This isn't the place to play devil's advocate; welcome to ACH & E, where we want citations.
Convicted murderer resumes his pro soccer career
- Thread starter CWatts
- Start date
This isn't the place to play devil's advocate; welcome to ACH & E, where we want citations.
Oh my lanta... Feminists. You guys are fucking wizards! What more do you want? You make people! How crazy is that?
Yes, women are smaller and more vulnerable, but men deal with men too. Men face the brunt of the violence. Bad things happen, sure, but I don't think there's an agenda against women. I think, for the most part, men are biologically driven to protect women.
Yes, women are smaller and more vulnerable, but men deal with men too. Men face the brunt of the violence. Bad things happen, sure, but I don't think there's an agenda against women. I think, for the most part, men are biologically driven to protect women.
Consequences for people who murder them would be a good start.
So you agree that patriarchy doesn't just hurt women?
...
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2012
- Messages
- 16,171
- Reaction score
- 3,734
Sooo.. people who disagree that it's no big deal someone who murdered a person, chopped the person up and fed the remains to a dog, and is then recruited by several pro sports teams, are feminists, and feminists are all women? That's a whole slew of interesting assumptions you've got going there.
Last edited:
I think the world is very complex. Humans are fundamentally animals, apes to be exact. I think males, for the most part, are biologically driven to protect women. I don't think there's a 'patriarchy' with an agenda against women. I think men and women are generally different in predictable ways. Some things women are better at, some things men are better at. From the way I see it, most men would beat the shit out of an abuser. That's the way of the homo-sapien.
Last edited:
You might want to take a look at the Room expectations.
And a look at The Newbie Guide to Absolute Write. We meant that respect your fellow writers thing.
Even the feminists.
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2010
- Messages
- 3,082
- Reaction score
- 888
- Location
- Where eggs are small and dear
- Website
- www.sunpig.com
(emphasis added)
And yet you shrug off this murder as a crime of passion and don't think the killer's professional career should be affected by it. That's a far cry from either protection or beating the shit out of an abuser.
I'm just curious - why does "crime of passion" mean "won't kill again"? Is there some reason why this man is unlikely to feel such a passion towards women again?
Last edited:
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2005
- Messages
- 16,339
- Reaction score
- 4,110
- Location
- East O' The Sun & West O' The Moon
- Website
- www.jlevitt.com
To be exact, humans are not apes, they are primates. Apes are a different species altogether, as are baboons and bonobos.
Baboons are quite interesting because they are territorial, aggressive, and have a rigid social hierarchy. Neuroscientist Robert Sapolsky wrote a wonderful book called A Primates Memoir of the time he spent studying them. He says something along the lines that if baboons had access to nuclear weapons, they would destroy the planet in a week. Here's a great interview with him from quite a while back:
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2001/04/of-monkeys-and-men/303047/
Bonobos on the other hand are far less aggressive, far more cooperative, and in general what we humans would think of as "nicer."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonobo
The point is you cannot make valid assumptions about human behavior by studying apes in particular, or even primates in general.
As for males being biologically wired to protect females, that's an interesting opinion. I would like to see it backed up with anything other than personal belief. It's my personal belief that males are biologically driven to subjugate women, especially sexually. Culture and civilization are what informs any male desire to protect women, not a biological imperative. And that cultural imperative is not equal in all societies.
Last edited:
For one of many, many real-life examples, my grandmother's cousin murdered his ex-girlfriend after abusing and stalking her. He was sentenced to life, then paroled after 13 years, because he was a young white man and maybe they thought it was a "crime of passion" and the dead woman was *pearl clutch* divorced. (The fact she was also a mother of three kids under 10 and one of them saw her get shot didn't seem to matter.)
20 years after the first murder, he killed again. This time he had an affair with a married woman and murdered her husband. Another life sentence and this time it stuck, he died in prison.
Plus if Bruno didn't want to pay child support, he could have used...protection!
I really hope any money he makes playing goes to Eliza's family or held in trust for the kid. He better not get custody. If his son wants to know him as an adult, okay, but the child should be kept far away from this monster.
Last edited:
I'm not surprised. He killed another man, rather than confining his passion to women.
In any event, aren't there studies of certain abusers which show their heart rates actually go down while they're engaging in violence?
I wonder if it's the same for trolls when they're trolling?
Thanks Admins for shutting that mess down.
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2011
- Messages
- 11,766
- Reaction score
- 12,242
- Location
- Atherton Tablelands
- Website
- snailseyeview.medium.com
Apes (Hominoidea) are a clade not a species. Humans and bonobos are hominoids (along with chimps, orang utans, gorillas, gibbons, siamangs). Baboons are not hominoids.
