StoneGarden.net Publishing / StoneGardenBooks.com

kristin724 said:

Here's the link to the contract:
http://www.stonegarden.net/pubagreement.html

Just a little to vague. I'm definately going to email some questions to the publisher before I plunge.

K

Click to expand...

More than just a little vague -- try internally inconsistent. For example:

stonegarden.net/pubagreement said:

1.2 Terms of Service. If you become an author, you will continue to be bound by all of the terms and conditions of the Terms of Service, which are incorporated into this Contract by this reference. Any disputes relating to this Contract with StoneGarden.Net Publishing will be subject to confidential binding arbitration. If the terms of this Contract conflict with the Terms of Service, this Contract will govern and be given precedence.

Click to expand...

Since the Terms of Service are bound into the contract, the terms of the Contract cannot conflict with the Terms of Service,since they are one in the same. If they do conflict, how do you know which part of the contract has precedence?
I also dislke Paragraph 8 in toto.

Remember, however, that I am not a lawyer, and this post displays merely my uninformed personal opinion.

Red flags in the contract:

- Typos and mis-spellings. Never a good sign.

- From Clause 4 (my emphasis): "Licensing Your Content to StoneGarden.Net Publishing. In uploading any of your Content to the Web Site, you grant to StoneGarden.Net Publishing a royalty-free, worldwide, transferable, nonexclusive, right and license in such Content, in all media existing now or created in the future, to do what it deems reasonable:" This is pretty sweeping. Also--royalty-free?

- From Clause 6 (my emphasis): "StoneGarden.Net Publishing Marketing of Your Title(s). StoneGarden.Net Publishing reserves the right, but has no obligation, to promote your title(s)..." What kind of publisher feels it doesn't have the obligation to promote its titles?

- Also from Clause 6: "ISBN Numbers. StoneGarden.Net Publishing may assign an ISBN number to your title(s)at their discretion." In other words, it may not assign an ISBN number. In which case your title couldn't be sold on Amazon or other online vendors.

- Clause 7 deals with payments to the author, some of which are described as "royalties." However, in Clause 4, you've granted StoneGarden a royalty-free license to your work. To put it mildly, there is some conflict here.

- Clause 7.4, which lets StoneGarden donate money due you to a charity of its choice if you don't fulfill certain obligations, is just weird.

There is a lot that's not adding up here. There's also no evidence that StoneGarden is capable of any meaningful book promotion or distribution, apart from its own website. It's like self-publishing, only with a bad contract.

- Victoria

Stonegarden Publishing

I'm looking to see if anyone has successfully worked for stonegarden.net. I'm a graduate student at Portland State, in publishing, and I'm giving a panel about publishing at SakuraCon in Seattle. The person who runs this place has volunteered to help me in my panel. Now at first I said, "sure, great, whatever, always glad to have other opinions" (I was simply told it was someone else in the publishing industry who volunteered) until I actually took a look at the website. Now I'm far more suspicious and don't really want my name attached to them.

http://absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43881 - that is the only time I can find them mentioned here before. But the contract break down fits with what I was beginning to think of them.

Thanks for any information!

~Cassie

They've revised their publishing agreement since we criticized it. Still a couple of problems--the publisher reserves the right to impose buyout fees if the author terminates the agreement prior to the end of the initial 2-year term, and royalties are paid on "net", which is defined as the publisher's actual cash receipts less printing and other costs (this could result in very small royalties indeed)--but otherwise, it's a much better and more professional document than the previous one.

Still, there's nothing on the site to indicate how they distribute, and a spot check of the books on Amazon reveals no professional reviews. And while some of the covers don't look bad, others are pretty unprofessional-looking. There's also no information on the staff, so it's impossible to know whether they have any relevant experience. If Stone Garden is like many other Internet-based micropresses, the odds are they don't.

- Victoria

That’s about what I thought. Thanks ^_^ I've told the woman running the panel room that I don't really feel comfortable with them co-teaching my panel on publishing and self-publishing, because I didn't feel like they were a company I wanted to endorse or have my name attached to. Especially with some of the covers, since that is one of the big things I like to stress while talking about self-publishing - how to look professional even if you are doing it mostly by yourself.

~Cassie Richoux

What I would reccomend is go over to the forums that Stone Garden Publishing has and look up some authors that have been published by them and ask them how they feel the experience was.
What you are doing is getting third party opinions. That would be like asking me what it is like to work for Microsoft. I've never worked for Microsoft so I cannot give you an informed opinion.
Ask the people who have worked with Stone Garden Publishing. I did. That's why I signed with them. They are a small press company who is growing because they treat their authors really well.

