The Cantina Staring Back At You From The Abyss

Oh lordy, I looked at the website. I was wrong. This isn't POD. It's someone printing out of their home and binding it in one of the plastic spiral thingies.

Nope, nope, nope right out there.

Shadowflame said:

Oh lordy, I looked at the website. I was wrong. This isn't POD. It's someone printing out of their home and binding it in one of the plastic spiral thingies.

Nope, nope, nope right out there.

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Yeah. That's... no.

ION. Finished another chapter in the WIP today. Finally. Been stuck for most of the week with stupid amounts of anxiety. But today I got more words chipped out.

Spaghetti squash is doing its first bake in the oven right now. In a bit I'll scrape it out into a skillet and simmer with some chicken broth, seasoning and meatballs. #nomnom

Happy Saturday, folks.

Aggy, stabby

Shadowflame said:

Oh lordy, I looked at the website. I was wrong. This isn't POD. It's someone printing out of their home and binding it in one of the plastic spiral thingies.

Nope, nope, nope right out there.

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Yikes.

I dunno what it is about these places that encourages them to host writing workshops, but it's a trend I've seen before. The cynical side of me says it's a way to make money. There wasn't a fee or due, was there?

Even if it's above board and being done as a community gesture, the level of knowledge you're likely to encounter is unlikely to be helpful to you.

Good call.

VeryBigBeard said:

Yikes.

I dunno what it is about these places that encourages them to host writing workshops, but it's a trend I've seen before. The cynical side of me says it's a way to make money. There wasn't a fee or due, was there?

Even if it's above board and being done as a community gesture, the level of knowledge you're likely to encounter is unlikely to be helpful to you.

Good call.

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IMO it's being done as a community gesture with some side benefits for the publisher (can we say loyal minions?)
And yeah, there's not going to be a benefit for me in this.

Y'all!!! I AM (officially) using The (Submission) Grinder!! ToT

Yay, Dammy!

Feels *good* to send off something on sub, doesn't it? Even if you know the result is likely to be a rejection letter, there's still that teeny possibility otherwise. In my case it was to a pro magazine that is seldom open, where I've struck out before. I tried once day before yesterday, and their submission service was whacked. So that gave me the chance to do one more run through the story. Of course I revised some stuff...ended up much happier with the story I sent in. If they don't like it, it will be a good self-pub trial.

*flops*

Yesterday a plot bunny mostly unrelated to my current WIP got lodged in my head and stuck there hard, displacing all the other plot bunnies hopping around in there. What's more it was a fanfic plot bunny (Doctor Who). I haven't written fanfic since I was a kid nor watched much Doctor Who since the Twelfth Doctor came in.

Most of this afternoon and night has been spent exorcising it in the form of a synopsis that resembles a script treatment for an episode. 3.4k words in a day is way over my normal 1.5-2k "good days". Maybe someday if I get an agent it could be shopped around as a licenced comic script or short or maybe it will just stay trunked until it morphs into something that fits into a fully original story as past fannish impulses have.

*pops her head up*

*waves*

Guess who's just got used to working 30 hours a week and studying full time. It only took three months of running around like a chook with it's head chopped off. I almost have a routine now.

How is everyone?

themindstream said:

*flops*

Yesterday a plot bunny mostly unrelated to my current WIP got lodged in my head and stuck there hard, displacing all the other plot bunnies hopping around in there. What's more it was a fanfic plot bunny (Doctor Who). I haven't written fanfic since I was a kid nor watched much Doctor Who since the Twelfth Doctor came in.

Most of this afternoon and night has been spent exorcising it in the form of a synopsis that resembles a script treatment for an episode. 3.4k words in a day is way over my normal 1.5-2k "good days". Maybe someday if I get an agent it could be shopped around as a licenced comic script or short or maybe it will just stay trunked until it morphs into something that fits into a fully original story as past fannish impulses have.

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I also think sometimes we right just because it's enjoyable to write? That being said, that's the mentality I always start out with, but I fall in love with my characters and then I'm all "EVERYONE ELSE MUST SEE THEM AND LOVE THEM." Which leads to publishing attempts.

