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How would you know you're writing accurate historical dialogue?

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Dutchess_of_Hyrule

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As the title says. I'm writing a historical novel and I'm curious as to how you would know that your dialogue is historically accurate?
 

Layla Nahar

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It's impossible to know. We could emulate written material (letters and such) from a given time - but - how do we know that's how people actually *spoke*? Also, some writing from a previous time period is straight up hard to comprehend - forex, accounts related to William Adams, the Englishman who became a retainer for Tokugawa Ieyasu, were difficult for me to parse at times. So even if you can emulate an antiquated style of communication, it might make your story difficult to read.
 

blacbird

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Research.

Find books either from or set in the historical period you are narrating, and see how they do it.

Also, be very wary of inadvertent anachronisms. Readers interested in historical fiction are generally pretty knowledgeable about factual material relating to the period of narration.

caw
 

Susannah Shepherd

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What period are you writing? One way might be to look at contemporary novels (i.e. those that were written at the time your own novel is set) and get some style inspiration from those.

That technique doesn't work quite so well for anything set earlier than the 18th century, though, as the style of novel we take for granted today (narrative and dialogue) is a surprisingly late development, at least in English.

Another resource I find helpful is this historical thesaurus: it tells you the date at which particular words have come into use and gives dates for synonyms as well. If you have access to the Oxford English Dictionary, it will also give you the history of usage.
 

LeftyLucy

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There are "Writer's Guide" books to different time periods that can be helpful.

For my historical WIP, I looked at letters, diaries and other written resources from the time. Using the theme and circumstances of my novel as a guide, I especially researched when certain words came into common usage, and researched social norms. My WIP deals heavily with race issues, so I did a lot of research to understand which race-based terminology was in use at the time, and also what exposure a typical person like my narrator would have had to people of different races.

This is just my personal preference and I definitely don't have anything to base it on, but my feeling about writing the dialogue was that getting it "right" had more to do with the things my characters talk about than it did with the words they use. Even if you're writing a time period that has very distinctive verbiage or sentence construction, I think that you may not want to be fully accurate to that because it might not be accessible to your reader. So pick one or two distinctive markers for the voice, and then make sure they're talking about the right things.
 

Cindyt

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Read novels written during your era and do research. I use just a seasoning, words like ye, atall, ahungred, afrightened, morrow, or ascared--anything that can take an "a" prefix. I also incorporate the right words for foods, like "wafer" for cookie and "fritter" for fried dough pastries, which are donuts without the hole. Finger food and deserts are dainties. I'll shut up now.

Oh, BTW unless your novel is set after 1840, I wouldn't advise using "okay." Lol.
 
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Dutchess_of_Hyrule

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Thank you all for your help. My novel takes place in 1958. :) So I don't think it's that different from the English language today.
 

Asha Leu

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It all depends on the era. Anything that's set earlier than late-medieval times or in a non-English speaking country is going to be using a translation convention to some extent anyway, so its much more about establishing the vibe of the era and not breaking a reader's suspension of disbelief rather than going for strict accuracy (as that would be more-or-less incomprehensible). I echo what others have said above about using period-appropriate language as a light seasoning and avoiding blatant anachronisms and Ye Olde Butchered English. Reading (good) historical fiction set within that era will also help.

But for a book set in 1958? Well, that makes your task both much easier and harder. Easier, because language hasn't changed too much in fifty years and you have a plethora of books, plays, films and television programs made during that era to use as reference guides (not too mention many people who actually lived through that time.) Harder, because the much wider range of available material (and potential readers who remember the era) means you have no excuse for getting it wrong, and because the differences in language are often in the subtle details.

Just work on absorbing as much material from that era as possible, and you should be fine - I'd reccomend stuff actually written or filmed in the 50s, rather than simply set in the time period, and non-fiction/documentaries/interviews/transcripts/etc would probably be more accurate than actual fiction - though, at the same time, good dialogue in fiction is rarely completely true-to-life, so there's always going to be an element of personal taste and judgement in how you use it. And no matter when something is set, vernaculars always differ depending on location, culture, class, and a myriad other factors.
 
