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Thread: Do you think Trump will reshape America?

  1. #51
    I should be writing. Alpha Echo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blacbird View Post
    We seem to have lost some of our long-time conservative arguers here, largely, I guess, because they were having the same problem, and couldn't take being called out on it. I actually think that's unfortunate.
    I just want to point out that there was one poster maybe a month ago, no more than that, who explained why she voted for Trump. I forget which thread it was, but her entire post was thoughtful and considerate, and I believe she had a link or two in there.

    I didn't agree with her, but I sent her a PM to thank her for posting in a primarily liberal political forum (at least at the moment). I told her it's important to talk about these things, and though I didn't agree with her (at all), I hoped to continue the conversation.

    Moments later, she had deleted her post, and she responded to my PM by telling me she'd very quickly received some nasty messages in response to her more conservative post.

    I don't think, and I'm certainly not suggesting that, the nasty messages came from any of the regulars here, but I'm just pointing out another possible reason we don't see much from the other side.
    "All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible"
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  2. #52
    Not so happily ever after... Nightmirror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Echo View Post
    I just want to point out that there was one poster maybe a month ago, no more than that, who explained why she voted for Trump. I forget which thread it was, but her entire post was thoughtful and considerate, and I believe she had a link or two in there.

    I didn't agree with her, but I sent her a PM to thank her for posting in a primarily liberal political forum (at least at the moment). I told her it's important to talk about these things, and though I didn't agree with her (at all), I hoped to continue the conversation.

    Moments later, she had deleted her post, and she responded to my PM by telling me she'd very quickly received some nasty messages in response to her more conservative post.

    I don't think, and I'm certainly not suggesting that, the nasty messages came from any of the regulars here, but I'm just pointing out another possible reason we don't see much from the other side.
    If people can post their opinions intelligently, it's highly hypocritical for members of opposing opinions to respond in such a hideous manner. In the south, for example, nearly all talk shows are of conservative opinion; it irks me when a liberal calls the radio show and gets shut down, barely a word in, without even hearing the caller's opinion or his supporting facts, simply for the amusement of his listeners. I'm just agreeing that such discourse should adhere to the same governing rules of moral and fair conduct when people express their views intelligently. By all means, rip anyone's opinion to shreds with evidence and enlighten them if they are ignorant, but please refrain from resorting to succumbing to brutal, juvenile tactics like bullying.
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  3. #53
    Herder of Hamsters AW Admin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha Echo View Post
    Moments later, she had deleted her post, and she responded to my PM by telling me she'd very quickly received some nasty messages in response to her more conservative post.

    I don't think, and I'm certainly not suggesting that, the nasty messages came from any of the regulars here, but I'm just pointing out another possible reason we don't see much from the other side.
    Just as a reminder, if you receive PMs or Rep comments that you feel are abusive or spam, please let MacAllister or me know.

    That's not OK.

  4. #54
    practical experience, FTW Twick's Avatar
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    Well, to get back to the topic at hand - Trump's budget would eliminate the Chemical Safety Board http://www.csb.gov/. If approved, that would probably reshape America by leaving explosion-shaped holes in various places where businesses (and workers) used to be.

  5. #55
    Livin' la vida biblia ASeiple's Avatar
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    Can Trump reshape America? Certainly.

    Will Trump do so? I doubt it. Takes a lot of work to get the entire country in line with one way of thinking on pretty much anything. And the guy doesn't have much of a work ethic, that I can see. His administration, sure, some of them are more devoted... but they're proving to be either incompetent or too busy feuding to get things done on the timetable they'd need to run to accomplish a major, lasting change.

    What he and they CAN do is leave a mess for whoever comes next to clean up. Junk enough things up that life gets messy in weird ways for everyone.

    And what we should do, is hold them accountable for every act of malice, incompetence, and laziness. They've used up all their benefit of the doubt, there's none left. Yell when they hurt you, yell when they look like they're gonna hurt you, and make their lives hard. Block, obstruct, slow down and play for time.

    In short, resist.

    Either he's going to fall over dead from stress or we'll run out the clock on him, but I think America will endure. And we'll come out stronger and better for having to beat up this random midboss.
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  6. #56
    Beastly Fido Roxxsmom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASeiple View Post

    Either he's going to fall over dead from stress or we'll run out the clock on him, but I think America will endure. And we'll come out stronger and better for having to beat up this random midboss.
    I sure hope so, but I'm still afraid there will be long-term effects that will stay with us for a long time. I'm old enough now that I worry I won't be alive by the time some of them are finally fixed and society starts moving (what I think of as) forward again. And some individual people harmed by these policies, and by the social climate this presidency engenders, will likely never recover or get their lives back.
    Last edited by Roxxsmom; 03-21-2017 at 01:26 AM.
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  7. #57
    Are you gonna finish that bacon? Vince524's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rugcat View Post
    I disagree with you on lots of things, Vince, but have never found you to be irrational or unpleasant in any fashion. Perhaps that is not unrelated to your decision to stay here and poke at us lefties once in a while.
    Does that mean you have to look harder, or it'll take more effort on my part?

  8. #58
    Pie aren't squared, pie are round! Introversion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASeiple View Post
    Either he's going to fall over dead from stress or we'll run out the clock on him, but I think America will endure. And we'll come out stronger and better for having to beat up this random midboss.
    I think you have more faith than I do in the "checks and balances" that I used to take for granted. Also in the American voter. By installing a conservative Supreme Court majority, Trump can continue to do damage for decades after he's out of office. By his actions and words, he's helping to make hate-speech normal, or at least common again.