Sincerely
B.L.Morgan
author of Blood And Rain, Blood For The Masses, Blood On Celluloid, The Dark Carnival and Night Knuckles. Reviewer for the now retired ezine SavageNight and the print magazine Sinesteria. Published author of over 30 short stories under various pseudonyms.

B.L.Morgan said:

That's why I signed with them. They are a small press company who is growing because they treat their authors really well.

Click to expand...

No, no, no! This is NOT why publshers grow, and this is NOT why someone should sign with a publisher. Publishing isn't a popularity contest where the nicest person wins. I take strong exception to statements like this because I see it all the time and would love nothing more than to stamp this thinking out of existence. Scam artists also treat their victims very well, so this should not be part of the equation.

I agree that talking to authors of any publisher is a great idea, but it shouldn't stop there. An author's criteria should be tough and realistic; can they get books distributed to physical stores and into the hands of buyers? What is their editing dept. like? Read a couple of that publisher's books and check for the quality of the production and the writing.

Please know that I'm not calling this publisher a scam because I know nothing about them. I'm merely pointing out that writers have to be fully educated BEFORE they sign with anyone. Someone's "niceness factor" is an added bonus, not a main criterion.

I am impressed by sales figures with at least 4 digits. Nasty is bad, but nice is the icing not the cake.

Make your own choices.

I am a professional and I choose carefully who I work with.
I am happy with Stone Garden Publishing. All of us choose what kind of behavior and what kind of people we allow in our lives. I choose to do business with professionals who make the experience a pleasant one. Life is too short to do otherwise.
And that is all I am going to say about this.

Sincerely
B.L.Morgan

Stonegarden sent me an acceptance email for my manuscript yesterday and I am seriously considering signing with them, but like anything I do, I always do my homework on any publisher I consider signing with. I did this with PublishAmerica, American Book Publishing and more recently with Capstone Fiction. My goal is to find a publisher who can best respresent my book and if after reviewing Stonegarden's contract I like what they have to offer, then it will be a done deal. All in all, I have read what came before my post and found it very informative. If anyone has something else to add, I welcome whatever you have to say. Thanks.

I researched publishers and agents for a year before I submitted my first manuscript. I went with Stonegarden.net Publishing in 2005 and have no regrets. My next book is due out in 2008 with the large gap being my own fault.

A Few Concerns You Might Want To Be Aware Of...

Hello, all. I was signed by this publisher before requesting and obtaining a release. I have no interest in dissuading anyone from signing with stonegarden.net; that’s the author’s prerogative. While I’d be the first to commend Kristofer J. Stamp’s politeness and dedication, there are a few details from my experience you might want to be aware of before you sign with stonegarden.net publishing. I wish you luck whatever your decision.

1. My work never received editing. To be fair to Mr. Stamp, I originally had the paperback signed with another such internet-based publisher and did send a file that had received content editing already. While I can’t say this is the case with everyone else’s work, I found it odd that in-house editing was never mentioned in my correspondence with this publisher.

2. When Adobe files of the press-ready manuscript were sent for my review, there were sizable errors—3 times. Some of these errors—i.e. paragraphs not even indented in the right places numerous times throughout a page—would have been caught had anyone at stonegarden.net proofed the work they did before sending it to me. I imagine it was a computer glitch, as Mr. Stamp indicated, but still. I will say that Mr. Stamp went over the manuscript three times, producing an independent reader; on the fourth occasion the work was correct, as far as I could tell. I did request a later publication date so that I could read every word over to make sure this fourth version was correct. This wasn’t granted.

3. This point was—well, odd to me. Mr. Stamp diligently included an award seal from a contest I won, offering congrats and all, but insisted on placing the seal on the back cover. I politely requested that it appear on the front cover; he indicated the front cover (mainly solid black in color) was too full for the award seal. I was surprised that he didn’t even consider budging on this.

4. I’m fairly certain from one email that Mr. Stamp holds a day job. I have nothing against this—I just think concerned posters might want to know that selling / placing books isn’t how he makes a living. From what I could tell, their authors typically work to place their own books if they want them in stores.

Given 1-4, I thought about whether or not the experience was worth it. I thought what the leading posters at Absolute Write might say—no presence in bookstores; no distribution channels I was made aware of; serious errors in my book that would go into print had I not discovered them; no reviews from trade publications; not a legit publishing credit in the eyes of industry professionals, etc. While I wish stonegarden.net publishing the best, if you’re shooting for any criteria listed in the sentences above you might want to keep looking elsewhere, as I am. Good luck to you.

