Does your voice change...

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

from story to story?

Chase · Jul 4, 2016

I try hard to maintain the same voice in narrative and dialog of each POV character in the sequel to my mystery novel. From character-to-character, I try for different voices.

In short stories, I strive for varied voices to narrate each tale.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

Thanks, Chase. So, in your short stories, are you altering your voice to suit a POV character? Or if the narrator is the author and not a character, do you ever try to find a voice that suits not a character but the story itself?

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

Maze Runner said:
Or if the narrator is the author and not a character, do you ever try to find a voice that suits not a character but the story itself?

I think you pretty-much have to.

Everything, including the narrative, should be in support of the story.

(As the old clipper ship captains said, "What she doesn't carry she drags.")

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

James D. Macdonald said:
I think you pretty-much have to.

Everything, including the narrative, should be in support of the story.

(As the old clipper ship captains said, "What she doesn't carry she drags.")

Thanks, this is what I'm beginning to understand. It seems some writers sound pretty much the same from book to book, whereas others don't. Just trying to sort this all out for myself.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

Just to add to the above. If the narrator is a character then of course the voice will change. I guess I'm talking about the author as narrator, and I don't know if it makes a difference if it's omniscient or close, or is that limited? Not real clear on the difference between close and limited.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

The difference between "close" or "limited" pretty much depends on which how-to-write book you read.

There's a scale, from true first person, out to the kind of third-person which is really first-person only with "he" or "she" substituted for "I," on to the one where the narrator can see and hear everyone, but only knows the thoughts and feelings of one character, to the sort of third person where the narrator only knows the thoughts and feelings of one person at a time, to true omniscient. True omniscient (done badly, "head hopping") has been out of fashion for quite a while, but is making a come back.

Some writers have the same narrative voice in all their novels because some writers are telling the same story in all their novels. (It's possible to make a fine career out of telling the same story over-and-over again.)

Sage · Jul 4, 2016

Some elements of my authorial voice carries between books, but with first-person and close-third POVs, the voice will also change from story to story. I've had betas tell me that the characters' voices are unique but that they can recognize the writing as mine at the same time.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

There's the distinction between narrative voice, and the writer's style. They're linked, but also separate.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

James D. Macdonald said:
The difference between "close" or "limited" pretty much depends on which how-to-write book you read.

There's a scale, from true first person, out to the kind of third-person which is really first-person only with "he" or "she" substituted for "I," on to the one where the narrator can see and hear everyone, but only knows the thoughts and feelings of one character, to the sort of third person where the narrator only knows the thoughts and feelings of one person at a time, to true omniscient. True omniscient (done badly, "head hopping") has been out of fashion for quite a while, but is making a come back.

Some writers have the same narrative voice in all their novels because some writers are telling the same story in all their novels. (It's possible to make a fine career out of telling the same story over-and-over again.)

That's great information, thanks. I'm having a little trouble digesting the bolded. In that voice, are you seeing and feeling everything that particular character is, at that time? If so, how is that different from true omniscient? I'm confused.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

In the bolded part, the author doesn't tell us about anything that happens while the viewpoint character is out of the room. Only things that the viewpoint character knows can be known to the reader.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

In true omniscient the author knows, and describes, everything at all places and all times, including the thoughts and feelings of all the characters.

Little did Lady Cecilia know what Lord Crumpleshaft was doing at that very moment in Norwich!

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

James D. Macdonald said:
In the bolded part, the author doesn't tell us about anything that happens while the viewpoint character is out of the room. Only things that the viewpoint character knows can be known to the reader.

Oh, I see. So there's only one viewpoint character, as in 1st person. Wondering what the benefit of it is, I guess, vs. 1st person. I really like the intimacy of 1st person, but one pov is a real limitation. It's interesting to me, because in a sense, you'd think that 1st person is closest to the way life is experienced.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

James D. Macdonald said:
In true omniscient the author knows, and describes, everything at all places and all times, including the thoughts and feelings of all the characters.