Mary Love said:

So, I just finished reading my boheemouth draft from last years nano for the first time (read it fast--350pgs in 24 hours--now my eyeballs are spinning) and, while I took notes through the whole thing for revision, there weren't any unexpected revelations or insights. I kept feeling like there should be... Isn't that how it's supposed to work after you take a break from a draft? But I still have the same problems I knew I had writing it--the ending drags, the magic is confusing, and the MC is distant. I guess I was expecting time to offer new insights to help with the revisions, but there were none and I'm still unsure how to fix my problems.

That's what I get for going at my list of chores out of order. I'm supposed to be working on revisions for this other draft I just finished, but at the first threat of a plot hole I opened a different doc and started reading. Bad, bad.



Gotta go make some myself and get back to patching plot holes and revising what I'm supposed to be working on.

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Have you ever heard of the Mace quotenient? There's a youtube vid of Mary Robinette Kowal going through it and I've found it very useful for seeing character motivations and the promises I've made as an author.

Jade A said:

I totally agree that there are areas kids media explores that adult media doesn't. A Series of Unfortunate Events is my fav example of that. the whole thing centers around how adults are quick to ignore when a child feels unsafe. it's a huge and important concept that could never be captured if it were told from an adult perspective.

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I remember someone once said that most children's fic is about finding a home. It's very true, and not a way I'd ever thought of kidlit before. What you just said was a very similar thing - extremely true, and opens up another way to think of kidlit.

JJ Litke said:

But only if you're okay with the main character being a rapist.

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This is why they need trigger/content warnings in books. Or some sort of tagging system.

_Sian_ said:

Have you ever heard of the Mace quotenient? There's a youtube vid of Mary Robinette Kowal going through it and I've found it very useful for seeing character motivations and the promises I've made as an author.

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Watched it. My mind was slowly blown. I feel like Mario, just leveled up with another addition to my writers tool box--thank you!!!

_Sian_ said:

*pops her head up*

*waves*

Guess who's just got used to working 30 hours a week and studying full time. It only took three months of running around like a chook with it's head chopped off. I almost have a routine now.

How is everyone?

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SIAN! *tacklehug*

Morning, Cantina. Mom's doing a lot better this morning. Still not 100% but she decided she's well enough she wants to fix breakfast even if she's not up to eating it yet. I will mainly be crafting and writing today since we're not going anywhere as far as I know. Now if I can just get more awake...

Jade A said:

I totally agree that there are areas kids media explores that adult media doesn't. A Series of Unfortunate Events is my fav example of that. the whole thing centers around how adults are quick to ignore when a child feels unsafe. it's a huge and important concept that could never be captured if it were told from an adult perspective.

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That is very true. Adults have this unfortunate habit of forgetting that children actually have feelings and that they experience the world in a way that's much rawer than the adult version. Or remembering that everything felt big and important then, and thus dismissing all emotions because, from an adult perspective, they might be pretty humdrum ("You're not furious, you're annoyed. You're not starving, you're peckish."). And also the unfortunate habit of ignoring any media that even looks like it's aimed at children and thus not remembering or seeing the world that children see (or that it's entirely inappropriate for children, e.g. Watership Down), all the while hiding behind media that's all sax and violins.
I have an irrational and deep-seated disrespect for anything that markets itself as very adult, very mature. And a probably undeserved respect for children's media.

Middle looks weird next to eldest and youngest. Thinking of alternatives, but only first, second and third comes to mind.

_Sian_ said:

Have you ever heard of the Mace quotenient? There's a youtube vid of Mary Robinette Kowal going through it and I've found it very useful for seeing character motivations and the promises I've made as an author.

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I just watched that video this morning. It's really good. I especially love how she broke down opening and closing each MACE element as nested code.

JJ Litke said:

I just watched that video this morning. It's really good. I especially love how she broke down opening and closing each MACE element as nested code.

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Yes, now to identify my elements and determine the order in which they close. I think it's spreadsheet time.

I have seen MICE/MACE before, but never with MRK. Have to check this one out.

