AW Amazon Store

If this site is helpful to you,
Please consider a voluntary subscription to defray ongoing expenses.


 

Welcome to the AbsoluteWrite Water Cooler! Please read The Newbie Guide To Absolute Write

Results 1 to 20 of 20

Thread: Fiction Editor Recommendations Please

  1. #1
    practical experience, FTW
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    207

    Fiction Editor Recommendations Please

    Hi, guys. I've been thinking recently about maybe self-publishing. ((still on the fence about it)) If I do decide to pursue it, can anyone recommend some fiction editors out there who are good, but aren't wildly expensive? I'm a little on the poor side currently.

  2. #2
    but appreciated anyway... Unimportant's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Aotearoa
    Posts
    5,453
    What genre?

    Dr Debra Doyle is excellent. http://doyleandmacdonald.com/editorial.html

  3. #3
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,553
    There are some recommendations here.

    [Publishing Services] Service Providers


  4. #4
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    India
    Posts
    11
    Thanks for sharing the link. I am also looking for help.

  5. #5
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,553
    Bear in mind that it's a very good idea to revise the socks off your work before sending it to an editor, as then the editor is free to look at the bigger problems in the ms rather than improving things you could have sorted out on your own.

    Note that if you're going to trade publish you don't need to pay for an editor at any point. Revise it to the best of your ability and that will be enough.

  6. #6
    banned as an incurable tosspot
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Rhode Island, USA
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Note that if you're going to trade publish you don't need to pay for an editor at any point. Revise it to the best of your ability and that will be enough.
    If you already have a publishing contract, this is true. If you don't, you'll want to make sure your submission is as publishable as possible. Agents and acquisition editors no longer have the time to work with manuscripts that have more than superficial problems.

  7. #7
    practical experience, FTW cornflake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    13,785
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    If you already have a publishing contract, this is true. If you don't, you'll want to make sure your submission is as publishable as possible. Agents and acquisition editors no longer have the time to work with manuscripts that have more than superficial problems.
    If you can't get your ms. to a point that it's ready to send to agents by yourself (with the help of beta readers, etc.), paying an editor to whip it into shape is not going to do you any favours. If the ms you send out isn't representative of your own ability, it's going to cause nothing but problems.

  8. #8
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,553
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    If you already have a publishing contract, this is true. If you don't, you'll want to make sure your submission is as publishable as possible. Agents and acquisition editors no longer have the time to work with manuscripts that have more than superficial problems.
    Of course it's true that you'll want to make your ms "as publishable as possible" prior to submission. But it's not true that you will need to pay to have your work edited prior to submission, nor is it true that agents and editors don't have time to work on anything more than superficial problems.

    My agent has worked with me to edit my books. Several of my agent-friends do the same for their clients. And all of the editors I know work hard on the books they sign to make them as good as they can be.

    I've checked out your website and notice that your editing experience was gained "freelancing for ad agencies", so perhaps this is true of the people you know within advertising, but it's not true of the good trade publishing professionals I know.

    Quote Originally Posted by cornflake View Post
    If you can't get your ms. to a point that it's ready to send to agents by yourself (with the help of beta readers, etc.), paying an editor to whip it into shape is not going to do you any favours. If the ms you send out isn't representative of your own ability, it's going to cause nothing but problems.
    Indeed. When I was last agent-hunting I was asked by all the offering agents (and a couple of others) if I'd had any help with my ms. They were all pleased to hear I'd gone no further than working with beta readers (one of whom I found at AW, and who was wonderful. She knows who she is and I am still grateful to her).

  9. #9
    banned as an incurable tosspot
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Rhode Island, USA
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by cornflake View Post
    If you can't get your ms. to a point that it's ready to send to agents by yourself (with the help of beta readers, etc.), paying an editor to whip it into shape is not going to do you any favours. If the ms you send out isn't representative of your own ability, it's going to cause nothing but problems.
    I don't "whip manuscripts into shape." I work with fiction authors to help them tell their stories more professionally. You claim to edit for money, and your website seems oriented to authors rather than publishers. Exactly what are your editing clients paying for?

  10. #10
    banned as an incurable tosspot
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Rhode Island, USA
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Of course it's true that you'll want to make your ms "as publishable as possible" prior to submission.
    Well, we agree on that, anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    But it's not true that you will need to pay to have your work edited prior to submission,
    I never said anyone needed to do anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    nor is it true that agents and editors don't have time to work on anything more than superficial problems.
    Well, here's just one of many. And she's been known to recommend an author seek professional editing after declining to represent:

    http://www.rachellegardner.com/how-much-editing-can-an-agent-do/

  11. #11
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,553
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    I don't "whip manuscripts into shape." I work with fiction authors to help them tell their stories more professionally. You claim to edit for money, and your website seems oriented to authors rather than publishers. Exactly what are your editing clients paying for?
    Cornflake's clients are paying for Cornflake's skill, expertise, experience and editorial talent, which are evident in many of Cornflake's posts here. Cornflake has proved to be valuable and thoughtful and good at this, and does not deserve snark. OK?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    I never said anyone needed to do anything.



