Harvey Weinstein resigns in sexual harrassment scandal

PorterStarrByrd said:

still shouldn't get the coverage it gets. Let the courts hang him and the report it. There is nothing new in this news and it gives an aberrant idiot publicity. Does he seem contrite? Is the publicity doing anything that hits him hard? I recognize the problem as do most people. but the coverage does nothing to solve the problem we all know about and despise. Does this have any effect on your problem with your private Harvey Weinstein?

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Actually, yes.

You're talking about this like it's something everyone knows about, and they don't. People don't believe us, and even if they do, not enough is done to stop it. When this kind of thing is reported, it does make people more aware of the problem.

Celia Cyanide said:

Actually, yes.

You're talking about this like it's something everyone knows about, and they don't. People don't believe us, and even if they do, not enough is done to stop it. When this kind of thing is reported, it does make people more aware of the problem.

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Well, tbf, women know about it. There's always been the whisper network, but you have to be able to tap into that. And you have to be in a position to do something about it. Not everyone can protect themselves.

I think a lot of women do take the "get over it; it happens to everybody" attitude because they've been convinced that it'll never stop and there's no point in even trying. I don't think it will stop. But I do think individual perpetrators can be stopped, and we can make it harder for the next one who starts.

But yes, this is accomplished by being loud and public about it. For every woman who speaks, there are untold others without the power or the resources or the strength.

Myrealana said:

In my experience, every woman--young, old, tall, short, fat, thin, hot, not--EVERY woman has had a Harvey Weinstein, probably more than one, in their lives that they didn't feel they could speak up about.

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Weird, but - I never experienced this - someone on in my job who could make things difficult for me and who was sexually unpleasant with me. I did have to deal with an office hoochie once, but... he was actually pretty hot, so I didn't mind flirting with him and he was really good about keeping it within some kind of line beyond which would have been too much...

This doesn't mean that I'm downplaying my sisters' reports of this. Just wanted to speak up that my experience is different.

Weinstein is now on a self-imposed leave of absence, so at least some young women will now not be subject to his bullshit. A win for them, and that alone makes this story worth it. Also, three members of his ALL MALE board of directors have resigned. Funny that. Makes you wonder how he got away with it all these years, doesn't it. *thinky-face emoji*

I guess there are no board-worthy women in Hollywood, either.

Celia Cyanide said:

You're talking about this like it's something everyone knows about, and they don't. People don't believe us, and even if they do, not enough is done to stop it. When this kind of thing is reported, it does make people more aware of the problem.

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It IS a problem and the problem is men. Most guys I know don't get the "Yeah, baby! Shake dat ass!" or "Whip it out!" or "Come here and sit on my face" treatment from women taking inventory as they walk down the street. It's not cute. It's not funny. It's creepy.

Case in point. Over the course of a month a young woman took selfies of herself with the men catcalling her.

Catcalling is neither cute nor a compliment. This seems a strange conceptual hurdle for many men to leap. Those who actually listen to the women being affected by catcalling—who tell them that rather than a positive it is threatening and a form of harassment—might sometimes come around. There are those who won’t, of course. A patriarchal society instils a sort of ingrained entitlement in the ruling group, and men will often get defensive and even aggressive when told to cut that shit out. It’s similar to racists in a white supremacist culture being told that certain words are no longer acceptable. They flare their nostrils and protest, quaking with a subconscious fear that the power balance may be shifting, that total domination in their favour might be coming to an end.

Noa Jansma is a twenty-year-old student from Amsterdam. During the course of this August she ran an Instragram account called ‘dearcatcallers’. She used it to post one selfie a day with a man who had catcalled her.

Explaining the project, Noa said:This Instagram has the aim to create awareness about the objectification of women in daily life.

Since many people still don’t know how often and in whatever context ‘catcalling’ happens, I’ll be showing my catcallers within the period of one month.

[…] both the objectification and the object are assembled in one composition. Myself, as the object, standing in front of the catcallers represents the reversed power ratio which is caused by this project.
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The little evils we shrug off as no big deal help the big monsters like Harvey Weinstein grow and feed. It's not cute. It's not funny. It's creepy and men need to stop doing it. Like now. Like yesterday.