Damoclian said:

Y'all!!! I AM (officially) using The (Submission) Grinder!! ToT

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woo!!

_Sian_ said:

I remember someone once said that most children's fic is about finding a home. It's very true, and not a way I'd ever thought of kidlit before. What you just said was a very similar thing - extremely true, and opens up another way to think of kidlit.

This is why they need trigger/content warnings in books. Or some sort of tagging system.

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*nods* there's this baseline assumption that the older the market, the better the content. I tend to just read and watch whatever appeals, but I will admit to holding a certain amount of hesitation around reading YA stuff. I'm trying to get past it, though. there are so many good YA stories out there. and kidlit!

Religion0 said:

That is very true. Adults have this unfortunate habit of forgetting that children actually have feelings and that they experience the world in a way that's much rawer than the adult version. Or remembering that everything felt big and important then, and thus dismissing all emotions because, from an adult perspective, they might be pretty humdrum ("You're not furious, you're annoyed. You're not starving, you're peckish."). And also the unfortunate habit of ignoring any media that even looks like it's aimed at children and thus not remembering or seeing the world that children see (or that it's entirely inappropriate for children, e.g. Watership Down), all the while hiding behind media that's all sax and violins.
I have an irrational and deep-seated disrespect for anything that markets itself as very adult, very mature. And a probably undeserved respect for children's media.

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kids definitely experience things on a more raw level. as you grow, you bury it. because of that, a lot of people view kids as irrational. really, they're just more honest. so a lot of kids media is more honest, as well

Religion0 said:

That is very cool. Also sometimes hilarious, as in the Stanley Parable. Kind of makes you question reality, though.

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Oh man, that game xD I love the "Following the Yellow Line Adventure Song" or whatever it's called. Or irritating the narrator with your broom closet obsession. Basically everything in that game is amusing.

_Sian_ said:

This is why they need trigger/content warnings in books. Or some sort of tagging system.

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I really agree. I always try to add TWs to my pieces, and know quite a few writers who do the same. whenever someone argues that it's a 'spoiler' I have to wonder what they think the synopsis on the back of their book is. or Viewer Discretion is Advised warnings that TV channels play.

really, how could TW: ASSAULT count as a spoiler, anyway. it doesn't say who's being assaulted, who's doing it, what the context is... it's just letting people who could be harmed by the content know to either avoid it or wait until they're in a good headspace.

[forgot to respond to this part last night, but I wanted to]

Kitkitdizzi said:

I do love the looks I get when it's Wednesday and I'm asked what I had for dinner the night before and tell them I had 'Taco Tuesday on Tuesday'

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I always shrug and say the kids love it when we do tacos on Tuesdays. Truth is I like it too.

Shadowflame said:

Is it worth it? I just don't know.
I'd really like to find a writing group that does critiques but it's not likely around here. (The ones I have gone to are "Everyone gets a gold star!" type groups and I need something more advanced.

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Glad you noped out of there for other reasons, but I suspect is where I have the same struggled. I haven't had people brutalize my work yet, but the scope of what I am looking for in a writing group and what a group like that will give are not the same thing and I've found it very hard to find what I am looking for.

VeryBigBeard said:

I think the bigger issue is just that this group doesn't seem like a match in terms of experience. I know from my experience how frustrating that can be for everyone involved. Just because it's a writing group doesn't mean it's going to be a good one. If you're going to constantly look over your shoulder because your crits are tough-but-fair, then I guess figure out if that's a level of hassle you want to deal with, and make the decision accordingly (maybe make the decision once the cold ebbs away ).

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And This!

_Sian_ said:

*pops her head up*

*waves*

Guess who's just got used to working 30 hours a week and studying full time. It only took three months of running around like a chook with it's head chopped off. I almost have a routine now.

How is everyone?

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Hey Stranger! I had all these mental designs on working out things for my story, but that didn't happen. Then my hip started doing its auto-immune madness and I'm feeling all kinds of not being functional today because I don't want to deal with pain. So, Monday, basically. How are you?