Little did Lady Cecilia know what Lord Crumpleshaft was doing at that very moment in Norwich!

Is there an obligation, in omniscient, to tell all?

Sage · Jul 4, 2016

In 3rd person, you can have multiple POVs in the novel, but only one at a time.

In omniscient, you still only have one POV at a time (that of the narrator), but the narrator knows what all the characters are doing and thinking and feeling.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

The benefit of, let's call it very-close third over first person is the slight amount of distancing between the reader and the character.

You can also think of a camera pulling back, and back, and back ....

- - - Updated - - -

Maze Runner said:
Is there an obligation, in omniscient, to tell all?

Only what is required for a satisfying story.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

Sage said:
In 3rd person, you can have multiple POVs in the novel, but only one at a time.

In omniscient, you still only have one POV at a time (that of the narrator), but the narrator knows what all the characters are doing and thinking and feeling.

So, in omniscient, it's up to the narrator to reveal only what serves the story?

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

James D. Macdonald said:
The benefit of, let's call it very-close third over first person is the slight amount of distancing between the reader and the character.

You can also think of a camera pulling back, and back, and back ....

- - - Updated - - -

Only what is required for a satisfying story.

Ah, thank you. I think I'm starting to get it.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

Let us turn from Lady Ceclia, sitting in the gazebo on this sultry summer afternoon mending her fan and thinking only of her forthcoming nuptials with Lord Crumpleshaft, and turn to Norfolk, where events would soon transpire that would send her placid life into a maelstrom of emotion.

Lord Crumpleshaft, who, the reader will no-doubt recall, was the illegitimate half-brother of Solomon Digby, the industrialist, was even then in the cottage of Grace, the gamekeeper's wife.

"Holla, Grace, my duck," said his lordship, as he surveyed the small but tidy abode. He noted particularly the red chintz curtains. He breathed deeply. The smell of tallow and wood ash contrasted with the stink that was London. He would gladly have remained in this simple district for the rest of his days.

"Holla, Edward," replied the gamekeeper's wife, for she knew not who he really was. To her mind, Lord Crumpleshaft was Edward Duff, a poacher, her husband's natural foe ... but her true love and lover. They had met at the fair a year ago come Lammas and he had won her heart with a soft word and a bunch of blue ribbons.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

So choose a voice that best suits what you'll need to tell a story most effectively? First person, also, offers the opportunity to keep a character in the dark, but only one character in the dark. It strikes me as the way the world really looks, to each of us, but maybe the most striking limitation is that the MC has to be in every scene? Other than maybe, when he's/she's being told of something in detail and so that the reader and the first person character is transported?

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

Having someone show up to tell the viewpoint character the things they need to know (or have them read it in the newspaper, or see it on TV), can get old really fast.

Every artistic choice comes with limitations. Choose the one that is best suited to the story you're telling.

Chase · Jul 4, 2016

Maze Runner said:
Or if the narrator is the author and not a character, do you ever try to find a voice that suits not a character but the story itself?

Agreeing with James and Sage, I try as much as skill allows to shed my author's skin and speak from within the story, itself.

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

Thanks, guys. And yet, there are consistencies throughout everyone's work. Would I be pushing my luck to ask for distinctions between voice and style? Is it true that style chooses us more than the other way around?

Maze Runner · Jul 4, 2016

I think maybe I'm complicating it now. I am unclear on style, but maybe it's best left unexamined.

I started this thread because I've noticed in hindsight that, in the two 3rd person stories I've written, there were different narrative voices, but of course both within me. Maybe the way an actor takes on different roles. And so I'm interested in how everyone approaches voice, as Chase says, to speak within the story itself.

I'm working on one now that thinks in a comedic way first. Then gives nods here and there to the dramatic, even tragic in life. Versus what I've done before, and that's think dramatically and occasionally give in to humor.

James D. Macdonald · Jul 4, 2016

"Style," as a very smart person once told me, "is what you can't help doing."

Does your voice change...

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