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Thread: Incorgnito Publishing Press

  1. #1
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
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    Publisher

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Travis, I've had a bit of a look around the internet and the only names I've found linked with Zharmae's management are you and Michael Conant. Is Mr Conant "the board" which has apparently asked you to focus on your duties as Executive Director for TRGM Holdings? (I see that TRGM Holdings is Travis Robert Grundy Marshall Holdings LLC: it's odd that your board would vote you out like that, seeing as it seems you're almost all the company.)

    An aside: Mr Conant is apparently the president and publisher for Incorgnito Publishing Press [sic] despite having no experience in publishing that I can see. The Incorgnito website is peppered with errors, which never bodes well for a publisher.



    I spent most of my working career in NYC where I embraced a reputation for calling people out and for my lack of political acumen so I will be short. And, if you find a mistake on our web site (don't do much with it nowadays), be champ and point them out or just be a complainer. Up to you.

    Over twenty-five years of publishing experience not including three years of book publishing experience with Travis starting with his first published book. Learned a lot, still learning. Still making mistakes. Look for our authors on Ovation Television mini-series, national book signing tour, presentations at Rotary clubs, Frankfurt Book Fair, BEA (2015, we skipped 2016), Business Wire and PR Wire releases, as calling cards for business leaders or wherever and however we can try and find each book their unique tipping point. Three million books (more) on Amazon sell 200 copies or less. This is not a business for the weak of heart or the instant millionaire.

    Oh, and yes, we did take on a few Zharmae authors. Would have taken them all if I had the resources to fit them all in. Nowhere near big enough for that...yet!
    Best of luck to all.

    Google us if you care.

  2. #2
    Not as sweet as you think Aggy B.'s Avatar
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    Yeah. Defensive and confrontational is what I look for in a potential publisher.
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  3. #3
    a demon for tea EMaree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    I spent most of my working career in NYC where I embraced a reputation for calling people out and for my lack of political acumen so I will be short. And, if you find a mistake on our web site (don't do much with it nowadays), be champ and point them out or just be a complainer. Up to you.

    Over twenty-five years of publishing experience not including three years of book publishing experience with Travis starting with his first published book. Learned a lot, still learning. Still making mistakes. Look for our authors on Ovation Television mini-series, national book signing tour, presentations at Rotary clubs, Frankfurt Book Fair, BEA (2015, we skipped 2016), Business Wire and PR Wire releases, as calling cards for business leaders or wherever and however we can try and find each book their unique tipping point. Three million books (more) on Amazon sell 200 copies or less. This is not a business for the weak of heart or the instant millionaire.

    Oh, and yes, we did take on a few Zharmae authors. Would have taken them all if I had the resources to fit them all in. Nowhere near big enough for that...yet!
    Best of luck to all.

    Google us if you care.
    Hm. Well.

    Hello there, Zharmae 2.0.
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    I'm NaNoWriMo-ing!

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  4. #4
    Christine Tripp ctripp's Avatar
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    Three million books (more) on Amazon sell 200 copies or less. This is not a business for the weak of heart or the instant millionaire.
    Forgot to mention those are not commercially publishing books

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    I spent most of my working career in NYC where I embraced a reputation for calling people out and for my lack of political acumen so I will be short. And, if you find a mistake on our web site (don't do much with it nowadays), be champ and point them out or just be a complainer. Up to you.

    Over twenty-five years of publishing experience not including three years of book publishing experience with Travis starting with his first published book. Learned a lot, still learning. Still making mistakes. Look for our authors on Ovation Television mini-series, national book signing tour, presentations at Rotary clubs, Frankfurt Book Fair, BEA (2015, we skipped 2016), Business Wire and PR Wire releases, as calling cards for business leaders or wherever and however we can try and find each book their unique tipping point. Three million books (more) on Amazon sell 200 copies or less. This is not a business for the weak of heart or the instant millionaire.

    Oh, and yes, we did take on a few Zharmae authors. Would have taken them all if I had the resources to fit them all in. Nowhere near big enough for that...yet!
    Best of luck to all.

