I'm not sure I understand how this story, as admirable and commendable as it is, makes a recommendation for submitting stuff to anyplace that "accepts anything".
caw
The One That Won't Sell
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I'm not sure I understand how this story, as admirable and commendable as it is, makes a recommendation for submitting stuff to anyplace that "accepts anything".
caw
Yup, and there's a lot of guys out there who'd love to marry a supermodel, but don't have a snowball's chance in hell of doing so. Will they remain single until the day they die?
Let's say you write a novel and really have high hopes it will be published by Tor. They quickly reject it, along with your second, third, fourth, and fifth choices, but then a small, lesser known publisher makes you an offer, likely for less money, likely they have less of a marketing budget for your book. Do you say no thanks and just throw your novel away?
If you're not willing to take your story to a "lower-tier" market after it's been rejected by all your first choices, then toss the story, forget about it, and start writing the next one. The end.
Wow, what an informative thread. Reminds me that I must never stop asking myself why I write stories, and why I'm writing my current WIP. What do I want to happen?
One answer is that I want to find a wider audience for my storytelling than family and friends. Another is that I enjoy the journey more than the destination, because the destination is frequently The One That Won't Sell...
This thread also reminds me of the relationship of quality to quantity. It applies to self-publishing as well as finding a print or on-line publisher. At Amazon, for example, my stories, poetry, essays and how-to guides are very small needles in a very large haystack. The quantity of other e-books similar to mine is the first hurdle in getting someone to buy my e-book. When they find my e-book at Amazon, the quality of my writing had better shine, or they'll click somewhere else.
One answer is that I want to find a wider audience for my storytelling than family and friends. Another is that I enjoy the journey more than the destination, because the destination is frequently The One That Won't Sell...
This thread also reminds me of the relationship of quality to quantity. It applies to self-publishing as well as finding a print or on-line publisher. At Amazon, for example, my stories, poetry, essays and how-to guides are very small needles in a very large haystack. The quantity of other e-books similar to mine is the first hurdle in getting someone to buy my e-book. When they find my e-book at Amazon, the quality of my writing had better shine, or they'll click somewhere else.
You giving up far, far too soon. I've made some of my best, biggest, and most lucrative sales after two dozen or more rejections. As long as there's a possible market, giving up on a story is a bad way to succeed. I've seen stories rejected several dozen time, and then sell to a top magazine. Heinlein's Rules work. They simply work, if you follow all five, and don't let anyone talk you out of doing so. Many will argue these rules to death, especially rule two. Ignore these people. They know not what they do. Read this, all of it, and believe it. http://www.sfwriter.com/ow05.htm
As for early stuff being bad, everyone says this, so it must be true. But if it is true, how do explain the hige number of very first short stories that sell? Or the number of first novels that sell? If you write with the attitude that your early stuff will automatically be bad, it will probably be bad. If you write with the attitude that it's going to be good, it will, if you have talent, and are an experienced reader, be pretty darned good, even if it doesn't sell. But a lot of it will sell, again, if you have talent.
My experience is that talent usually shows up early, or it doesn't show up at all. But here's the thing. If you follow all five of Heinlein's Rules, you don't have to worry about it. You need have no faith in your short stories, as long as you have faith in the rules. Rule four is "You must put your story on the market." Rule five is, "You must keep it there until it sells." It's just this simple.
Break these rules and you may still succeed, but doing so is far less likely. The funny thing is that even those who argue against the rules follow them when they make a sale. Follow the rules, and your chances of succeeding go up dramatically. But you probably can't make yourself follow all five. They're incredibly simple rules. They almost ridiculously simple. But from my experience, only about one writer in a hundred can actually follow all five for any length of time. The other ninety-nine find all sorts of excuse not to follow them. But any story you sell probably follows all five rules. Sawyer adds a sixth rule that's equally simple, and equally important, but few can follow it, either.
http://www.sfwriter.com/ow05.htm
Heinlein's Rules work for you, James. But they don't work for everyone. As is always the case with writing, we all have to find our own path.
If I'd followed them I wouldn't have been published nearly so often as I have. I don't finish pieces which don't work. I do rewrite when I'm given good advice on how to make a piece work better, even if I don't have a deal in place for it. And I usually go on to sell those works.
It's true that some first short stories sell, and some first novels. But if you take the number of first novels which do sell, and compare that to the number of first novels which fail to sell, you'll see that the first set is only a tiny percentage compared to the second.
Do you have a source for this claim, James?
Show me anyone who sold a story without following Heinlein's rules. Just one person. Including you. Which of his rules did you break with that first sale? Did you write it? Did you finish it? Did you get it the way you wanted, stopped tinkering, and submit it? Did you keep submitting it until it sold?
As for a source, just my experience, and the experience of hundreds of pro writers who also know and follow Heinlein's Rules, including, but certainly not limited to Robert J. Sawyer. Source list? You mean source as in what? The source is darned near every pro writer I've ever know, and most of the editors.
Heinlein's Rules give any writer the best possible chance of success, and I simply don't know more than two or three pro writers who haven't followed them, even if they've never heard of them. How can you possibly succeed without writing? How can you sell something unless you finish it? On and on.
The simple fact is that somewhere around ninety percent of all who try writing will fail completely. They will never sell anything to a paying market. Most of these writer fail right on rule one. They simply don't write very much, very often at all.
I didn't make up these stats. Go argue wit Robert J.. Sawyer, and all the other big name pros who repeat them.
Heinlein's Rule work. Period. All the naysayers in the world won't stop them from working, or stop not following them from failing.
The funny thing is that it's almost impossible to sell a story without falling all five rules, even if you don't know the rules. There must be some way of doing so, but I have no idea how you could go about it. The question is only how often you follow the rules, not whether they work. Of course they work, no matter who you are. How else can you sell a story, other than by doing these five things?
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The story I had in mind when I started this thread? I sold it. Granted, it was heavily edited and changed, but I sold it. It'll get published in a few weeks.
Short fiction that won't sell...so basically everything I've written so far?
All joking aside, I'm inexperienced with short fiction publishing as of yet, as I've only really gotten serious with it recently, but I'd imagine that, after a dozen rejections, I'd just move onto something else. My mind is racing with so many different ideas that I'd be unable to sit still with one after it seems that everyone hates it.
Also, congrats on selling your story! That's incredible!
All joking aside, I'm inexperienced with short fiction publishing as of yet, as I've only really gotten serious with it recently, but I'd imagine that, after a dozen rejections, I'd just move onto something else. My mind is racing with so many different ideas that I'd be unable to sit still with one after it seems that everyone hates it.
Also, congrats on selling your story! That's incredible!
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