Info-dumps (Retrieved)

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Puma

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06-13-2006, 08:43 PM Puma vbmenu_register("postmenu_644961", true);
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Info Dumps
Either in this forum or another of the sci-fi forums I've seen questions regarding the amount of info dumping that's acceptable. I was not familiar with this term. I am through the first draft of a sci-fi novel that may be a "bodacious" info dump; but I'm not sure.

When you're writing a story based on real science that most people only have cursory knowledge about, how do you convey the needed science to make the story clear without doing a lot of info dumping? For example, I really like most of Michael Crichton's books because they contain enough real information to make the story believable. I would never have thought of his books as info dumps.

So - anyone - can you give me some more information about this. How much is too much? Do you assume that the general populace remembers what they learned in high school science classes and only info dump what's beyond the high school level? Help! Puma
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06-13-2006, 09:59 PM chaostitan vbmenu_register("postmenu_645122", true);
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This is just what I have gleaned from past discussions on the subject.

To be an info dump, information has to be conveyed in certain way. The best example I can give is from a young adult series called Sweet Valley High, because it always sticks in my mind. In the first chapter of each book, the author explains who the twins are, how they are different, where they live, and who their friends are. Every. Single. Book.

That is an info dump.

Whenever you add exposition for the express purpose of educating your reader, rather than moving the story forward, you are making an info dump.
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06-13-2006, 10:54 PM Sosiki vbmenu_register("postmenu_645229", true);
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Well, most authors have to give some background information in order to have their readers understand certain aspects of their books. Since every reader has a preferance for how much information is too much, there really is no limit to it. The only line to draw is when you write to the point where you have trouble heading back to the plot after you explain what is needed for the reader to know.
I would say, personally, that having info dumps at some times are necessary. But when the reader looses sight of what the main story is and focuses more on putting the information together to reveal why something works a certain way (like why solar flares occur), then the story becomes digressive.
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06-14-2006, 01:39 PM dblteam vbmenu_register("postmenu_646400", true);
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Another thing to consider is the type of story you're telling. Different audiences have different tolerances for cool science/technology info-dumps. If it's a techno-thriller or hard SF, the core audience for those books generally expect and *want* to have much of the science explained. I think the hard SF stories tend to have the "physics geek" version, and the techno-thrillers the "Popular Science" version, but both are info-dumps.

One thing I think is difficult for authors to determine is how much explanation is *necessary* to the story. As cool and interesting as the author finds all of his research and ideas to be, if they aren't integral to the story, the reader isn't going to care.

As a general rule of first drafts, I'd say write as much as you think belongs. It will probably be too much, but that's what beta readers are for. You just have to be willing to kill your darlings if your readers agree that section is unnecessary.

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06-14-2006, 02:09 PM RedMolly vbmenu_register("postmenu_646448", true);
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I read much more fantasy than SF, but I've always thought both C.J. Cherryh and Lois McMaster Bujold do a great job of explaining as much of the science as you need to know without resorting to info dumps. (And Bujold's Vorkosigan series explains who the characters are and fills in backstory admirably without Sweet Valley High-style exposition... I remember those books unfondly...)
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06-14-2006, 07:23 PM Puma vbmenu_register("postmenu_646988", true);
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Okay, so what I've got in my opinion is a techno thriller. I use the characters to convey the information that the reader needs to know to understand the science; but I also break up the sequences with mundane material (like getting a can of pop in the middle of a technical discussion). So far I've only had one beta reader (not a science person) who read it and immediately re-read it - and then said that nothing needed to be changed. I've also got a scientist reading it for accuracy. So if I put the two opinions together does it sound like I may be all right and not info dumping? Puma
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06-16-2006, 12:43 AM Rebe Angel vbmenu_register("postmenu_649867", true);
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When i'm worried i might be doing an info dump I try to have oneof the charecters be explaining it to another and I have the other chareter react and the two charecters be doing stuf related to whats going on. Actions, even non important ones, keep the reader thinking "okay tha makes this story make more sense" and not "oh god another lecture"

for exampe In my book most recently my main charecter is heading to the main headquarters of a huge orginization and their traveling compain over the course of a few day explains a huge nuber of things while there traveling or setting up camp or watering there horses. The explanations he gives to her normally result from an action they do. (she comments on how she can see magic when she spots a normal camping spot for traveling mages judging by the traces of magic he comments how its an abnormal skill and there off.}
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06-16-2006, 02:14 AM Pthom vbmenu_register("postmenu_649893", true);
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When your story involves one character, either major or minor, who doesn't know "all about the world" he lives in (or is thrust into), he can ask another character (or be told) about things that would otherwise wind up in an info dump.

But what if the only one not in the know is the reader? In a future world, say, where things are vastly different from the reader's experience, yet familiar to the characters in the story, it makes no sense to have one character tell another something they both know well. So in the descriptions of things, in the manner of speech in dialogue, in the actions the characters take, the author must somehow incorporate these things in a subtle way so the reader can be made to understand the world without having his enjoyment of the story interrupted. To my mind, nothing is worse than an encyclopedia-like passage describing how the space ship engines work when it's really only necessary to know that the space ship can go places the characters need it to.
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06-16-2006, 02:04 PM Roger J Carlson vbmenu_register("postmenu_650838", true);
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puma
Okay, so what I've got in my opinion is a techno thriller. I use the characters to convey the information that the reader needs to know to understand the science; ...

I guess one question you have to ask yourself is if the reader really needs to understand the science. Can they understand the story just as well without it? That, I think, is the touchstone. If the reader doesn't need it, then you're doing it for you, not them.

I'm not saying you never have to explain the science. For instance, you might want to explain something about balistics to explain why your orbiting space ship can't just turn around and boost in the opposite direction. But there has to be a reason in the story to do it, and not just because you think the reader ought to know it.

In my latest WIP, the editor suggested that I had too much exposition. I went though it and I discovered that most of it could be disposed of. It made the story much better. That's not to say that it was useless. It was important for ME to understand the science. I just didn't need to explain it all to the reader.
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06-16-2006, 07:36 PM Puma vbmenu_register("postmenu_651453", true);
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Excellent response, Roger. I think in my case, without the science, the readers would only get the thrill but not understand why it happened. My science is geology which in my opinion is lesser known than the others. (No - no Jurassic Park look alike). If anyone can correct my impression, I'm all ears. Puma
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