    Google us if you care.

    Can I ask why you would have taken on all of the Zharmae authors? Would it have been a favor to Travis? Or because you think the books are market ready and unrealized revenue streams? Given the lack of upfront money dedicated to the existing Zharmae line (no advances, no upfront paying of service providers, etc.) it seems like it would be fairly cheap to pick up all of the books if the authors were up for it.

    It's not a business for the weak of heart or the instant millionaire. It's also not for people who think they've recreated the wheel and are going to be successful using strategies that are universally challenged by people with real experience in the industry.

  6. #6
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    I spent most of my working career in NYC where I embraced a reputation for calling people out and for my lack of political acumen so I will be short. And, if you find a mistake on our web site (don't do much with it nowadays), be champ and point them out or just be a complainer. Up to you.
    I spent most of my working career in London, NYC, and various other cities. I'm not sure why this is appropriate to this thread, but there you go.

    I've just clicked on three different pages from your site and have found mistakes on every page I visited.

    http://www.incorgnitobooks.com/rights-and-permissions/

    For country or language specific rights acquisition please email us at:[redacted]
    For permission to reprint part of one of our author’s works, please email us at: [redacted]
    http://www.incorgnitobooks.com/our-story/

    By the time our first book was out, we had set the schedule for the year. Our goal, from the beginning, was to represent author’s works that quite simply entertain us.
    http://www.incorgnitobooks.com/distribution/

    Incorgnito Publishing Press books are distributed through Ingram and direct on Amazon through Kindle Direct Publishing. Our books are also available direct from the publisher at our Website at: www.incorgnitobooks.com.
    I am not going to error-check your entire website for you, because I only do that for friends, or for paying clients; and because it's your responsibility to ensure your website is clean and tidy, not mine.

    Over twenty-five years of publishing experience not including three years of book publishing experience with Travis starting with his first published book. Learned a lot, still learning. Still making mistakes.
    I don't doubt you're still learning. We all are.

    Your LinkedIn page doesn't mention any time spent in trade publishing, apart from your time with Zharmae and Incorgnito. And trade publishing is a lot different to other forms of publishing (I've worked in computer games publishing, music publishing, and newspaper publishing in addition to trade publishing).

    Look for our authors on Ovation Television mini-series, national book signing tour, presentations at Rotary clubs, Frankfurt Book Fair, BEA (2015, we skipped 2016), Business Wire and PR Wire releases, as calling cards for business leaders or wherever and however we can try and find each book their unique tipping point.
    The Ovation mini-series deal appears to have been made by the authors' agent, Jon Levin at CAA. It wasn't Incorgnito's efforts which made it happen, as far as I can see.

    I don't think you have full bookshop distribution, so I'm not convinced that those book signing tours are going to do your authors much good, I'm afraid. And if those signing tours aren't combined with strong press and media coverage, again, they're not going to be effective.

    My mother in law has made presentations at Rotary clubs. It's not difficult to get a spot. It's not the most effective way to sell a decent number of books.

    The Frankfurt Book Fair is a rights fair, and not a place for authors to attend. But as your authors did attend, how many of them made any foreign and subsidiary rights deals as a result of their attendance there?

    It's pretty run-of-the-mill to issue press releases, in various different ways.

    What I see here is ordinary things which are within the reach of everyone. Not good strong stuff which a good publisher would do.

    Three million books (more) on Amazon sell 200 copies or less. This is not a business for the weak of heart or the instant millionaire.
    But books from good trade publishers routinely sell far more than that, and the low sales figures of those books is not a justification for any publishers' lack of performance.

    Oh, and yes, we did take on a few Zharmae authors. Would have taken them all if I had the resources to fit them all in. Nowhere near big enough for that...yet!
    Best of luck to all.

    Google us if you care.
    Ah. So when Travis told us this,

    Quote Originally Posted by traveo2343 View Post
    We are very lucky in that TZPP'social closure is orderly and will take several months. We are not filing bankruptcy nor are we in any such risk. All authors have, at this point received reversion letters which are effective 31 August 2016. A select few have asked us to broker a sale of their contracts to other publishers which we are supporting, at the author's request.
    were you the publisher which he was selling rights on to?

