Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

alanna said:

Does any one else get caught up in editing before the rough draft is done, or is it just me?

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I finished my first novel in about a year, but it would have been months quicker if I hadn't started every session by going back a few pages and reading.

And you can't read at the computer without making changes. More times than I can count, I started at the beginning and just edited what was already there.

I hadn't joined any writer's groups, I didn't search the internet, and I didn't talk to anyone about writing. (It started as a typing excercise to prevent the loss of that painfully-earned skill.) I didn't know what was right and what was wrong, either in techniques for writing or the writing skills discussed in this thread.

Now that I know what a mistake it is to edit instead of finish the first draft... I still do it. (Niven's Law #17: No technique works if it isn't used.)

Meh. Writing takes more discipline than I maybe have.

Roger J Carlson said:

OH! That's TERRIBLE!

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Thank you!


By the way, sometimes when I'm not posting here, I'm peeing.

I just didn't want you all to think I never do.

Everyone, if the board is suddenly unreadable, switch to "linear mode" in "Display modes" (link at the right end of the blue bar, top of the page).

Threaded mode just plain doesn't work.

loquax said:

This is a bit more like it. Now we're getting where I wanted - a debate on the balance between realism and artistic licence.

Personally I'm on Roger's side. The ammo thing always gets to me (a normal machine gun clip lasts about five seconds if you hold your finger on the trigger.) And the cops always hide behind car doors. An air-rifle pellet could puncture a car door. As well as a bible in your left breast pocket.

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Sorry if I'm straying but I couldn't let this slip. I was on a course a couple of years ago for reporters who work in wars or other hostile environments. The instructors, former Royal Marine Commandos, took us out to the range to demonstrate where a reporter can actually take cover when he's shot at.
They had built walls of concrete, brick, sandbags and other materials and shot at them to show what would happen to somebody hiding behind them. They also set up doors from five different types of cars and shot at them with an AK47 from about 20 meters. The bullet went through most but the door of a Toyota Corolla stopped it. The instructors weren't overly surprised. I also know a BBC cameraman who was shot in the hip in Kosovo. The bullet was stopped by his cell phone and a wad of currency in his hip pouch. Heck of a bruise though. I don't know the range on that one. The weapon was most likely an AK47.

That said, I probably wouldn't include it in a novel because some, or maybe most, readers would doubt it, as shown here.

Thanks. Adam

Bullets are funny things. So are human bodies. They both surprise you.

Also -- an awful lot of AK ammo is old, or was manufactured with a bit less quality control than you might like. Some of it is likely underpowered.

Yes. A lot of coincidences probably lead up to the car door stopping the bullet. Weak ammo hitting just the right spot, etc. And I wouldn't want to read it in a novel unless the author had good reason to include a passage that could strain credibility. Kind of like solving your character's financial woes by having him win the lottery. It could fit, but with care and good reason. The story may become one about problems caused by his windfall.

So, as for the debate between realism and artistic license, it seems an author may sometimes have to ignore what is strictly realistic so that the text sounds realistic. Giving the character the urge to pee in the middle of a scene, while completely realistic, is probably either besides the point or a setup for further action.

By the way, thank you Uncle Jim for this wonderful thread. I've learned more from it than from any book I've read.

Adam

Re: query letters.

I know what they are, but are there any examples on the net of how to write a compelling query?

changling said:

Re: query letters.

I know what they are, but are there any examples on the net of how to write a compelling query?

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There are approximately as many opinions about what makes a compelling query letter as there are agents and publishers. Here's one I've recently turned to.
http://absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9780

A compelling query?

Keep it to one page. Two at most.

Beyond that ... there's not much I can say other than spell the agent's name right, and watch your grammar and spelling.

changling said:

Re: query letters.

I know what they are, but are there any examples on the net of how to write a compelling query?