Jade A said:

I really agree. I always try to add TWs to my pieces, and know quite a few writers who do the same. whenever someone argues that it's a 'spoiler' I have to wonder what they think the synopsis on the back of their book is. or Viewer Discretion is Advised warnings that TV channels play.

really, how could TW: ASSAULT count as a spoiler, anyway. it doesn't say who's being assaulted, who's doing it, what the context is... it's just letting people who could be harmed by the content know to either avoid it or wait until they're in a good headspace.

[forgot to respond to this part last night, but I wanted to]

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This^ x1,000. There's one author I follow who posted a content rundown of her own book. She was careful not to spoil anything, yet still told me what I, as a sensitive person, needed to know about the violence and related things, and I can't express how much respect that earned her in my eyes. I intend to do the same if I ever write a book that needs it.



Morning, Cantina. My mom is eating solid food again. Yay! She's also feeling up to going out of the house, so I'll have to get my writing done before we go do errands.

Oh, out of curiosity, if y'all have a story idea and don't have anything else to write on, have you ever written it on the inside cover of the book you're reading? I know some people keep notepads by their bed for that kind of thing, but I don't have ideas at night often enough to feel that's worth it, so on the rare occasion I do have I idea, I've more than once put it in the book I was reading (in pencil, of course) and then erased it once I got it transferred to the computer. I'm asking because I did it again last night when I was attacked with an idea for expanding my SISYFUS from last year, "Space Elves".

Blinkk said:

Hey guys, I have 4 credits on Audible and I need some new authors to check out. I'm really into anti heroes right now. Does anyone have any fantasy authors they can recommend who do a lot of antihero's? I've been reading a lot of Robin Hobb and Steven King and I want to explore more authors with that dark feel. I love that stuff.

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I read Elantris by Sanderson and really enjoyed. My current favorite antihero, though, is by far Harry Dresden (Jim Butcher). I was going to say if you like assassins, check out Robin Hobb - but I see you're already there You might enjoy the Raymond Feist Riftwar books. My favorite group was the ones he did with Janny Wurts, Daughter of the Empire.

Shadowflame said:

Is it worth it? I just don't know.
I'd really like to find a writing group that does critiques but it's not likely around here. (The ones I have gone to are "Everyone gets a gold star!" type groups and I need something more advanced.

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I was saying 'run away' in my head even before your revelation of the business model.

_Sian_ said:

*pops her head up*

*waves*

Guess who's just got used to working 30 hours a week and studying full time. It only took three months of running around like a chook with it's head chopped off. I almost have a routine now.

How is everyone?

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Hello, Sian!

Mary Love said:

Yes, now to identify my elements and determine the order in which they close. I think it's spreadsheet time.

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WOOHOO!!! GO SPREADSHEETS GO!!!

I went to the Ithaca Friends of the Library booksale and added to my research collection (several books on medieval Ireland, Iceland, church, etc.) on Saturday. Then I went up to Syracuse because SURPRISE! I discovered they were having a bead show. I spent far more money there, alas. But it was good! I went to Buttermilk falls and took some autumn photos (though the falls were almost dry) and to a lovely Catholic cemetery in Syracuse and got lots of angel photos.

Sunday I had brunch with some of my author friends and chatted about books and such. Then husband came home from his weekend event in Maryland and we chilled. Tomorrow he's off to Maine for a week, and my busy time at work kicks into high gear this afternoon.

ETA: BY GOLLY Y'ALL, I DONE BEEN HERE TWO (2) YEARS!!!!!

Religion0 said:

Middle looks weird next to eldest and youngest. Thinking of alternatives, but only first, second and third comes to mind.

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Where I come from, "middle" as in second of three, when referencing children, is common practice. With more than three spawns there can be multiple middles, eldests, or youngests. But "middle" for this is usually how it goes. I assume you're doing more translation stuff, then?

Jade A said:

I really agree. I always try to add TWs to my pieces, and know quite a few writers who do the same. whenever someone argues that it's a 'spoiler' I have to wonder what they think the synopsis on the back of their book is. or Viewer Discretion is Advised warnings that TV channels play.

really, how could TW: ASSAULT count as a spoiler, anyway. it doesn't say who's being assaulted, who's doing it, what the context is... it's just letting people who could be harmed by the content know to either avoid it or wait until they're in a good headspace.