Offered contract...stonegarden.net

Bit perplexed. Have a number of queries and submissions on a project out there now. Stonegarden.net does have a presence at Barnes and Noble and not all of their titles are listed in the million plus (low number) sellers. They just offered me a contract ten days after I queried them and sent my submission. Just getting a little inky about how fast that was and that in their contract they have the trade paperback rights listed right next to the caveat, if applicable. Should I pass and hope for the others to come through? Has anyone had experience with this publisher?

On the site, he admits that he does not have a presence in BM stores.

Are your books available in brick and mortar stores?
At this time our titles are only available online. We are working with our distribution partners to get them into the most popular brick and mortar outlets. You can always special order them through your favorite store using the ISBN number listed in our catalog.

Thank you for your answer. I have an inky feeling about them. Just queried this publisher one night when I was depressed. They didn't have a not recommended on P&E. I've been e-pubbed before and it's a tough road to walk. Think I will pass.

I've been epublished before and found it to be pretty easy and profitable--it is more about the quality of the press and having the right product for the market.

I'm currently reviewing a book from this publisher and I have to say, their editorial standards seem to be pretty close to nonexistent. I've never seen so many misused homophones and semicolons. It's a damn shame; the concept behind the book isn't half bad, and it really deserved better treatment from the publisher.

I'm sure they're very nice people but I would strongly suggest that anyone intending to work with them should first have your work reviewed by your most OCD Grammar Fiend buddy.

Eudaimon said:

I'm currently reviewing a book from this publisher and I have to say, their editorial standards seem to be pretty close to nonexistent. I've never seen so many misused homophones and semicolons. It's a damn shame; the concept behind the book isn't half bad, and it really deserved better treatment from the publisher.

I'm sure they're very nice people but I would strongly suggest that anyone intending to work with them should first have your work reviewed by your most OCD Grammar Fiend buddy.

Click to expand...

They published my short story (Creamy White Flesh) in their anthology, 'Don't Turn the Lights On'. Last year.

Yes, they did not catch a couple of my punctuation errors, and no, I don't expect a royalty. But the copies of the book make me happy, and when ever I look at it, I stop feeling like a failure so I stop 'giving up' and I keep writing.

Editors (besides Kristofer J. Stamp - owner/publisher):
http://www.tracyfabre.com/
http://www.robstarr.org/writers_portfolio.php
http://fictioneditor-rstarr.blogspot.com/2008_07_01_archive.html
http://www.shirleyannhoward.com/
https://www.stonegarden.net/forums/index.php?topic=280.0
http://www.facebook.com/people/Judy...p?id=100000275058976&hiq=judy,dahl&ref=search
https://www.stonegarden.net/forums/index.php?topic=1117.0
http://www.kevinhugheswrites.com/contant_my_editor_judy_dahl.html

Returns
All books are returnable within a thirty day period following the receipt of your merchandise. Shipping costs are non-refundable. Refunds will be made by money order or PayPal within ten business days following the receipt of your return by StoneGarden.net Publishing. Products must be in salable condition when returned. StoneGarden.net Publishing reserves the right to refuse a return if damage to the product is the fault of the customer.

Wholesale customers may contact the Support Staff for additional information on special return policies.
http://www.stonegarden.net/index.php?main_page=shippinginfo

Question:
Who distributes your books?
Answer:
We are distributed by Ingram, along with Baker and Taylor.
http://www.stonegardenbooks.com/html/site_faq.html

Cover Artist
http://peterjosephswanson.blogspot.com/
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/peter-swanson/9/495/92b

More links:
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/854769/dishing_out_advice_for_writers_a_publisher.html?cat=3
https://www.stonegarden.net/forums/index.php?topic=849.0
http://www.facebook.com/pages/StoneGardennet-Publishing/50251256776?v=wall&ref=ts
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Stone...=wall&ref=ts#/group.php?gid=2639741851&ref=ts

guys, the website is down for maintainance. guess it's just another micropress gone bust.

http://www.stonegarden.net/index.ph...enance&zenid=3fd00ae8d14ace0e8332134a93043c2c

It doesn't look like that to me. After reading this post:
https://www.stonegarden.net/forums/index.php?topic=1210.0
(which is dated only a few days ago), it looks like the publisher has taken the Thanksgiving holidays as a time to revamp the website and move the content onto the new one.