    Well, here's just one of many. And she's been known to recommend an author seek professional editing after declining to represent:

    http://www.rachellegardner.com/how-much-editing-can-an-agent-do/
    We can all point to links where agents or editors have said one thing that supports our arguments, just as we can all selectively quote to prove points, and make unhelpful snarky comments which don't add anything other than unpleasantness to the threads we participate in. I don't see the value in it.

    You didn't respond to my previous comment, so I'll quote it again here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    I've checked out your website and notice that your editing experience was gained "freelancing for ad agencies", so perhaps this is true of the people you know within advertising, but it's not true of the good trade publishing professionals I know.
    Now. Let's stop with the snipey derails. Thanks.

  12. #12
    please distract me mccardey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Australia.
    Posts
    11,241
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    I don't "whip manuscripts into shape." I work with fiction authors to help them tell their stories more professionally. You claim to edit for money, and your website seems oriented to authors rather than publishers. Exactly what are your editing clients paying for?
    Do you charge, like, money for that? Asking for a friend.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Let's stop with the snipey derails. Thanks.
    Oops. Missed that.
    Soz.

  13. #13
    banned as an incurable tosspot
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Rhode Island, USA
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Cornflake's clients are paying for Cornflake's skill, expertise, experience and editorial talent, which are evident in many of Cornflake's posts here. Cornflake has proved to be valuable and thoughtful and good at this, and does not deserve snark. OK?



    We can all point to links where agents or editors have said one thing that supports our arguments, just as we can all selectively quote to prove points, and make unhelpful snarky comments which don't add anything other than unpleasantness to the threads we participate in. I don't see the value in it.

    You didn't respond to my previous comment, so I'll quote it again here.



    Now. Let's stop with the snipey derails. Thanks.
    Huh. And here I was thinking I was pretty polite, even though I grow tired of the anti-editor crusaders on this forum. Maybe you can tell me how to rephrase what was a legitimate question. How does someone who takes payment for editing justify doing so after asserting beta readers and one's own talent is all that is required when seeking to be published?

    I didn't realize you were asking a question about my experience. It seemed more like sneering. Twice.
    Last edited by Thoughtfleditor; 07-14-2017 at 06:19 PM.

  14. #14
    Herder of Hamsters AW Admin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    On the Server
    Posts
    13,280
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    If you already have a publishing contract, this is true. If you don't, you'll want to make sure your submission is as publishable as possible. Agents and acquisition editors no longer have the time to work with manuscripts that have more than superficial problems.
    I've not seen any decline in the amount of time editors have to edit mss. at any of the trade or academic publishers I work with and for. Perhaps you should look at better established publishers?

    If you have serious issues with writing, because you're not a native speaker of English, or you're dyslexic, etc. it might make sense for you to hire an editor for proofreading, even though you plan on subbing to trade publishers. Certainly it makes sense for those who plan to self-publish.

    But if you're planning to to submit to trade publishers and you haven't any special circumstances, it's silly and possibly stupid to hire an editor. The editor won't know the preferences of the eventual publisher's editors, won't know house style, etc. and could make more work rather than less work.

    Moreover, why pay someone to do the publisher's job?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    Huh. And here I was thinking I was pretty polite, even though I grow tired of the anti-editor crusaders on this forum. Maybe you can tell me how to rephrase what was a legitimate question. How does someone who takes payment for editing justify doing so after asserting beta readers and one's own talent is all that is required when seeking to be published?

    I didn't realize you were asking a question about my experience. It seemed more like sneering. Twice.
    Bless your heart.

    You're not qualified to edit. Your prose is clumsy, both here and on your site. God knows what you'd do to an innocent author's prose. The reference to "fiction authors" is enough to make someone with an ear wince, and your site copy is not helpful. Working for ad agencies as a proof reader doesn't qualify you to edit fiction; a Ph.D. in English doesn't qualify me to edit fiction, but it does qualify me to point out that you're a clumsy writer and likely to be an even worse editor.

    Your own prose on your Website is over-larded with prepositional phrases. It's not promising.