PorterStarrByrd said:

still shouldn't get the coverage it gets. Let the courts hang him and the report it. There is nothing new in this news and it gives an aberrant idiot publicity. Does he seem contrite? Is the publicity doing anything that hits him hard? I recognize the problem as do most people. but the coverage does nothing to solve the problem we all know about and despise. Does this have any effect on your problem with your private Harvey Weinstein?

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The "coverage" makes sure that men know what other men are doing. The coverage makes it clear that we don't condone or except people treating people this way. The coverage helps let others know that they will be called on their behavior. The coverage means that that victims know that they aren't alone.

PorterStarrByrd said:

still shouldn't get the coverage it gets. Let the courts hang him and the report it.

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Sadly, the courts most often don't hang these guys. They didn't hang Bill Cosby, or Jion Ghomeshi, or Michael Jackson.

Even when these guys are convicted of something (look at Roman Polanski) their careers continue to hum along. Maybe the fact that there's something of a cloud over them because of all the negative PR, has some effect, though.

And as others have said, the publicity can be very beneficial for women who have experienced the same thing. At the very least, it lets them know they're not crazy and they're not alone.

Maybe someday the outrage will build to a point where something gets done about these sexual predators, where the law gets more teeth, or juries are more willing to believe the victims . If it does, though, I can guarantee many people will bemoan it as "political correctness.

PorterStarrByrd said:

Let the courts hang him and the report it.

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You mean like the court "hanged" the Berkeley rapist? If a woman didn't report on the victim's statement, no one would have heard about it. He would have remained on the school swim team and done it again, and again, and again, just like he's probably assaulted girls and women before he tried to rape a stranger under a garbage dumpster.

Or how the court hanged this Michigan rapist? By giving him joint custody of the child, 9 years after he impregnated the 12 year-old girl he raped?

Have you heard about Weinstein's predilections before now? No, but he's paid off numerous women large sums of money. Presumably there HAVE been court cases, but good lawyers can buy a lot of silence. Women have to do the heavy lifting, speak out, and protect our own. We don't have nearly enough allies in men, and we aren't going to shut up about it.

Myrealana said:

In my experience, every woman--young, old, tall, short, fat, thin, hot, not--EVERY woman has had a Harvey Weinstein, probably more than one, in their lives that they didn't feel they could speak up about.

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I've never had a boss or man in a position of authority over me who sexually harassed me or anything like that, though I've had some who were sexist in other ways (one had his office practically wallpapered with various comics with the same punch line--what shrews/bitches/idiots/hypocrites women were and how put upon men were to put up with them--cartoons in this vein).

I've had a couple of situations where a guy wouldn't leave me alone or take no for a while with regards to wanting to go out with him (one was into what is now called "negging"), and I have run into some who were way too handsy at parties and in social situations. There was a guy in my college fencing club (and he was older than most of the rest of us) who would come up and give unasked for massages while commenting on how tense your muscles were (well of course they're tense, you idiot, some guy I barely know is touching me without asking).

I've been luckier than a lot of women in that department, I think. Most of my close friends have stories. One friend was sexually harassed and groped by a mutual friend who also happened to be a police officer. My cousin had a guy who worked as a night manager in her apartment building letting himself into her apartment during the day when she was at work so he could leave (very much unwanted) flowers and creepy little notes.

I'm not sure why I've been relatively lucky myself, but I doubt it's because I radiate self confidence or dress conservatively or anything like that.

As a Black man, I'm eternally uncomfortable whenever a White person attempts to tell me with great certainty, "This isn't about race. This isn't that important. Why not be concerned about something that really matters?"

I'm not a woman, but I'd feel equally uncomfortable telling my wife or daughter, "This isn't about sexism. This isn't about a piggish man deploying his power and influence to bend women to do his lascivious bidding. Chill out and I'll tell you when its REALLY important."