    Travis also wrote this:

    Quote Originally Posted by traveo2343 View Post
    Michael was released from contract in 2014. We are not affiliated with Michael or Incorgnito Publishing. Michael is not a member of either board.
    If you're taking on some of his authors then Zharmae is affiliated with you. I wonder why he didn't make that clear.

  7. #7
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    Welcome to the new boss, same as the old boss.

    Not sure if we need to start a new thread or just rename this one.


  8. #8
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    What I figured

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Travis, I've had a bit of a look around the internet and the only names I've found linked with Zharmae's management are you and Michael Conant. Is Mr Conant "the board" which has apparently asked you to focus on your duties as Executive Director for TRGM Holdings? (I see that TRGM Holdings is Travis Robert Grundy Marshall Holdings LLC: it's odd that your board would vote you out like that, seeing as it seems you're almost all the company.)

    An aside: Mr Conant is apparently the president and publisher for Incorgnito Publishing Press [sic] despite having no experience in publishing that I can see. The Incorgnito website is peppered with errors, which never bodes well for a publisher.




    Old Hack you really just are a negative person. At least here. All you do is point out what you perceive is or is not real and side with the negative aspects. I don't have time to argue with you. Most of what you wrote is just plain wrong and uninformed. Oh hang on, my author who is waisting his time on the national book tour is on TMZ... ok back.

    I said I was short in response deliberately. So those who found it defensive or Zharmae 2.0 blah blah blah.... I don't care. That is my nature. My authors appreciate my bluntness and my support. And if you don't like giving up movie rights and tv, then don't do it. Good luck to you. No one forces you to sign a contract. Contracts are negotiations. And we all have our sticking points. It never bothers me for an author to say no I won't give up those rights. I simply say got it and good luck and we both move on. That makes neither the author nor the publisher an ogre. It's business people!! The moment you put your painting on the street with a for sale sign, you're not simply an artist, you're a business person. So act like one.

    If somene wants to talk business of publishing or related topics, I will check back. But if you just want to attack, go for it and have great time playing with yourself cause I ain't into that game.

    Was that too blunt??

  9. #9
    E Conchis Omnia Helix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    Old Hack you really just are a negative person. At least here. All you do is point out what you perceive is or is not real and side with the negative aspects. I don't have time to argue with you. Most of what you wrote is just plain wrong and uninformed. Oh hang on, my author who is waisting his time on the national book tour is on TMZ... ok back.

    I said I was short in response deliberately. So those who found it defensive or Zharmae 2.0 blah blah blah.... I don't care. That is my nature. My authors appreciate my bluntness and my support. And if you don't like giving up movie rights and tv, then don't do it. Good luck to you. No one forces you to sign a contract. Contracts are negotiations. And we all have our sticking points. It never bothers me for an author to say no I won't give up those rights. I simply say got it and good luck and we both move on. That makes neither the author nor the publisher an ogre. It's business people!! The moment you put your painting on the street with a for sale sign, you're not simply an artist, you're a business person. So act like one.

    If somene wants to talk business of publishing or related topics, I will check back. But if you just want to attack, go for it and have great time playing with yourself cause I ain't into that game.

    Was that too blunt??

    Not so much blunt as evasive.
    She was warned. She was given an explanation. Nevertheless, she persisted.

  10. #10
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    and poorly written.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post

    If somene wants to talk business of publishing or related topics, I will check back. But if you just want to attack, go for it and have great time playing with yourself cause I ain't into that game.

    Was that too blunt??
    Believe me, I've got zero problems with bluntness.

    That said, I asked some questions about the business of publishing, specifically how it related to Incorgnito and the crew of Zharmae authors.

  12. #12
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    ctripp

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Travis, I've had a bit of a look around the internet and the only names I've found linked with Zharmae's management are you and Michael Conant. Is Mr Conant "the board" which has apparently asked you to focus on your duties as Executive Director for TRGM Holdings? (I see that TRGM Holdings is Travis Robert Grundy Marshall Holdings LLC: it's odd that your board would vote you out like that, seeing as it seems you're almost all the company.)

