Special Counsel Appointed To Head Up Russia Investigation

rugcat · May 17, 2017

WASHINGTON — The Justice Department has appointed Robert S. Mueller III, the former F.B.I. director, to serve as a special counsel to oversee its investigation into Russian meddling in the election, Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein anno

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/...ler-special-counsel-russia-investigation.html

There has been intense pressure to do something like this, which has certainly increased since the revelation of the James Comey memo. Robert Mueller is a serious guy. This is not going to be a casual investigation, nor any kind of cover up. The Trump White House must be feeling a bit nervous today.

regdog · May 17, 2017

Finally.

Brightdreamer · May 17, 2017

It's probably wrong that my first thought isn't "Finally - someone's going after the truth!" but "Dang - how far will the White House go to distract everyone from this?"

rugcat · May 17, 2017

Robert Mueller is also highly respected on both sides of the aisle. As much or more so than anyone else in law-enforcement.

If he finds evidence of collusion with the Russians, I can't see a single Republican claiming bias or that it's not true. They're going to have to accept it.

On the other hand, if he finds there is no evidence of collusion, those of us who think there was are going to have to accept that as well.

Whatever the outcome, I think this will go along way and restoring some trust in our institutions.

Gregg · May 17, 2017

I agree with rugcat. Hopefully the investigation will be concluded in months, not years.

While it is never a good thing to be the subject of an investigation by a special counsel, this does give the Trump administration a chance to get on track and work on their agenda.

shakeysix · May 17, 2017

Another good thing--people are actually following the news these days and keeping track of the events instead of hollering. And that debate with Bernie and John Kasich was something that the country needed. Politicians, even opposing politicians, do not need to bellow, belittle and name call to make a point. Maybe, just maybe---nope. Not going to jinx it--s6

rugcat · May 17, 2017

Gregg said:
I agree with rugcat. Hopefully the investigation will be concluded in months, not years.

While it is never a good thing to be the subject of an investigation by a special counsel, this does give the Trump administration a chance to get on track and work on their agenda.

Hopefully not years, but it depends entirely on where the investigation leads.

The Whitewater investigation took a couple of years, IIRC, but that was because it broadened out into other areas – the whole Monica Lewinski thing came out as an unexpected byproduct of that investigation.

I believe the same thing is going to happen with this investigation. I don't believe enough evidence of collusion will come out to justify criminal charges. There may have been actions which are ethically and politically questionable, but the only thing Robert Mueller is going to be looking at is whether the actions constitute an actual criminal act.

But who knows where the investigation will lead. It surely will look into the financial dealings of people like Paul Manafort, especially in his relations to Russia and the Russian government. And those investigations may well entangle Trump – in which case he'll start looking into Trump's financial dealings. Mueller would then also have justification to subpoena Trump's tax records for what they might show. They certainly would be relevant to the investigation.

Trump would surely fight any subpoena of his tax records in court and it could drag on forever.

And I still believe this investigation will go in unexpected directions and what will eventually bring Trump down, if anything, will be his financial dealings, not his connections to Russian hacking during the campaign. But it's not going to all be over in a couple of months.

blacbird · May 17, 2017

And the "Justice Department" is run by who?

Jeff Sessions, that's who. So does Mueller answer to Tweetybird Sessions? If so, does that give anybody confidence in the fidelity of this "investigation"?

caw

MaeZe · May 17, 2017

Mueller is no patsy and no fool. He will answer to the public when his findings are ready.

rugcat · May 17, 2017

blacbird said:
And the "Justice Department" is run by who?

Jeff Sessions, that's who. So does Mueller answer to Tweetybird Sessions? If so, does that give anybody confidence in the fidelity of this "investigation"?

caw

No, he will be answering to acting attorney general Rod Rosenstein, who is the one who appointed him. He will not be answering or dealing with Jeff Sessions.

Plus, there are legal structures put in place insuring his independence. Theoretically Rosenstein could fire him, but he would have to inform the heads of both the majority and minority justice committee members in senate and give a written explanation.