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blacbird

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1958 doesn't strike me as particularly "historical", but maybe that's just me. But for heaven's sake, there are a bazillion movies made in and about that era. And TV shows. Go watch some.

And some quick facts about 1958, or its immediate temporal environs:

It was Cold War time, U.S. v. Communism.
You still dialed a telephone. And public telephone booths were everywhere.
Most TV was still in black-and-white.
Young rock stars Buddy Holly, Richie Valens and J.D. Richardson were killed in a plane crash in February of that year, the Day the Music Died.
Elvis was still thin.
The Beatles didn't exist. Bob Dylan was 17, and still known as Robert Zimmerman.
In Major League Baseball, the Dodgers were still in Brooklyn, the Giants still in New York and the Braves still in Milwaukee.
Soda fountains were popular hangouts for teenagers.
The car you really wanted was a robin's-egg-blue and cream-colored 1957 Chevy. With neat tail fins.
The nation of Vietnam existed, but the American public didn't know that.
The Russians had just managed to launch the first artificial satellites, the Sputniks. The U.S. was thoroughly embarrassed and desperate to catch up.
U.S. dimes and quarters were still made of real silver.
Legally-enforced racial segregation still existed and dominated society in the southeastern states of the U.S., but the situation had become restive, especially in Arkansas.
Westerns were the most popular TV shows.
The cultural outsiders were "beatniks"; among writers those included Allen Ginsburg, Jack Kerouac, Lawrence Ferlinghetti.
Playboy magazine was the most shocking publication legally available.
You could still get your feet X-rayed at a shoe store to see what shoes would fit.
Cigarettes were about the most widely-advertised product on TV and elsewhere.
Charles Starkweather terrified the Midwest with his murder spree odyssey.
The U.S. 1-cent piece still had stylized wheat stalks on the back.
The biggest baseball stars were Mickey Mantle, Willie Mays, Henry Aaron, Yogi Berra, Ted Williams, Stan Musial.
A cup of coffee cost no more than a quarter, and you could get it black, or with cream and/or sugar. That was it, for choices.
No Japanese cars were sold in the U.S. You wanted a "foreign" car, you got a Volkswagen.
The most popular dog breed was the collie, thanks to the TV show "Lassie".
The most popular movie actor was almost certainly John Wayne.
If you were a guy, what you wanted to groom your hair was Brylcreem ("a little dab'll do ya, Brylcreem, you'll look so debonair")
Roller-skating rinks were a big deal for teenagers. Along with drive-in movies.
Milton Berle was considered funny. (No one today can possibly understand or explain this.)
At the beginning of the year, there were only 48 states. Alaska and Hawaii were admitted shortly after.
Seat belts in cars were a new thing, and wearing them was only an option. Only jerks and dumbshits did that.
Dual car headlights were new that year, I believe. And considered very "cool".
To great fanfare, Ford produced the Edsel that year.
Everybody in the U.S. was happy . . . at least that's the image passed down to us, now half-a-century and more beyond.

caw
 

BethS

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I was born that year! Historical indeed :granny:

Damned whippersnappers...

The decade I was born in cannot possibly be now considered historical fiction...
 

Dutchess_of_Hyrule

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1958 doesn't strike me as particularly "historical", but maybe that's just me. But for heaven's sake, there are a bazillion movies made in and about that era. And TV shows. Go watch some.

And some quick facts about 1958, or its immediate temporal environs:

It was Cold War time, U.S. v. Communism.
You still dialed a telephone. And public telephone booths were everywhere.
Most TV was still in black-and-white.
Young rock stars Buddy Holly, Richie Valens and J.D. Richardson were killed in a plane crash in February of that year, the Day the Music Died.
Elvis was still thin.
The Beatles didn't exist. Bob Dylan was 17, and still known as Robert Zimmerman.
In Major League Baseball, the Dodgers were still in Brooklyn, the Giants still in New York and the Braves still in Milwaukee.
Soda fountains were popular hangouts for teenagers.
The car you really wanted was a robin's-egg-blue and cream-colored 1957 Chevy. With neat tail fins.
The nation of Vietnam existed, but the American public didn't know that.
The Russians had just managed to launch the first artificial satellites, the Sputniks. The U.S. was thoroughly embarrassed and desperate to catch up.
U.S. dimes and quarters were still made of real silver.
Legally-enforced racial segregation still existed and dominated society in the southeastern states of the U.S., but the situation had become restive, especially in Arkansas.
Westerns were the most popular TV shows.
The cultural outsiders were "beatniks"; among writers those included Allen Ginsburg, Jack Kerouac, Lawrence Ferlinghetti.
Playboy magazine was the most shocking publication legally available.
You could still get your feet X-rayed at a shoe store to see what shoes would fit.
Cigarettes were about the most widely-advertised product on TV and elsewhere.
Charles Starkweather terrified the Midwest with his murder spree odyssey.
The U.S. 1-cent piece still had stylized wheat stalks on the back.
The biggest baseball stars were Mickey Mantle, Willie Mays, Henry Aaron, Yogi Berra, Ted Williams, Stan Musial.
A cup of coffee cost no more than a quarter, and you could get it black, or with cream and/or sugar. That was it, for choices.
No Japanese cars were sold in the U.S. You wanted a "foreign" car, you got a Volkswagen.
The most popular dog breed was the collie, thanks to the TV show "Lassie".
The most popular movie actor was almost certainly John Wayne.
If you were a guy, what you wanted to groom your hair was Brylcreem ("a little dab'll do ya, Brylcreem, you'll look so debonair")
Roller-skating rinks were a big deal for teenagers. Along with drive-in movies.
Milton Berle was considered funny. (No one today can possibly understand or explain this.)
At the beginning of the year, there were only 48 states. Alaska and Hawaii were admitted shortly after.
Seat belts in cars were a new thing, and wearing them was only an option. Only jerks and dumbshits did that.
Dual car headlights were new that year, I believe. And considered very "cool".
To great fanfare, Ford produced the Edsel that year.
Everybody in the U.S. was happy . . . at least that's the image passed down to us, now half-a-century and more beyond.

caw

Thank you for the list you wrote up. From the research I've done so far, I was pleasantly surprised to find out something new. :) thank you once again!
 

BenPanced

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But for a book set in 1958? Well, that makes your task both much easier and harder. Easier, because language hasn't changed too much in fifty years and you have a plethora of books, plays, films and television programs made during that era to use as reference guides (not too mention many people who actually lived through that time.) Harder, because the much wider range of available material (and potential readers who remember the era) means you have no excuse for getting it wrong, and because the differences in language are often in the subtle details.

(bolding mine)

This. I remember when the 50s nostalgia during the early to mid 70s hit, particularly with the TV show Happy Days. My mother, born in 1944, regularly cringed and muttered at the TV how everything portrayed in the series was stilted to inaccurate to flat out wrong: the hair, the music, the clothes, the dialogue/slang/vernacular, the dancing, you name it. While the series was set in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, the upper midwest of the United States, it had that "California twang" because the cast, writers, and crew were set in Los Angeles and had their own set of nostalgia that colored everything. (The one movie she's said that's one of the more accurate, even though there are a few misfires, was the original not-musical Hairspray.)

The trouble with nostalgia and many period pieces is everything from a particular era generally gets lumped together, which is why in a movie set in 1982 you'll hear music from 1983 and 1985 on the soundtrack; it's all from the 80s, so what? Big deal. Never mind fads and styles change on an hourly basis, but it's all the 80s. Also, as mentioned above, different regions had different perceptions of current pop culture so what was well-known and popular in, say, Chicago, certainly may not have made its way to Miami and what was known in Miami certainly could have changed along the way it was being imported to Los Angeles (East Coast/West Coast versions of punk, anybody?)
 

mccardey

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Also, as mentioned above, different regions had different perceptions of current pop culture so what was well-known and popular in, say, Chicago, certainly may not have made its way to Miami and what was known in Miami certainly could have changed along the way it was being imported to Los Angeles (East Coast/West Coast versions of punk, anybody?)
And don't let's get started on whole different countries...
 

ULTRAGOTHA

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One thing to AVOID is phrases, words, ideas, etc that came into being after 1958.
 
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