Should US pay reparations for slavery? U.N. appointed experts think so.

RichardGarfinkle said:

Slavery was the official policy of the USA until the passage of the 13th amendment. As a result the US as an entity is deemed responsible. We collectively live under and individually reap the benefits of the US Constitution. We also therefore collectively live under and should bear the costs of the wrongs of that document and the slaveholding government it created.

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Totally and vehemently disagree.

This is an interesting question, one that's certainly not limited to slave ownership or the US. Historically, many countries whose governments still exist in more or less the same form today once had policies that caused great suffering that continues to resonate today. The roots of slavery in the US extend before the birth of our own country, so how much blame does Britain bear, even if they abandoned the institution before we did? Lingering harm done by the colonialism practiced by European powers also comes to mind, and of course the treatment of Native Americans by our own government etc. What about wars where a given country stole territory from its original owners on pretty flimsy pretenses?

If the descendants of the people responsible for these past wrongs still bear some responsibility, how much and what form should it take? And how much money would be needed to right the wrongs that still linger, and how should this money be used? Direct payments to the descendants of the wronged, or should it be used for targeted programs meant to rectify lingering economic inequality, racism and so on?

If we owe reparations for slavery, we probably owe them for the genocide of Native Americans, too.

And for the mistreatment of various groups of immigrants. And for the institutionalized sexism that made women second class citizens. And for all of the soldiers killed in wars fought unnecessarily.

I'm sure we could keep adding to this.

Regardless, who is getting the payments? The descendants of slaves? Will proof be necessary, because that strikes me as pretty unfair.

RichardGarfinkle said:

Slavery was the official policy of the USA until the passage of the 13th amendment. As a result the US as an entity is deemed responsible. We collectively live under and individually reap the benefits of the US Constitution. We also therefore collectively live under and should bear the costs of the wrongs of that document and the slaveholding government it created.

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I agree. I feel about this the same way I feel about tax money being used to settle lawsuits against the criminaljustice system and police. The government as an entity has a responsibility to right its wrongs, and we have a responsibility for our country's actions.

I'm pretty sure that my family never owned slaves, because most of them came here from Europe during WWI. But I fully support my tax money going toward reparations, especially since I still benefit, indirectly, from racism.

I have an idea for reperations: Stop being racist.

I am Caucasion, yet also Native American, My family never had slaves (as we were poor white trash). I feel that racism is a double edged sword. Everyone feels it...if they choose to, yet everyone can overcome it. There are some wonderfully educated and mainstream persons of African descent. I feel that some of our youth have been programmed to believe certain things while completely overlooking the fact that there are so many avenues now open to negate those horrible issues.
I lived in the deep south for many years when I was young. The black people treated my family better than our white peers. I feel an affinity to anyone who gives me a chance. I blame noone today for the way my Indian forebears were treated. Why should the past separate us now???

Zoombie said:

I have an idea for reperations: Stop being racist.

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Hard to disagree with that.

It is beacause, ontop of being handsome, wise, and rich...I am also always correct.

Rolling Thunder said:

You're dressing up as Trump for Halloween, aren't you?

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ooh, I might have to do that. I'm spending Halloween with my Trump-voting brother and his family (yes, I love my nieces and nephews very much), so it will be perfect. Let's see -- I just need me a tangerine-tinged spray tan, a yuuge pair of prosthetic hands, and something to approximate his hairdo. Anyone have any thoughts on what I might use for that last one?

Donald Trump Halloween costumes have been a thing since last Halloween.

James D. Macdonald said:

Donald Trump Halloween costumes have been a thing since last Halloween.

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Oh, I need to do a homemade one. I'm going to start growing some fungus for the wig and putting together a pair of massive papier-mache hands tonight.

Zoombie said:

It is beacause, ontop of being handsome, wise, and rich...I am also always correct.

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Except when it comes to typing "beacause, ontop"

CassandraW said:

and something to approximate his hairdo. Anyone have any thoughts on what I might use for that last one?

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A sham?

This idea is a practical absurdity, and won't happen, and at this juncture in history, a century-and-a-half beyond the abolition of slavery, and a half-century now beyond things like the Voting Rights act, it's really a moot point.

If the UN demands that the U.S. now pay reparations for 150-year-old policies, they should also demand that the British do likewise for their occupation and exploitation of India and other places, that the French do likewise for their occupation and exploitation of Algeria and Indochina and other places, that the Dutch do likewise for their occupation and exploitation of what is now Indonesia, that the Belgians do likewise for their occupation and exploitation of the Congo, that the Russians do likewise for Stalin's empire of gulags, etc., that the Chinese do likewise for their occupation of Tibet, . . . and then there's North Korea . . . except the last one probably doesn't have the means to pay reparations to anybody. Many of these things also involved de facto slavery.

What we can do, and should do, is stop police from killing unarmed and unresisting civilians, who, it seems, just happen mainly to be black.

Oh, and it would help, at least symbolically, if sympathizers with the romance and blissful wonder of the antebellum South in the U.S. would stop using the Confederate Battle Flag as a badge of honor.

caw

My family did not arrive in the US until after the Civil War, thus after slavery was outlawed. Why should I have to pay?

Should blacks who arrived in this country after slavery ended be paid reparations?

If reparations are going to be required, how do we extract reparations from the Native American tribes that allowed slave ownership? Some tribes owned black slaves. Others owned Native American slaves. How would that work?

Without question, slavery was and is a horrific institution. But trying to set up any sort of cash payments would I think cause much more harm than good. I can't imagine what the process would look like to authorize a particular family. Paying reparations would also I think set back race relations by decades.

If I can say this without sounding patronizing, I think it's better to channel the funds that would have been spent there to programs designed to help alleviate the problems caused by slavery.

Paying reparations is silly, impractical, and would be hugely divisive. Whether its right or wrong, people would seriously struggle accepting the idea of paying money to people when they didn't actually do anything wrong, and the people receiving the money weren't around for the policies anyway.

All it would do is fuel racial division, and it wouldn't solve anything. It's a ridiculous idea.

What they could do (stay with me, crazy idea I know), is actually put some decent thought and policy into ensuring minorities aren't kicked around in all the ridiculous ways they still are. Make some attempt at fixing the modern problems instead of awarding people money for something (something terrible, and I'm not denying it left a hideous scar) that happened over a century ago.

I haven't read all of the posts here because it's late. I'll catch up tomorrow.

I want to go on record, though, as saying that calling the idea of reparations absurd, ridiculous, silly, and so on is rude at best. We don't need to label ideas in ways that demean them just because.

A reason for reparations is that racism is institutionalized in our society. You have to think about that. Really try to put yourself in Black Americans' shoes.

I'll say more on this tomorrow. It's a worthwhile and important discussion, and I hope we can elevate it from where it currently is.

In a word, no. Collective guilt? Srsly? You're responsible for the sins of not only your father, but people who are long dead and were of no relation to you at all? Bulloney.