The guy who wrote the legal aspects of the special counsel was on the Rachel Maddow show, and explained that the way it was written was with exactly the scenario in mind that we now have – including a situation with a compromised attorney general.

This is one of the few appointments that I don't think we have to worry about.

rugcat · May 17, 2017

MaeZe said:
Mueller is no patsy and no fool. He will answer to the public when his findings are ready.

Actually, he won't. He will present his findings to the acting Attorney General, who will then make them public if he sees fit.

Unlike Comey, he will not be giving any press conferences. He will simply present a case to the Justice Department for criminal prosecution or decline to do so.

shakeysix · May 18, 2017

Elijah Cummings is on Morning Joe as I post this. He wrote a lengthy letter warning Pence about Flynn's being investigated in November. When Cummings asked Pence about it later, Pence said that he was "foggy" about it. Flynn is saying he told the vetting team he was being investigated. He wants to tell his story.

Remember the trash compacter scene in the first Star Wars? Luke, Leia, Hahn, Chewy are knee deep in floating garbage when something slithery grabs Luke by the ankle and pulls him under. I think it has Pence by the ankle now--s6

cornflake · May 18, 2017

Apparently someone got up and found wherever they'd hidden his phone, because --

Donald J. Trump ‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 3h 3 hours ago

More

With all of the illegal acts that took place in the Clinton campaign & Obama Administration, there was never a special councel appointed!

Nice spelling, moron.

Twick · May 18, 2017

To be fair, he mentioned the Clinton "campaign," so he's presumably talking Hillary, not Bill.

He has yet to realize that once he became president, "But Hillary!" is no longer an argument. There's no reason to have a special prosecutor for a candidate. Perhaps she was horrible as he says, but as he likes to remind us, he won. Therefore, she's old news. Now Trump has to stand on his own integrity, not compare himself to someone else. Saying, "I'm no worse than the person who wasn't elected" isn't persuasive, but he can't get it through his head that this is now an ineffective strategy.

cornflake · May 18, 2017

Twick said:
To be fair, he mentioned the Clinton "campaign," so he's presumably talking Hillary, not Bill.

He has yet to realize that once he became president, "But Hillary!" is no longer an argument. There's no reason to have a special prosecutor for a candidate. Perhaps she was horrible as he says, but as he likes to remind us, he won. Therefore, she's old news. Now Trump has to stand on his own integrity, not compare himself to someone else. Saying, "I'm no worse than the person who wasn't elected" isn't persuasive, but he can't get it through his head that this is now an ineffective strategy.

Yeah, that took me a second, but ... yeah. A special prosecutor for a general citizen? Trying to parse his forays into logic is hard.

Alessandra Kelley · May 18, 2017

What illegal acts in the Obama administration?

President Obama presided over the cleanest, most scandal-free administration this nation has seen in eons, certainly for my entire lifetime.

Despite the ferocious efforts of the entire Republican Party to pin something, anything on President Obama, without pause or mercy or human consideration, despite all the insults and dirt-digging and denunciations, President Obama served his full eight years with dignity, presence, humor, good judgement, a warm, supportive family life -- and not the slightest whiff of real scandal. Ever.

davidjgalloway · May 18, 2017

President Obama presided over the cleanest, most scandal-free administration this nation has seen in eons, certainly for my entire lifetime.

Interesting, because I would tend to agree, though if you review a listing like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...2009.E2.80.932017_Barack_Obama_Administration

it brings back a lot of things I had forgotten, and some of them significant (Weiner, Hastert, GSA/Vegas). I think the point you're making is that even those events in the Executive Branch did not reach up to Obama, nor did he appear to be the instigator of or contributor to any scandalous acts. Politicians under his tenure continued to be the sociopaths and clueless oversexed morons they often are, but he seems not to be in that sorry group.

davidjgalloway · May 18, 2017

I would also add it does seem unfair--to any president of any party--to list "scandals" that became public under their administration, but had absolutely nothing to do with that particular head of state.

cbenoi1 · May 18, 2017

regdog said:
Finally.

Day 119 of the Trump administration. There is a Guinness record to be had with the number of daily clusterfucks.