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I had an "a-ha" moment while reading this one -- I realised that the query letter is simply a business-to-business direct marketing letter, so should be treated like one. Hence, the three most important things: put right up front what you're selling, give the reasons why it would benefit the recipient to buy it, and keep it short.

But then I've worked in B2B marketing before, so I'm familiar with those things.

jules said:

I had an "a-ha" moment while reading this one

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Hmm. The author implies that synopses should be double spaced, but Jim has explained that no one is going to edit your synopsis, so don't do it that way.

Other than that, good link.

James D. Macdonald said:

A compelling query?

Keep it to one page. Two at most.

Beyond that ... there's not much I can say other than spell the agent's name right, and watch your grammar and spelling.

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Jim, Compelling in the sense that the query gets me to at least having the first three chapters read.

Thanks for the info.

I ususally use the second example. Also, I start my chapters halfway down the page. I think they like it that way so they can write notes all over the first page of each chapter.

Drop a third or half-way down the page. Chapter number or title centered, drop another couple of lines, then start the first paragraph.

Meanwhile: a nice review of an older book: http://www.livejournal.com/users/blackhanddpants/4107.html

Goofing up

Never felt so stupid. I think I swapped the covering letters in my query to two agents. Found out about it when I got a sorry no luck, reply from Agent #1: "NB: Your letter was addressed to Agent #2, instead of Agent #1."



Has anybody here ever done anything like that?

- Paritosh

LOL. I think everybody's done something like that. I think I forgot to remove the "enclosed please find the first three chapters as requested in your guidelines." I was only sending the query and a synop. Oops.

paritoshuttam said:

Has anybody here ever done anything like that?

- Paritosh

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Not that I know of, but I've queried so many agents, that it's virtually certain I've made some mistake like that. I wonder how many form rejections are a result of something like this?

Still, all is not necessarily lost. Give it some time and then requery. Don't mention the earlier faux pas. I imagine most agents receive so many queries that they can't afford to remember all the ones they've rejected -- regardless of the reason. Even if they do and reject you again because of it, you haven't lost anything.

Out of curiousity (not subscribing to Writer's Market myself), what do they recommend Times New Roman for? Manuscripts? Cover letters? Synopses? Queries? Self-editing?

MzPrint said:

So, why does the Writer's Market (page 10) recommend Times New Roman? And when I went to type this message the default font was Verdana. Btw, Writer's Market/Writer's Digest are deteriorating, seems like they are more interested in selling books on writing than actually printing helpful articles. We pay for a subscription to get a whole magazine full of ads.

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Um, I'm not sure what the default font of a forum has to do with manuscript format, but as far as the other, I think it's been said before that any information on format offered by guides are just that -- guides. Always bow to whatever the market/agent you're targetting requests. If Joe Agent asks for papyrus in small caps, do it.

MzPrint said:

So, why does the Writer's Market (page 10) recommend Times New Roman? And when I went to type this message the default font was Verdana. Btw, Writer's Market/Writer's Digest are deteriorating, seems like they are more interested in selling books on writing than actually printing helpful articles. We pay for a subscription to get a whole magazine full of ads.

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Like the person above, I'm not sure what the default (or any) font on this message board has to do with what font is proper to use when writing a novel.

Also, it would be helpful if you quote whatever post it is that you're referring to, as this is somewhat vague, and one must do quite a bit of searching through the posts to find what "misinformation" you're referring to.

The above comment from scribbler was also correct in stating that these places such as Writer's Market are just guides; use whatever font the market or agent prefers. If you're not sure, then ask, but do not assume.

paritoshuttam said:

Has anybody here ever done anything like that?

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Happens all the darned time. Editor at Publisher A gets a cover letter addressed to Editor at Publisher B. Or the body of the cover letter talks about how the author always wanted to be published by Publisher C when the editor reading the letter is working for Publisher D.

Always check and doublecheck the names before you send something out.

Fonts

Times New Roman may be right but Courier 10 is never wrong. (Unless the guidelines say so.)