    An aside: Mr Conant is apparently the president and publisher for Incorgnito Publishing Press [sic] despite having no experience in publishing that I can see. The Incorgnito website is peppered with errors, which never bodes well for a publisher.



    ctripp - legitimate question or point so didn't want to ignore you. Just trying to get way from the theme of this thread. Here is my opinion on that business aspect.

    It matters little if they are commercially published works. Technology has done some wonderful things. For music and publishing, it has made it possible for anyone to create and commercially offer their work without subscribing to the established norm. The downside to that is that it has enabled anyone to offer their work commercially without subscribing to the established norm. What I mean by that is the filter has been removed along with the barrier to access. Some will say the filter has been shifted to the individual consumer directly. Maybe. Maybe we just look for a different set of influencers.

    Regardless, every book, wait maybe not regardless. Maybe more because of this shift, every book on Amazon is in competition with every other book. The commercialness (oops did I make that up) has little bearing as all 3 million books (not an exact amount) are being sold in the same place to the same audience. And it affects every author out there. I would argue that small publishers are affected even greater because we are not that far above the food chain from self-publishing; at least not in the beginning stages perhaps.

    Whether you are self-publishing or using a small press, the trick is to be heard above all this barrier breaking noise. That is no small feat. You can have a great book and do all the things everyone tells you to do (and that you may pay to hear) and still sell 200 copies. I believe there is that tipping point out there and that it takes a lot of work and patience to stick around for that point to find you (you can't create a tipping point).

    As a publisher, I try to help that along by picking books that have a better commercial chance of finding their place. That might include taking on a seires that is looking for a TV deal (Old Hack wrongly reffered to this) and hoping it is found. The book enhances that deal and visa versa if it happens. I also may pick books that have a place that is not going to put them on the national scene (maybe they will) but will get the author some publicity and some sales (such as the author who Old Hack said wastes his time at Rotary clubs - he makes about $1500 a month). My point there is you take advantage of what the book and author have to offer and make the biggest splash with that as you can.

    Hope this wasn't too long an answer.

  13. #13
    Now with more stubble VeryBigBeard's Avatar
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    I'm looking up Incorgnito's books on Amazon and, man, it's an experience. The ones I've looked inside so far reveal that there is a reason for the poor sales rankings, shall we say. I also get this gem, from a review of Taimak:

    3- Amazingly on pages 101/102 there is a couple of paragraphs of missing text? This is due to the publisher putting a photograph over it. How this was not noticed before printing is beyond me. Publishers reply was that the mistake makes the book more collectable. Really?
    To which a "Michael Conant" has decided to commit the Author's Big Mistake, tearing into the reviewer in one, massive, grammatically-challenged paragraph.

    Numerous other reviews of various Incorgnito books mention the need for a copy-editor. Editorial reviews come from a paid review service. Yuck.

    Basically, you're publishing books badly. If I may be so blunt.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by VeryBigBeard View Post

    Basically, you're publishing books badly. If I may be so blunt.
    He says he likes blunt.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    It matters little if they are commercially published works. Technology has done some wonderful things. For music and publishing, it has made it possible for anyone to create and commercially offer their work without subscribing to the established norm. The downside to that is that it has enabled anyone to offer their work commercially without subscribing to the established norm. What I mean by that is the filter has been removed along with the barrier to access. Some will say the filter has been shifted to the individual consumer directly. Maybe. Maybe we just look for a different set of influencers.

    Regardless, every book, wait maybe not regardless. Maybe more because of this shift, every book on Amazon is in competition with every other book. The commercialness (oops did I make that up) has little bearing as all 3 million books (not an exact amount) are being sold in the same place to the same audience. And it affects every author out there. I would argue that small publishers are affected even greater because we are not that far above the food chain from self-publishing; at least not in the beginning stages perhaps.