-cb

cornflake · May 18, 2017

I browse some forums that would have pages full of answers for you -- people called repeatedly for Obama's impeachment, for things from Benghazi, the IRS thing, etc.

nighttimer · May 18, 2017

davidjgalloway said:
I would also add it does seem unfair--to any president of any party--to list "scandals" that became public under their administration, but had absolutely nothing to do with that particular head of state.

Harry Truman got off a pretty famous line about bucks and where they stop. Maybe you've heard it?

Apparently, Rosenstein made the decision to tap Mueller without running it by Jeff Sessions or the White House. Ballsy.

Whether it leads to anything, I can't say. Mueller's credentials speak for themselves, but this hardly means he's going to be able to get into whatever Russian/Trump rabbit hole he wants to poke around in.

Hey kids! It's Fun Facts Time:

[h=4]Can a ‘special prosecutor’ or an ‘independent counsel’ be appointed?[/h]No, because the law that created that type of prosecutor expired.

During the Watergate-era’s so-called Saturday Night Massacre, President Richard M. Nixon ordered the firing of the prosecutor running the investigation into his White House. As part of the reforms afterward, Congress created a new type of prosecutor to look into high-level executive branch wrongdoing while shielded from political interference. This position was called a special prosecutor at first and later an independent counsel.

The law set criteria for an attorney general to request a three-judge panel to appoint such a prosecutor, who would be subject to the judges’ supervision and could not be fired by the president or his appointees.

While the Supreme Court upheld the arrangement as constitutional, critics said it permitted a prosecutor to run amok. Republicans learned to hate the arrangement during the Iran-contra investigation into the Reagan administration, and Democrats did, as well, during the Whitewater and Monica Lewinsky investigations into President Bill Clinton. When the law expired in 1999, Congress did not renew it.

[h=4]What would the appointment of a ‘special counsel’ do?[/h]This position dates to 1999, when the Justice Department issued new regulations to create it after the independent counsel law expired. Special counsels are empowered to run an investigation with greater autonomy than a United States attorney normally enjoys. The regulations say special counsels “shall not be subject to the day-to-day supervision of any official of the department.” A special counsel also generally decides on his or her own “whether and to what extent to inform or consult with the attorney general or others within the department about the conduct of his or her duties and responsibilities.”

But if Mr. Rosenstein were to appoint one, the special counsel would still be ultimately subject to his control — and Mr. Trump’s. That means the special counsel’s decisions could be overruled, and he or she could be fired.

Don't think because Mueller is well-regarded and respected and hopefully can run an independent investigation without the White House impeding it, Trump would hesitate to fire him if the itch nagged at him long enough. Firing people is Trump's thing and he kinda seems to get off on it.

rugcat · May 18, 2017

nighttimer said:
Hey kids! It's Fun Facts Time:

Don't think because Mueller is well-regarded and respected and hopefully can run an independent investigation without the White House impeding it, Trump would hesitate to fire him if the itch nagged at him long enough. Firing people is Trump's thing and he kinda seems to get off on it.

That is true, but it's not quite so black-and-white. According to the man who wrote the special counsel regulations, Rod Rosenstein can indeed overrule Robert Mueller, but only if Mueller's requests fall wildly outside established policy. He can't just say "I don't think that's an area of importance, so you need to focus elsewhere."

Trump can indeed fire Robert Mueller. And although he would take a a lot of flak if he did so, that's never bothered him, and I think he would probably survive it politically. That will be true as long as his support still hovers close to 40%.

But if that support among the general population craters, as it did with Nixon, you will see Republicans in Congress deserting him in droves. And the congressional investigations would still keep going, as would the FBI's. One way or another, the stuff he's trying to hide will eventually come out.

Special Counsel Appointed To Head Up Russia Investigation

Lost in the Fog

The Scavengers

Just Another Lazy Perfectionist

Lost in the Fog

Life is good

blue eyed floozy

Lost in the Fog

Lost in the Fog

Lost in the Fog

blue eyed floozy

practical experience, FTW

practical experience, FTW

Sophipygian

Opus is my guy.

Opus is my guy.

practical experience, FTW

No Gods No Masters

Lost in the Fog