[forgot to respond to this part last night, but I wanted to]

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MY DUDE!!! ^^ QFT FTW. I doeth spake as a personage unpleasantly sensitive to certain topics and numb to others, but TWs are wonderful. This whole rigmarole I keep hearing elsewhere from here about safe-spaces being somehow bad, or trigger warnings making people "weaker" really get's my gumption going. Like, (rhetorically speaking here) : what's wrong with respecting other people's sensitivities? Are we not allowed to feel safe and comfortable just because sometimes the world is neither? grrrrr, is all I can really say against it because I'm so angry it's that or start crying. Thank you for being a cool dude, Jade!

E.F.B. said:

This^ x1,000. There's one author I follow who posted a content rundown of her own book. She was careful not to spoil anything, yet still told me what I, as a sensitive person, needed to know about the violence and related things, and I can't express how much respect that earned her in my eyes. I intend to do the same if I ever write a book that needs it.

Morning, Cantina. My mom is eating solid food again. Yay! She's also feeling up to going out of the house, so I'll have to get my writing done before we go do errands.

Oh, out of curiosity, if y'all have a story idea and don't have anything else to write on, have you ever written it on the inside cover of the book you're reading? I know some people keep notepads by their bed for that kind of thing, but I don't have ideas at night often enough to feel that's worth it, so on the rare occasion I do have I idea, I've more than once put it in the book I was reading (in pencil, of course) and then erased it once I got it transferred to the computer. I'm asking because I did it again last night when I was attacked with an idea for expanding my SISYFUS from last year, "Space Elves".

Click to expand...

QFT again. As for the note taking in books that ain't mine own writing, I don't really do it because I mostly (but not entirely) consume ebooks and I can just take notes in those if needed with a keyboard and such. Also I always have an actual notebook within reach... But I mean, it's not like you're deliberately and maliciously defacing someone else's property for the sake of it? It's a book you own, yeah? Books belong to their readers and they aren't sacred as a rule, so you should feel comfortable doing whatever makes you happy with your books. Right? That could be marking passages, dogearing or taking notes about other books in that book.

my writing has taken a turn for the ambiguous. open endings, questions left unanswered, a lot of mystery throughout. funnily enough, I hated story ambiguity a few months ago. WHAT'S HAPPENING TO MEEEEE

E.F.B. said:

Oh, out of curiosity, if y'all have a story idea and don't have anything else to write on, have you ever written it on the inside cover of the book you're reading? I know some people keep notepads by their bed for that kind of thing, but I don't have ideas at night often enough to feel that's worth it, so on the rare occasion I do have I idea, I've more than once put it in the book I was reading (in pencil, of course) and then erased it once I got it transferred to the computer. I'm asking because I did it again last night when I was attacked with an idea for expanding my SISYFUS from last year, "Space Elves".

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I usually type them on my phone somewhere. it's always with me, so it's easy

Damoclian said:

ETA: BY GOLLY Y'ALL, I DONE BEEN HERE TWO (2) YEARS!!!!!

MY DUDE!!! ^^ QFT FTW. I doeth spake as a personage unpleasantly sensitive to certain topics and numb to others, but TWs are wonderful. This whole rigmarole I keep hearing elsewhere from here about safe-spaces being somehow bad, or trigger warnings making people "weaker" really get's my gumption going. Like, (rhetorically speaking here) : what's wrong with respecting other people's sensitivities? Are we not allowed to feel safe and comfortable just because sometimes the world is neither? grrrrr, is all I can really say against it because I'm so angry it's that or start crying. Thank you for being a cool dude, Jade!

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wooooo anniversary!

you're so spot on. I have sensitivity to pictures more than words, but have loved ones who can't read about certain things. I don't get why people are awful to others for it

I only got 425 words in Friday, but I've gotten 1400 today, and still going. I finally got the MC to meet the Faerie Queen and King. She at least didn't pee her pants, but it was a close thing. Now she's got to turn down a Fae lord's advances, and the crap will really hit the fan.