Children's Writers: You Don't Hire the Artist

stormie

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Toomanywords--

Keep in mind that many commercial children's picture book publishers would rather see the entire manuscript, in proper format, since it's usually under 1,000 words. Check out the 2007 Children's Writer's and Illustrator's book for all the info. on publishers. Do a search here on AW for proper formatting. (Briefly, it's double space between lines, 12 pt.font, either Times New Roman or Courier, name and address on top left corner, first page.)

Best of luck!
 

verbie

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I've recently sold a series of children's picture books that will debut mid summer. I will restate the thread title. You don't hire the artist. The illustrations didn't even come up in the conversation until we got past the contract stage and into the editing phase. Then I was able to make some suggestions.

One thing I will say is that when you are writing your picture book, be sure to have something picture worthy on each page. My editor says they often reject stories that read well, but don't lend themselves well to visual appeal.

I work with a twenty four page storyboard with 23 pages of test, and pay specific attention to how visually appealing each page might be. I know this should just be common sense, but as I said above, my editor says she's rejected many well told stories because it would be too much work to try and break it down onto a story board. Just thought I'd pass this along in case anyone is interested.
 

talkwrite

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Thank you all for this excellent and informative thread. I am a literary translator and am in the same position as an illustrator. We are expected to market ourselves -best skill and talent in hand- to publishers. Once you get the nod for one book you still have to keep up a big sales pitch for the next one and the next one and so on. Facing the traditionally tight market for considering translators here in the U.S., we fall into the pool of self published authors. They hire us and the illustrator to create their "complete" book. The difference is education - the publisher will more than likely understand our work as opposed to a self published author. The publisher bestows the bid acceptance and then leaves you alone to work. Whereas the self published author has the benefit of playing a role with linguistic consultation in this second creation of their work of art . But there is real joy in developing the translation while being in touch with a good author. I keep hoping to get the contract for just one "Harry Potter" novel, and I'll keep trying.
 

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I'm very glad I looked into this thread. The title caught my eye immediately.;) A friend of my brother made an offer about six months ago to do some illustrations for the book set I've been creating with my kids. It would only need a handful so I considered it. She wanted me to come up with a storyboard for the books and present it to her so she had an idea of what kind of illustrations to do. I never did because real life grabbed me by the throat and the book set was completely shelved. I got back to it about a month or so ago and was going to contact this friend to see if she was still interested. (I was still going on the assumption that you needed illustrations to present with the manuscript.) I'm glad I haven't called her yet after seeing this. I would have done all that work for nothing and probably wasted her time.
 
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JLCwrites

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Thanks for this post!

Kudos from me too! This takes a load off of my shoulders. I have a few PB story ideas sitting in my notebook, and I have been trying to come up with ways to illustrate them. Whew! Now I don't have to. I am currently in the midst of writing a YA, but when I am done with the FD I can concentrate on my PBs without worrying about my 'less than professional' drawing skills! (I like to dabble in PBs between YA drafts. Call them 'mini vacations from the motherbook.) ;)
 

rjschechter

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I have a somewhat related question. OK, I get it, a writer does not submit illustrations. But does the writer ever have (negotiate for) any right to approve the illustrations that are ultimately used? Once the writer submits the text, are all questions of layout, page breaks, formatting and illustrations entirely out of the writer's hands, so the writer simply sits back and nervously waits to see what has been done with his or her words? Or do writers ever get to exert some sort of creative control over the process after the text is submitted?
 

Jamesaritchie

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I have a somewhat related question. OK, I get it, a writer does not submit illustrations. But does the writer ever have (negotiate for) any right to approve the illustrations that are ultimately used? Once the writer submits the text, are all questions of layout, page breaks, formatting and illustrations entirely out of the writer's hands, so the writer simply sits back and nervously waits to see what has been done with his or her words? Or do writers ever get to exert some sort of creative control over the process after the text is submitted?

When you sell a bazillion copies of your book, and make the publisher a mint of money, you can then have veto power over pretty much everything. Before this time, forget it. You can ask, you can give your opinion, but it's ultimately out of your hands, as it should be. Nothing screws up a book faster than a writer trying to do someone else's job.
 

stormie

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My friend illustrates PBs for S&S, HarperCollins, etc. She reads the ms., discusses drawings with the editor(s), and sometimes through the editors, gets an idea of what the writer envisions. It's not entirely out of the writer's hands. Also, the publishers try to "match up" the right artist with the ms.
 