    Whether you are self-publishing or using a small press, the trick is to be heard above all this barrier breaking noise. That is no small feat. You can have a great book and do all the things everyone tells you to do (and that you may pay to hear) and still sell 200 copies. I believe there is that tipping point out there and that it takes a lot of work and patience to stick around for that point to find you (you can't create a tipping point).

    As a publisher, I try to help that along by picking books that have a better commercial chance of finding their place. That might include taking on a seires that is looking for a TV deal (Old Hack wrongly reffered to this) and hoping it is found. The book enhances that deal and visa versa if it happens. I also may pick books that have a place that is not going to put them on the national scene (maybe they will) but will get the author some publicity and some sales (such as the author who Old Hack said wastes his time at Rotary clubs - he makes about $1500 a month). My point there is you take advantage of what the book and author have to offer and make the biggest splash with that as you can.

    Hope this wasn't too long an answer.
    After reading and re-reading this, I have to tell you--forgive me I'm going to be blunt--this is a ridiculous assertion.

    "Every book on Amazon is in competition with every other book" is like saying, "Major League Baseball players are in competition with Little League Baseball players because they both play baseball."

    The implication behind "commercially published" is that it was published by a company who (a) knows what they're doing, (b) has the resources and capital to do it correctly, and (c) knows the marketplace. You're right that you can write off plenty of the self-published and micro presses who have books listed on Amazon. But if you're a businessman who has any interest in keeping the lights on, collecting a salary, and growing a company, swimming in THAT pool of poorly published books is nothing to be proud of and will lead to the same drowning.

    One of the things Travis refused to do was listen to the things people were telling him to do if he wanted to make a serious go of it with Zharmae. The new models, the tweaked contract, the ponzi structure--none of that was ever going to result in success. The important things like, print ARCs, establish relationship with brick and mortar book stores, put out quality books that get the attention and respect of the book reviewing media were completely ignored. Do you plan on working differently? Or are you going to keep the same course?

    You don't seem impressed with selling 200 copies. That's good, because a publisher will lose a shitload of money if all they manage to sell is 200 copies. But what is your goal? How many copies, on average, will it take for you to consider a book a success?

  16. #16
    practical experience, FTW Anarchic Q's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    Oh hang on, my author who is waisting his time on the national book tour is on TMZ... ok back.
    Don't humble brag, it's not impressive, nor is it cute.
    Do Not Tamper With - My Writing, Art & Reviews Blog
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchic Q View Post
    Don't humble brag, it's not impressive, nor is it cute.
    It's not very good publicity either if the author isn't named.
    She was warned. She was given an explanation. Nevertheless, she persisted.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    Old Hack you really just are a negative person. At least here. All you do is point out what you perceive is or is not real and side with the negative aspects. I don't have time to argue with you. Most of what you wrote is just plain wrong and uninformed. Oh hang on, my author who is waisting his time on the national book tour is on TMZ... ok back.
    That's not acceptable here.

    One more crack like that and you will no longer be posting here.

    Old Hack has been writing, editing and working in publishing for quite a while.

    She's a professional.

    She knows what she's talking about.

    You don't.

    You're barely literate. It's wasting. Not waisting.

    If a blind dyslexic can spot your typos, never mind subject-verb agreement issues, you'd best reconsider your choice of profession.
    Last edited by AW Admin; 09-04-2016 at 11:06 PM.

  19. #19
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    Old Hack you really just are a negative person. At least here. All you do is point out what you perceive is or is not real and side with the negative aspects. I don't have time to argue with you. Most of what you wrote is just plain wrong and uninformed.
    You're right, I have been very negative in this thread. But that's because there's so much to be negative about. Zharmae published too many books, published them badly, did bugger-all in the way of effective promotion, and its pay structure was such that the people doing the real work for them--the writers, editors, artists, designers--bore all the risk of the business. What's to be positive about that?

    If you've found anything "plain wrong and uninformed" about my posts then do please explain what, specifically, I've got wrong.

    Oh hang on, my author who is waisting his time on the national book tour is on TMZ... ok back.
    I think you meant "wasting". The rest of that sentence is barely literate.