    I feel like I don't know my country any more, and given that much of recent horribleness is the GOP in general, not just Trump, and given how many people still support Trump, I'm pessmistic that things will revert back to sanity quickly, if ever, post-Trump.

  9. #59
    Herder of Hamsters AW Admin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vince524 View Post
    Does that mean you have to look harder, or it'll take more effort on my part?
    yes

  10. #60
    Joker Groupie Celia Cyanide's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by William Haskins View Post
    this isn't the first time since the election that you've taken a veiled victory lap over the bones of those who have moved on. instead of latching on to the conclusion that makes you feel the smartest, you might want to actually dig in a bit and find out what really went on.

    i can assure you, in my case anyway, that it has nothing to do with some fear that i can't hold my own in debates here or back up my arguments.

    I actually hadn't noticed that you were not posting as much anymore. I don't really know why anyone left or reverted to lurking after the closing and reopening of the room. I know I have backed off a bit because I want to make sure my posts are appropriate to the new tone of the room. We used to get silly sometimes.
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  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by William Haskins View Post
    this isn't the first time since the election that you've taken a veiled victory lap over the bones of those who have moved on. instead of latching on to the conclusion that makes you feel the smartest, you might want to actually dig in a bit and find out what really went on.

    i can assure you, in my case anyway, that it has nothing to do with some fear that i can't hold my own in debates here or back up my arguments.
    If it helps, I wasn't thinking of you, personally. And I think you have reason to know me better than that. There were three or four others conspicuously in mind. Frankly, I'd like to piss them off enough to draw them back into the conversation here. I would really like to know what they think of the current . . . situation . . . in the White House.

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  12. #62
    Heckuva good sport frimble3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    The KKK is just one very busy bloke in Alabama.
    That's why he wears hoods - to hide the fact that he's very much an army of one.

  13. #63
    Heckuva good sport frimble3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmirror View Post
    In the south, for example, nearly all talk shows are of conservative opinion; it irks me when a liberal calls the radio show and gets shut down, barely a word in, without even hearing the caller's opinion or his supporting facts, simply for the amusement of his listeners.
    That's not just the Southern U.S.. We have radio programs like that here, I used to have to listen to them when my dad was driving and in charge of the radio. Exactly the same format you describe: host brings up some hot-button topic, pre-Internet click-bait, and all the old-guy regulars would call in. They were against some stuff automatically, and for other stuff just because they always had been, but their ideas were preexisting, and they had no interest in more information or other points of view.
    I assume they're still around, but my father isn't, so I don't have to listen.

    AFAIK, the only radio station that does actual 'talking' is CBC radio (Canada's version of NPR). They bring up a topic, usually something in the news, or at least something new, bring in an expert in the field, or someone who's written about it, they interview them, and then there's a short call-in segment, which I suspect is screened for axe-grinders. No ranting or shouting allowed. It's moderated, it's informative, it's interesting.

  14. #64
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    One of the effects of this presidency that I hope won't get glossed over or accepted as ordinary practice is nepotism. This is defined as the practice among those with power or influence of favouring relatives or friends, especially by giving them jobs. It is a term that originated to describe how Borgia Popes made a habit of finding jobs and high positions or lucrative sinecures for 'nephews' or other family members who were not qualified or entitled to hold those positions. Because those in power often hoped the family member would 'manage' or 'contain' the Papal authority, no objection was raised, although conflicts of interest and incompetence were often fairly obvious. And once nepotism was widely accepted or 'normalised', it simply went on, generation after generation, in powerful extended families with many business and political interests.

    Although US anti-nepotism law states that a public official “may not appoint, employ, promote, advance, or advocate for appointment” a relative to an agency or office that is run by the official according to a Guardian article, President Trump's son-in-law has been appointed a senior advisor and his daughter Ivanka is to have her own office in the West Wing and access to classified information. Alarming for any of us who have seen blatant nepotism at work in local government or corporate life.

  15. #65
    Travelling around the sun cbenoi1's Avatar
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    It marks the end of POTUS as a role model.

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  16. #66
    practical experience, FTW RightHoJeeves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbenoi1 View Post
    It marks the end of POTUS as a role model.

    -cb
    I wonder if the next President will either have mountainous expectation placed upon him/her, or whether the bar will be super low?

    I also wouldn't be surprised if there's a big move to solidify a lot of the "gentlemen's agreements" into hard law. Like about conflicts of interest, particularly. Not so an ethics committee can say they don't like it, but so you can lock people up.
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  17. #67
    blue eyed floozy shakeysix's Avatar
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    This election was a blow to the entire country. I firmly believe that it was master minded by the Russians, abetted by greed, fueled by ignorance and guided by paranoid fear and resentment. I'll be damned if I lose a friend over it.

    When I say friend I mean someone I have known for ten years, even if it is only by an avatar. Yeah, we have had our disagreements--but we also have our humor, our wit, our words. Even when those words have my blood singing in my ears, they are worth reading, because they were well written, well thought out and posted by a fellow wordsmith. Sometimes a poster pops in who is accusatory, ill prepared, comically arrogant. We make short work of him/her because it takes guts to swim here for years, decades. Let's not turn on each other--in my HUMBLE (But oh, so vehemently held) opinion, division is what the enemies of our country are trying to accomplish! --s6
    Last edited by shakeysix; 03-22-2017 at 03:36 PM.

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