He recruited other men to do the dirty work - how is this a crime of passion? And, if 'men' are supposedly so damn protective, well, he didn't seem to have had any trouble finding men who were up for torturing and killing this young woman, did he? No-one heard his plan and then scuttled off to report him to the police, apparently.
Also, from the link in the OP
Also, from the link in the OP
which, considering the age of the child, suggests that he wanted her to have an abortion, rather than giving it away after birth. In either case, now he wants to have custody of the child? Let's hope the custody judge is as appalled by this as I am.
Last edited:
The fact that he had his entourage do his dirty work - including his 17-year-old cousin - just makes him all the more contemptible. Guess he didn't want to get his precious goalie hands dirty?
Also, abortion is illegal in Brazil except for in cases of rape or incest or if the life of the mother is in danger. http://www.reuters.com/article/us-abortion-brazil-secrets-idUSKCN0YG1GP
FYI AustinF was banned for trolling so there is no need to respond to his posts.
A troubling thought has been mulling in my head. He wanted the child aborted, then plotted, recruited others to do the actual killing, and watched the murder of the mother of this child, all to avoid spending money on the care of this child. Why should anyone believe he is now okay with the idea of spending money on the care of this child and not killing him?
AustinF's trolling aside, there is a sad belief among many that women ask to be abused. They talk back, stand up for themselves, don't obey, are independent, etc. This belief isn't only among some men but women as well. The men have control, misogyny and abuse issues, but many women think that way as a false sense of security. It is the same way there are women who say a woman asks to be raped by drinking, flirting, dressing a certain way. The thought is, 'if I don't do those things, I am safe.'
Men are not pre-programmed to protect women. They are raised by men and women who respect women and teach that respect, including being protective and standing up for what is right.
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2012
- Messages
- 14,751
- Reaction score
- 24,799
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Website
- elizabethbonesteel.com
Not to digress, but I think there's also a problem with recognizing what abuse is. Creepiest story I ever heard was from a woman I knew talking about her college boyfriend throwing her new camera into a wall when they were fighting. Her first thought? "Wow, he must really love me to react so strongly." There's a lot behind her reaction, but not the least of it is the toxic idea that violence = manly passion.
This is such a good point. Far too often, from a young age boys and girls are taught that boys hitting, bullying and harassing girls is how they show they like them. Adults have to teach children abuse is abuse, not affection.
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2011
- Messages
- 23,130
- Reaction score
- 10,901
- Location
- Where faults collide
- Website
- doggedlywriting.blogspot.com
Sorry for derailing things up thread.
This is very true, and it goes both ways too. if a woman is meek and passive and attempts to placate the man who abuses her, then people sneer and ask why she was such a doormat and didn't stand up for herself, or why she didn't leave him.
No matter what, it's her fault (to some people).
It sickens me that men who murder their wives and girlfriends still seem to get relatively light sentences, let alone be socially accepted afterwards. Pro sports also seem to have a particularly bad blind spot here, where the desire to sign someone who can win games for a franchise is greater than any loss of revenue due to fan disgust.
I'm never been more than a very casual follower of pro sports, so I've never really understood the passion and loyalty that many feel for their favorite teams. Out of curiosity, are there any fans who will turn away from a team they've followed for years because something said team did (besides losing too many games) leaves a bad taste in their mouths? Clearly the business decisions involved in signing disgusting, but talented, felons are based on the answer to this being no.
This is very true, and it goes both ways too. if a woman is meek and passive and attempts to placate the man who abuses her, then people sneer and ask why she was such a doormat and didn't stand up for herself, or why she didn't leave him.
No matter what, it's her fault (to some people).
It sickens me that men who murder their wives and girlfriends still seem to get relatively light sentences, let alone be socially accepted afterwards. Pro sports also seem to have a particularly bad blind spot here, where the desire to sign someone who can win games for a franchise is greater than any loss of revenue due to fan disgust.
I'm never been more than a very casual follower of pro sports, so I've never really understood the passion and loyalty that many feel for their favorite teams. Out of curiosity, are there any fans who will turn away from a team they've followed for years because something said team did (besides losing too many games) leaves a bad taste in their mouths? Clearly the business decisions involved in signing disgusting, but talented, felons are based on the answer to this being no.
Last edited:
In the interest of accuracy, "apes" are not a species. They are a major group of primates. Bonobos are apes, as are gorillas and chimpanzees and orangutans and gibbons. Baboons are monkeys, and monkeys are a separate major group of primates.
caw