    If you do have an author on TMZ, I hope his or her books are widely available through physical bookshops. Because if you don't, there will be very little sales benefit. Do you have full bookshop distribution? I don't think so. But do correct me if I'm wrong.

    I said I was short in response deliberately. So those who found it defensive or Zharmae 2.0 blah blah blah.... I don't care. That is my nature. My authors appreciate my bluntness and my support. And if you don't like giving up movie rights and tv, then don't do it. Good luck to you. No one forces you to sign a contract. Contracts are negotiations. And we all have our sticking points. It never bothers me for an author to say no I won't give up those rights. I simply say got it and good luck and we both move on. That makes neither the author nor the publisher an ogre. It's business people!! The moment you put your painting on the street with a for sale sign, you're not simply an artist, you're a business person. So act like one.
    Contracts are negotiations. And few good publishers rights-grab the TV and movie rights from their authors. I wouldn't sign such a contract, and I'd advise others not to, too.

    If somene wants to talk business of publishing or related topics, I will check back. But if you just want to attack, go for it and have great time playing with yourself cause I ain't into that game.

    Was that too blunt??
    You're not being too blunt at all, Michael. And you're giving us a very clear indication of the levels of professionalism we can expect to see from your publishing company. It's very useful and kind of you to do so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    ctripp - legitimate question or point so didn't want to ignore you. Just trying to get way from the theme of this thread. Here is my opinion on that business aspect.

    It matters little if they are commercially published works. Technology has done some wonderful things. For music and publishing, it has made it possible for anyone to create and commercially offer their work without subscribing to the established norm. The downside to that is that it has enabled anyone to offer their work commercially without subscribing to the established norm. What I mean by that is the filter has been removed along with the barrier to access. Some will say the filter has been shifted to the individual consumer directly. Maybe. Maybe we just look for a different set of influencers.

    Regardless, every book, wait maybe not regardless. Maybe more because of this shift, every book on Amazon is in competition with every other book. The commercialness (oops did I make that up) has little bearing as all 3 million books (not an exact amount) are being sold in the same place to the same audience. And it affects every author out there. I would argue that small publishers are affected even greater because we are not that far above the food chain from self-publishing; at least not in the beginning stages perhaps.

    Whether you are self-publishing or using a small press, the trick is to be heard above all this barrier breaking noise. That is no small feat. You can have a great book and do all the things everyone tells you to do (and that you may pay to hear) and still sell 200 copies. I believe there is that tipping point out there and that it takes a lot of work and patience to stick around for that point to find you (you can't create a tipping point).

    As a publisher, I try to help that along by picking books that have a better commercial chance of finding their place. That might include taking on a seires that is looking for a TV deal (Old Hack wrongly reffered to this) and hoping it is found. The book enhances that deal and visa versa if it happens. I also may pick books that have a place that is not going to put them on the national scene (maybe they will) but will get the author some publicity and some sales (such as the author who Old Hack said wastes his time at Rotary clubs - he makes about $1500 a month). My point there is you take advantage of what the book and author have to offer and make the biggest splash with that as you can.

    Hope this wasn't too long an answer.
    I think you've been reading all those self-publishing evangelism blogs. They are probably where your much-repeated "200 copies" stat comes from; and I've certainly read a lot on them about how technology has leveled the playing-field where writers and publishers are concerned.

    But just because they've put out all those assertions, it doesn't mean they're right.

    And if I was spending my time giving promotional talks and made just $1500 a month from my writing, I'd be looking for another job.

  20. #20
    Christine Tripp ctripp's Avatar
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    You can have a great book and do all the things everyone tells you to do (and that you may pay to hear) and still sell 200 copies.
    Michael I appreciate you addressed this but still have to go back to, I've honestly never heard of a commercially published book only selling 200 copies. That publisher would of had to of made a dreadful mistake, either in choosing the manuscript, or NO marketing and NO reviews. 200 sales wouldn't pay any of the Publishers associated costs, overhead, print, staff, Editors, cover artists, on and on, let alone an Author advance.
    And that poor Author would never be picked up again, with a record as dismal as that. I have a feeling you are looking at an averaging of roughly 3 million books, watered down by something like 2.5 of them being self published titles and THEIR average life time sales at roughly 100 copies. Library sales alone, in commercial publishing, would exceed 200 in North American would it not?
    I do agree that the glut of titles on Amazon has made it tougher on some of the good but smallest Publishers, in that casual browsing may not result in their offerings ever being discovered by a customer. But no Publisher was ever able to/should ever rely on readers stumbling upon a title by chance, even when books were only available in stores and their competition only other commercial books.
    They still have to get reviews, have a marketing budget and know how to spend it wisely.