Could be I don't believe I need someone telling me what I should get hyped about. I'm unreasonable that way. I would hope any woman who is told the Harvey Weinstein story is a non-story would respond the same way.

What the actual fuck, Donna Karan?

'I think we have to look at ourselves. Obviously, the treatment of women all over the world is something that has always had to be identified. Certainly in the country of Haiti where I work, in Africa, in the developing world, it's been a hard time for women.

'To see it here in our own country is very difficult, but I also think how do we display ourselves? How do we present ourselves as women? What are we asking? Are we asking for it by presenting all the sensuality and all the sexuality?

'And what are we throwing out to our children today about how to dance and how to perform and what to wear? How much should they show?' ...

'You look at everything all over the world today and how women are dressing and what they are asking by just presenting themselves the way they do. What are they asking for? Trouble,' she said.

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cornflake said:

What the actual fuck, Donna Karan?

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What, she's coming out with a line of DK burkas next year? Because well all know that the fashion industry is a hotbed of modesty and discretion.

The New Yorker's expose' of Harvey Weinstein includes his rape of Asia Argento, retaliation against Rosanna Arquette and Mira Sorvino, an NYPD investigation in 2015, and complicity throughout his company:

Sixteen former and current executives and assistants at Weinstein’s companies told me that they witnessed or had knowledge of unwanted sexual advances and touching at events associated with Weinstein’s films and in the workplace. They and others describe a pattern of professional meetings that were little more than thin pretexts for sexual advances on young actresses and models. All sixteen said that the behavior was widely known within both Miramax and the Weinstein Company.

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It's a long but worthwhile read, and some excellent journalism from Ronan Farrow.

If you're truly not interested in a thread, you just leave it. If you post saying that no one cares or we shouldn't be focused on it, what you're actually doing is trying to silence people. And when you do that with a subject like this, you're taking the side of the abusers.

If the topic makes you uncomfortable, good. You should make you squirm and wish to banish it from your brain. That's all signs that your basic decency is still intact. But don't you dare give in to your own selfish desire to not have to acknowledge someone else's suffering by demanding they not speak of it.

CWatts said:

The New Yorker's expose' of Harvey Weinstein includes his rape of Asia Argento, retaliation against Rosanna Arquette and Mira Sorvino, an NYPD investigation in 2015, and complicity throughout his company:



It's a long but worthwhile read, and some excellent journalism from Ronan Farrow.

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It's a helluva read.

Meanwhile, George Clooney has added a male voice to go along with Meryl Streep, Glenn Close and Judi Densch in denouncing Harvey Weinstein's predatory ways. Gwenyth Paltrow and Angelina Jolie say they too are part of the Harassed by Harvey Club.

However, Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are getting scorched for their odd silence about Weinstein, a major contributor to the Democrats. Clinton has finally broken her five-day silence while Obama has yet to issue a statement.

That Donald Trump has been relatively silent about Democrats scrambling to get away from Weinstein is telling and it must be killing him, but is even Trump dumb enough to open that can of worms?

The story within the story is Harvey Weinstein is not an outlier. There are a lot of other powerful predators in Tinsel Town stalking women, men and children as their prey and there always have been.

Donna Karan backpedals, comments her comments were commented out of context.

Meanwhile, Weinstein's wife Georgina Chapman is filing for divorce.

Myrealana said:

There was a trending thread on Twitter yesterday to the effect of "To all women, who was your Harvey Weinstein?"

In my experience, every woman--young, old, tall, short, fat, thin, hot, not--EVERY woman has had a Harvey Weinstein, probably more than one, in their lives that they didn't feel they could speak up about.

Mine was the training manager at the tech support company I worked at just out of college. He was over 50, called me "sweetie" and would walk up behind me and massage my shoulders. I would ask him to please not touch me, then I'd shrug away, give him a look. I told HR, they said it didn't qualify as "sexual harassment" unless there was explicit quid-pro-quo demanded. I finally told him, in front of witnesses "Any part of you that touches me, you're not getting back." He moved on to harass another woman in the department. I helped her get rid of him, and he moved on again. I worked there three years, and in that time, the women just learned to protect each other from him. No one in power ever even tried to stop him.

