea one could write a good novel, while someone else could write a bad one) Stilll we have to make decisions with regard to the priority of ideas: which to keep and which to discard...

Thanks,
Pencilone

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I give my manuscript to a beta reader only after I am sure it is as good as I can make it. After I get it back, I usually discover how wrong I was! I don't give a chapter-by-chapter outline (or even talk about it), because I want the beta reader to be surprised (or confused) just like any reader would be. One of the problems with editing your own work is that you know what the words are supposed to say rather than what they actually say. Giving any sort of heads-up, handicaps them in the same way.

Rather than saying "beta reader" say "focus group" or "test audience" if it helps explain the concept better.

The question is "Yes, but does the novel work?" You'll know it's working when the beta readers start handing copies to their friends and begging you for more.

A high bar? Sure. Publishing in general has a high bar.

There's a discussion happening right now in the Children's board here at AW about the Delacourt contest (for first YA novels). Some folks won't submit because some years Delacourt doesn't select anyone at all. (There's no entry fee, BTW -- it's a chance to have your book read even if you don't have an agent.)

I find it entirely reasonable that some years they don't find any manuscripts that meet their needs. That isn't to say the books are crap -- only that they don't meet that publisher's needs.

Thanks, uncle Jim and Roger .

I'd love to take part in the Delacorte contest, and the only thing that bothers me is that it's only for residents from USA and Canada. Do you think they would mind too much if I post it to one of my friends from US, who could post it to them? Would that be cheating? If they really like the book they should not care that I'm from the UK...