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Self -Pub or Not?

I read the whole thread here and my question is that yes it does make sense that you would be frowned on if you self-pub because yes everyone can do it, but is it truly a bad idea to wait til you get a hit 6 months from now if you've written a children's picture book that has had nods with rejections that say to take conolation in the fact that the book was being seriously considered? Seems like amazon.com, would be a place to get attention.
 

Toothpaste

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Depends on your goal and how big a readership you want. There is nothing wrong with self-publishing, so long as you aren't using it as a stepping stone to a professional career or expecting to sell a lot of books that way. If you have a niche market, or really want to get a book in print (say before an elderly grandparent passes on or something) then go for it. Otherwise what's the rush? Why the impatience?
 

igorr

Question, So how do I attempt to get my children's book published? I have searched some websites and some say to email it and other send it. They seem fishy.

I am a teacher. I taught for 4 years in PG county MD, and I have since moved back to my home state of PA, just outside of Pittsburgh. I wrote a shorter 40 some page picture, rhyming children's books within the past year, and BOY and I glad I found this thread. I, just tonight, was having a few people from another forum working on pictures for me.

But my main question is, how do I attempt to get it published?? Could you help me??? thanks

And I am new, so be gentle!

If you write picture books, you've probably thought at some point, "Boy, it would really impress the editor if I hired someone to illustrate this book. Then it'll look like a real book." But really, that's not true. The publisher wants to hire the artist.

They want to choose an artist whose style they like-- possibly someone they've worked with before, possibly someone who's won awards or has a great track record. They'll want to enter into a contract with the artist for the rights to the work, and give specific direction for page counts, style, colors, size, etc.

If you're a professional artist yourself and want to illustrate your own books, sure, submit it as a complete package-- but otherwise, don't hire someone or enlist your cousin or son (who's undoubtedly talented, but likely not what the publisher is looking for).

It will more than likely count as a strike *against* you to submit art with the writing. It brands you an amateur. Some publishers are more than happy to hear your suggestions once they're considering buying your book if you've come across an artist whose style you think fits the book. But before then, don't waste anyone's time or your money.
 

AndyPolyak

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and most of the time publishers are only expecting to see manuscripts from writers and art submissions from artists, and they match them up.

Really? Hmmmm..... I'm lucky, then, to have my own artist and to get the illustrations I want but not the ones which a publisher wants (who, probably, has hardly read my book yet)...
 

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Hi Jenna!

An artist friend of mine did illustrations for my manuscript back when I was considering self-publishing. He wouldn't let me pay him for them. He only asked that he be credited for the artwork should it ever be used. There are only 8 drawings...it's not a picture book, just a novel with a few drawings here and there.

Anyway, I've since decided not to go the self-publish route. I have not mentioned illustrations in my queries to agents because I had heard it might seem unprofessional, which you've substantiated for me here.

My question is this, should I just junk the drawings completely (or stick them on my website like they are now, just for fun)...or could I mention them to an agent after signing on? I'd hate for them to go to waste, but I would really not be insulted (neither would my friend) if they were rejected.

I had an agent until recently, but his name on the Writer's Beware list is what actually drew me to this website...I mentioned the drawings to him once, but he never responded. Big surprise! ;)

Hi, Nuoddo,

Total newbie to the boards, but I though I'd respond because I'm in a similar situation. I have just finished writing my first middle-grade adventure novel manuscript and I created a website to promote it. Because websites look really dull without graphics, I hired an artist friend of mine to do some illustrations for the site. I love his work, but I know that publishers/editors like to be able to choose the artists. My friend understands this as well, of course.

My question is, is it okay to send a card with the website address to potential editors (knowing that if they do visit the website they'll see the pre-commissioned art)? I just sent out my first query letter for the book yesterday and I included a business card with my contact info and my website. I don't want to insult anyone!

Thanks!

Dalton
www.tilliemcgwinn.com
 

stormie

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Hi Dalton,
Welcome to AW!
Here's the deal: Just send out your query. Don't worry about web sites or business cards at this stage. In fact, editors usually don't have the time to type in your link into their address bar and look at your web page. As for business cards, they could get lost in the slush.