What about the rest of you? Any "Non news" about your own Harvey Weinstein?

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I think you're right. My first non-news was during a high school internship at a small, locally owned photography store. Not the owner. He was a gruff but sweet old man. It was the guy in his late 20's/early 30's (hard to know because it was just about twenty years ago) who worked there. Every day for 90 minutes, I worked beside this guy. It's funny...I can't now recall what he said exactly. But I know he said things. I remember vaguely what he looked like and how scared but excited his words made me feel - I was 16/17 and had never had that kind of attention before. Boys didn't like me. But this man did. Scary but exciting. And definitely confusing.

I have had quite a few since then, right up until about 6 months ago when the most-recent non-news took a new job.

nighttimer said:

It's a helluva read.

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It is, indeed. A nauseating one

nighttimer said:

However, Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are getting scorched for their odd silence about Weinstein, a major contributor to the Democrats. Clinton has finally broken her five-day silence while Obama has yet to issue a statement.

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Both have now, but..."Odd"? A metric shitton of people have had contact with Weinstein. Why aren't we hearing, "Odd that Tom Brokaw hasn't said anything." Or more pertinent, since he's taken Weinstein's money and dismissed the sexual assault case against him, "Odd Cy Vance hasn't said anything." Bah!

nighttimer said:

That Donald Trump has been relatively silent about Democrats scrambling to get away from Weinstein is telling and it must be killing him, but is even Trump dumb enough to open that can of worms?

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Yeah, he is. He just made Kellyanne do it for him.

nighttimer said:

The story within the story is Harvey Weinstein is not an outlier. There are a lot of other powerful predators in Tinsel Town stalking women, men and children as their prey and there always have been.

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Tinseltown and every other industry in this country. Tech, finance, retail, publishing, sports...shall I go on?

ElaineA said:

Tinseltown and every other industry in this country. Tech, finance, retail, publishing, sports...shall I go on?

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Exactly. Anita Hill has an excellent guest column in Variety about Weinstein: http://variety.com/2017/biz/news/an...ent-harvey-weinstein-guest-column-1202585236/

One of the paradoxes is that very liberal industries like entertainment, like tech, are still producing or reproducing the same types of behavior that have been going on in more traditional settings all along.

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It does seem that a common denominator in media, technology and sports is that they run on "stars" and cults of personality - this idea that if you have enough talent, you can get away with being a utter crapsack human being*. Even aside from the harassment, Weinstein was known throughout the industry for being a dick in an industry chockfull of them.

*Resemblance to certain hot-mike comments is entirely intentional.

Maybe this will help shine the light that Corey Feldman and others have been trying to shine for years now.

cmhbob said:

Maybe this will help shine the light that Corey Feldman and others have been trying to shine for years now.

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Tried to read the article, but a few paragraphs in, something popped up in my face, blocking it unless I subscribed to something

Roxxsmom said:

Tried to read the article, but a few paragraphs in, something popped up in my face, blocking it unless I subscribed to something

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It's suggesting, without anything to back it that I can see really, that Weinstein may have preyed on kids -- despite that everyone's who's come forward has been an adult woman. It also misuses pedophile, so...

Roxxsmom said:

Tried to read the article, but a few paragraphs in, something popped up in my face, blocking it unless I subscribed to something

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Once I saw that it was on Cernovich's site, I wouldn't click. He previously called date rape a "liberal fiction" and promoted the claim that Hillary Clinton ran a pedophile ring out of a pizzeria. There are some sites I won't give a click.

cmhbob said:

Maybe this will help shine the light that Corey Feldman and others have been trying to shine for years now.

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You mean the Corey Feldman who finds young actress and tells him that he's going to help them with their career and has them sign a contract where they have to live in his house and wear bras and g-strings all the time, and tells them what they can and cannot eat?

That Corey Feldman?

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/wd7pxq/corey-feldman-will-no-longer-be-throwing-parties-245