    I will assess the strengths and weaknesses of the major components of the manuscript and provide suggestions on how best to address problem areas.
    Seriously dude; that's just ugly. If you can tolerate a sentence like that without physical pain, you're not an editor. You don't have an ear.

    You're snotty to mods, you're antagonistic towards members who have earned our respect, and you're only here to hang your shingle.

    I'm not willing to tolerate parasites who mangle English for money.

  15. #15
    practical experience, FTW cornflake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    13,785
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoughtfleditor View Post
    Huh. And here I was thinking I was pretty polite, even though I grow tired of the anti-editor crusaders on this forum. Maybe you can tell me how to rephrase what was a legitimate question. How does someone who takes payment for editing justify doing so after asserting beta readers and one's own talent is all that is required when seeking to be published?

    I didn't realize you were asking a question about my experience. It seemed more like sneering. Twice.
    I don't know where you're getting the idea there are "anti-editor crusaders" on a forum populated by a whole lot of editors. Old Hack is an editor (among other things). There is an 'Ask an editor' section of AW, and plenty of areas in which people get advice from members, some of whom have spent many years as professional editors, about all manner of, you know, editing.

    Reread my comment please. Beta readers and one's own talent may not, indeed, be all that's required when seeking to be published. If those things together, however, cannot produce a manuscript that is competent, clean, and professional enough to pass muster with an agent, employing a professional editor to accomplish that is not likely going to do the writer any favours in the long run.

  16. #16
    Herder of Hamsters AW Admin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    On the Server
    Posts
    13,280
    If you're looking for an editor, be wary of those who conflate editing and proof reading.

    They are not the same; there are rare individuals who can do both equally well, but they're rare.

    If you're looking for an editor and the prose on their own site and in their posts is awkward and amateur, keep looking.

    See the FAQ here: [Publishing Services] What should I ask a prospective copy editor?

  17. #17
    ....... Harlequin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    The land from whence the shadows fall
    Posts
    1,459
    Hrm. I felt like my first editor was pretty much a crash course (in a good way) on writing; go through her revisions felt like "levelling up".

    Or to borrow an MMO metaphor, it felt like being power levelled a little bit, and that maybe I'd saved myself some grinding.

    I mean, good betas feel that way too, but it was very focused with the editor. I've also beta read for people before where I felt there were subtle underlying problems that were above my craft ability to fix. An editor maybe would help more.
    Last edited by Harlequin; 07-15-2017 at 12:35 AM.
    Deferential, glad to be of use,
    Politic, cautious, and meticulous;
    Full of high sentence, but a bit obtuse;
    At times, indeed, almost ridiculousó
    Almost, at times, the Fool.


  18. #18
    practical experience, FTW pschmehl's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Richardson, TX
    Posts
    159
    My editor was wonderful at retaining my voice while suggesting changes that improved the manuscript. Since Cathleen Townsend, in reviewing my book, had this to say, I think I got my money's worth.
    But this volume has superb writing in a line-edit senseóI didnít have a single wince as I read, and thatís a rarer occurrence than I would wish.
    If you're interested, PM me, and I'll tell you how to contact her. She stays busy, so I can't promise she can take you on.
    Retired
    Writing Christian fiction for those who are searching
    http://www.paullawrencebooks.com
    @paullawrencebooks Facebook page
    My first book is out - Prayers Were No Help and on Amazon.

  19. #19
    please distract me mccardey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Australia.
    Posts
    11,241
    Quote Originally Posted by Dana Lee View Post
    Hello KittenEV,
    I wish I had seen your post sooner, but I have just returned to my editing work after a summer break. I edit and proofread for an affordable rate and am flexible to work with. I'd love to help you out with your project, so feel free to message me!

    Dana Lee
    Welcome to AW, Dana. You might want to pop into the Newbie's page and open a thread there and tell us a bit about yourself.

  20. #20
    Night Owl GypsyLayla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    California
    Posts
    76
    I don't like "one size fits all" advice.

    My husband and I did our research. We decided that working with an editor was the right choice for us. "I got no help except my beta readers" didn't work for us. Why? We are both introverts with very small social circles. No contacts in the publishing world. Our beta readers are busy people and they are unrealiable when it comes to substantive writing advice. We both write well, but we didn't have the money or personality to attend endless workshops, writing courses, etc. We used our editing as a learning experience.

    And we learned a lot from the experience. When an agent asks me if we had help, I'll be honest. We did. They don't want to rep us... time to move on.

    You know what the most important thing I learned was? Most freelance editors are not good ones. I found two that are. It took me four months to find them. If you want the information PM me.
    Last edited by GypsyLayla; 11-11-2017 at 07:20 AM.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Custom Search