  21. #21
    delicate #!&@*#! flower Perks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchic Q View Post
    Don't humble brag, it's not impressive, nor is it cute.
    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    It's not very good publicity either if the author isn't named.
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post

    If you do have an author on TMZ, I hope his or her books are widely available through physical bookshops. Because if you don't, there will be very little sales benefit. Do you have full bookshop distribution? I don't think so. But do correct me if I'm wrong.
    Presumably it's Taimak, and this book.

  22. #22
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctripp View Post
    Michael I appreciate you addressed this but still have to go back to, I've honestly never heard of a commercially published book only selling 200 copies. That publisher would of had to of made a dreadful mistake, either in choosing the manuscript, or NO marketing and NO reviews. 200 sales wouldn't pay any of the Publishers associated costs, overhead, print, staff, Editors, cover artists, on and on, let alone an Author advance.
    And that poor Author would never be picked up again, with a record as dismal as that. I have a feeling you are looking at an averaging of roughly 3 million books, watered down by something like 2.5 of them being self published titles and THEIR average life time sales at roughly 100 copies. Library sales alone, in commercial publishing, would exceed 200 in North American would it not?
    I do agree that the glut of titles on Amazon has made it tougher on some of the good but smallest Publishers, in that casual browsing may not result in their offerings ever being discovered by a customer. But no Publisher was ever able to/should ever rely on readers stumbling upon a title by chance, even when books were only available in stores and their competition only other commercial books.
    They still have to get reviews, have a marketing budget and know how to spend it wisely.
    I've seen books which have sold fewer than 200 copies, but it's very rare.

    I think the figures which Michael has seen have been calculated by someone who doesn't understand how ISBNs work or what they're for. I've seen several articles which make similar claims. What happens is a journalist looks up the number of books published in the UK, or the US; and then looks up the number of books sold in those markets; and then they divide one by the other, and reach that low figure.

    What they don't understand is that it's not just books which have ISBNs: textbooks, diaries, calendars, and some periodicals have them too, and those books rarely make high sales. Some textbooks are written for courses which have only fifty people on them, and are never expected to sell more than fifty copies. They also don't understand that some books have more than one ISBN (for example, a book can have a hardback edition, a trade paperback, a mass market paperback, a large print, an edition in library binding, and various new editions, and each will have its own ISBN) and those multiple ISBNs will make it look as though the book has not sold well, when in fact it's done very well indeed.

    The thing is, those articles which claim that lots of trade published books sell fewer than 200 copies are written by people who don't understand the business, or the statistics they're working with, and so their conclusions are meaningless.

    Quote Originally Posted by Perks View Post
    Presumably it's Taimak, and this book.
    Oh, dear lord. Michael, your response to that one star review is very unprofessional. Don't do that! It doesn't help you or your authors. Really. The only response a publisher or agent or author can reasonably make to any review is to say, "Thank you so much for taking the time to review my book." Don't do anything else. It'll not do you well.

    Now, I think we need to stop talking about Incorgnito here. This is Zharmae's thread, and we should really focus on them.

  23. #23
    Your Genial Uncle Absolute Sage James D. Macdonald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Incorgnito View Post
    Most of what you wrote is just plain wrong and uninformed.
    Faust: Come, I think hell's a fable.

    Mephisto: Aye, think so still 'til experience change thy mind.

  24. #24

  25. #25
    Born at sea Clairels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    The Incorgnito website is peppered with errors, which never bodes well for a publisher.
    The name of the press itself looks like a typo/misspelling.

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