Send the best query you can, and don't forget the SASE if you're sending snail mail. It's the query that will want them to ask to see more. Or not.

Best of luck and stick around here!
 

Dalton

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Hi Dalton,
Welcome to AW!
Here's the deal: Just send out your query. Don't worry about web sites or business cards at this stage. In fact, editors usually don't have the time to type in your link into their address bar and look at your web page. As for business cards, they could get lost in the slush.

Send the best query you can, and don't forget the SASE if you're sending snail mail. It's the query that will want them to ask to see more. Or not.

Best of luck and stick around here!

Thanks very much for the response, Stormie! I definitely did craft the very best query letter I could (plus the SASE, of course), but I also included a business card (with the web address), just in case the editor was at all interested. I assumed that the business card and the website would let the prospective editor know that I'm thinking of my writing as a business and that I've already given some thought to marketing. I didn't figure that including the card could hurt -- but I might very well be wrong!

Dalton
www.tilliemcgwinn.com
 

stormie

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I assumed that the business card and the website would let the prospective editor know that I'm thinking of my writing as a business and that I've already given some thought to marketing. I didn't figure that including the card could hurt -- but I might very well be wrong!
The business card won't hurt your chances of your writing being considered, it's just not necessary. What counts is your query and that you follow any guidelines they state. As for websites, as I said, it's not necessary at this point in time, and editors are many times too busy to type in your address.
 

hurricanehanni

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my books are done w/graphics, can I sell it???

Hi,
I am new to this site and love it. My wife and I have written a series of educational books that could go on forever. Very colorful and interactive for the children and parents. I used to be a publisher of a small magazine and my graphics person from that magazine is a partner with us on the book series. We have already written the first three books, including all graphics and covers. We have special characters that appear in each and every series. We also have started a web site to support the books with interactive activities and learnings exercises. We also have another book series that we will spin off of the first.

My question is that if the books and the characters are really marketable and "the next best thing," how do we sell it and/or market it. Based on what I've read, we are out of luck because we did the full package. Can anyone offer some advice?
Thanks,
Ryan
 

stormie

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Here's a thought: Why not query about the first book (don't mention the illustrations or that it's a series) and see where it gets you. If you get an educational publisher interested, and they like what they read, then maybe you could mention about the illustrations and possible series, etc.

The only other route I can see for you is self-publishing, but that costs money.
 

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Graphic Artist's

I recently read the same section in the Graphic Artist's Guild Handbook regarding work-for-hire situations. I was about to take on a book illustration job and the contract was presented that way. Ultimately I had to decide for myself if I was comfortable with the contract, taking into account all the advice I've been reading.
 

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I'm new here, and wanted info about self-publishing and illustrators. How does one contract with illustrators in that case?
 

Kerr

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Okay folks, then I would ask only one last question: What IF you've written a story that you think is a descent little story and would like your daughter to illustrate it? Would it then be reasonable to wait for, say, one drawing to be complete then ask a publisher if they'd like to see the story and that one drawing as an example? In my case, I've done a bit of researching and located a pub within my state who is also a children's story writer with a family hired illustrator for her own books. I know this is NOT the way to go about this process. Still....
 
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Here I was always panicking because I couldn't drum up an illustrator. Now that I have got one, I'm wondering what to do. She's developed my main character for me and I've fallen in love with the image of him as being my character. Yikes. Well, I've learned something, haven't I?
 

marcus.riedner

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I've just started working with an electronic children's book publisher, and I have had to learn a great deal about the traditional paper based publishing industry. I've trawled through the forums here once or twice on information gathering hunts. It never ceases to amaze me how... strange and counter intuitive things in publishing can be. Thanks for the awesome thread here, very interesting!
 

schreiben

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The publisher wants to hire the artist...
They want to choose an artist whose style they like-- possibly someone they've worked with before, possibly someone who's won awards or has a great track record. They'll want to enter into a contract with the artist for the rights to the work, and give specific direction for page counts, style, colors, size, etc.

Thanks for this information. I'm a neophite. An aspiring writer. I keep on thinking about possible illustrations that would go with my story when in fact, it's not really necessary.

Again, thanks a lot for this post.