Police Officers Shot During Protest in Dallas

mccardey · Jul 11, 2016

On the topic of de-escalation, New Zealand seems to have nailed it.

A takeaway shop owner has spoken about how he “took away the power” of an armed would-be robber by simply ignoring him.
Said Ahmed of Christchurch, New Zealand, decided to finish serving a customer before walking away from the counter – while a masked man brandishing a handgun stood by.

<snip>

“Ahmed said he had witnessed years of violence in Egypt before emigrating to New Zealand, and the quiet predictability of his life in Christchurch influenced his low-key reaction.

My heart was beating quickly, I was scared, but I wasn’t going to show him that. That is why my nature is cool. I have been 20 years here and never seen any fighting. In Egypt it happens every day but in New Zealand I am calm because it is a safe country.”

Lillith1991 · Jul 11, 2016

cmhbob said:
Privately? More than occasionally. Publicly, in a way they're accountable for what they say? Never, that I know of.

The bolded part is a problem. We should have empathy for the job they do and how hard it is, but that's supremely hard when they're acting like parents telling a kid to do something because they said so. You have to give respect when possible in order to earn respect, and even quite a few who know many police officers and like them are fed up with the amount of death coming about at their hands.

Xelebes · Jul 11, 2016

Preliminary work done on a basis of stops, blacks don't get shot at more often than whites. They may get roughed up more, but they don't get shot as much as when stopping a white person.

Of course, what makes up the difference is that blacks are simply stopped more often than whites.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/u...e-use-of-force-but-not-in-shootings.html?_r=1

cmhbob · Jul 11, 2016

Xelebes said:
Preliminary work done on a basis of stops, blacks don't get shot at more often than whites. They may get roughed up more, but they don't get shot as much as when stopping a white person.

Of course, what makes up the difference is that blacks are simply stopped more often than whites.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/u...e-use-of-force-but-not-in-shootings.html?_r=1

Counterpoint to that from The Guardian.

A new study claims that while black people might experience more use of force by the police, they’re no more likely to be shot – but the data is misleading.

A study reported by the New York Times on Monday claimed to find “surprising new evidence” that there is no racial bias in police shootings. But the study, and the New York Times’ reporting, uses a small sample of data that leads to simplistic conclusions.

The author of the study, Roland G Fryer Jr, analyzed 1,332 shootings between 2000 and 2015. However, the way he and a group of student researchers created their data was largely by coding police narratives rather than considering the testimonials of witnesses or suspects (assuming that the suspects were not killed by the police in the shooting). The study therefore assumes police reports are unbiased sources of information about facts like whether or not the officer shoots the suspect before being attacked.

Xelebes · Jul 11, 2016

robjvargas · Jul 12, 2016

Vince524 said:
Well for one thing, because police officers are aware as they've seen it dozens of times that what they hear from the beginning when things make the news isn't always what happened. But again, apparently, unless you assume that the accusation is true from the start, you're part of the problem.

You even quoted me as pointing out that it hasn't happened even after investigations and the all-too-rare disciplinary action were complete. Now you respond from expecting these statements before the investigations are complete?

OK, let's try this:

WHEN does it become acceptable/proper to comment on an incident?

Vince524 · Jul 12, 2016

robjvargas said:
You even quoted me as pointing out that it hasn't happened even after investigations and the all-too-rare disciplinary action were complete. Now you respond from expecting these statements before the investigations are complete?

OK, let's try this:

WHEN does it become acceptable/proper to comment on an incident?

Are you talking about when a cop should? Or when anyone else should talk about it?

Obviously, we can discuss it at any point, but when the facts aren't all known, I think that we should be careful not to make assumptions, and jump to a conclusion because often times, it could turn false. That goes for anyone on either side of the debate.

Cops who are on the job aren't going to speak out for many reasons. Blue wall of silence is certainly one of the, if not the, biggest, but not the only one. Each and every one of them knows that no matter how good of a cop they are, they could wind up in a situation where they have a split second to make a decision that will be dissected on the news for months to come. And yes, they don't want to be seen as the guy who turned on a brother in blue.

Police Officers Shot During Protest in Dallas

mccardey

Lillith1991

The Hobbit-Vulcan hybrid

Xelebes

Delerium ex Ennui

cmhbob

Did...did I do that?

Xelebes

Delerium ex Ennui

robjvargas

Vince524

Are you gonna finish that bacon?