Romance - state of the industry 2016

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SylviaFrost

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It's tougher to succeed than it was a year ago in the Indie market, that's for damn sure. That said if you can write fast, on genre, and are savvy you can still make good money writing romance. I do okay, and I regularly rub elbows with people who do way more than okay (20k+ months). The key I've noticed is an ability to either have the novel of your heart be something marketable or know how to write to market. I think in romance it's getting less and less possible to write. You have to be willing to be at minimum publisher savvy. That means knowing how to create a brand, how to market etc etc. It's really not that hard, but it is a pain. I have sympathy for authors who don't want to deal with that. OTOH, I really have no interest in writing query letters, but if I wanted to not self-publish, that would be something I'd have to do. So if you really want to write, publish and make a living at it, you make it work.

You save up that $600 to publish your novel. Yes, it can be done at $600, it really, really can. And no it won't be crap at that price point, but you have to be very savvy. And you have to be savvy from the moment you put your pen to paper, in what you're writing. 99% of what I see people write isn't written to market, or part of a hot genre. Lots of those people self-publish and are DOA. There are resources to learn how to self-publish really well, and it can be done, but it's work, and more work than it used to be.
 
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AvaBond

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Hey dear romance writers :)

Wow. It's really a reality-check-slap-in-the-face-feeling reading this thread. But I like it, I prefer to know the business I'm entering, how you all share your experience and how you tackle the ups and downs... and let me tell you the romance industry is certainly not more of a rotten apple than the illustration industry I'm trying to leave behind.

Ten years ago I was charging 1000 USdollar per illustration, earlier this Spring the SAME company offered me 250 dollars for the same type of illustration. That's me - improving my skills for ten years only to earn 75% less, and how all people who do the art and culture scene suffer today. I can't pay my bills, so I started to write (oh stop laughing) and my plan is.... Who am I kidding? It's not a solid plan yet. I would accept an illustration gig if it came flying at this time but I'm not actively reaching out for that, and I'll keep writing as many romance books as I can knowing that some time soon, most likely within 4-6 months I have to get myself a different job. Why? I have two kids, that's why. Need to make ends meet, and this bubble I'm in right now allowing me some time to write is only temporary (thank god for resting on a back-up budget that will last me a few more months but when it's gone it's GONE)

With all of that said, my plan is to reach out to other romance writers, share my work, improve as much as I can, and then try EVERYTHING. I'll try Harlequin and/or their e-book publisher Carina Press (are they part of the big 5?) and all the biggies and the small, and if no one likes it I'll self publish.

I don't have an agent though, in my illustrationwork I've always been flying solo but it seems a lot of writers find working with an agent a good thing?

God I need more coffee... and then I'll prepare my NaNoWriMo summary (figured it would push me into writing a book in one month, sounds like a great idea right now, ask me again how it feels in about a month haha)

Hey - wishing you all the best of luck - keep writing - I'm cheering on you!
 

She who must

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If you're not just in it for the $$$ and I'm assuming because you're an artist already you're not, let's do a beta swap. Can't hurt.
 

romance2die4

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I found that the self publishing learning curve is very steep. There are so many resources out there that it can be difficult to assimulate. I have been thinking about branching out to Harlequin or other pub. Have you decided to go that way? If so, how is it going?
 

c.m.n.

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Well, you don't necessarily NEED $600 to publish. I can still self-publish for around $0, but I'm not really doing it for money, either.

If anyone is doing it for money, you really need to study up on what's in the market and write to it. Release a book once every month, create a newsletter and "call to action" for subscribers, gain an ARC team, word-of-mouth, etc, etc. It is very VERY difficult for someone who works full-time or even part-time. A lot of your work needs to go into writing and marketing.

I wonder... this thread is quite a few months old, now. Has there been any shift lately? I'm noticing a lot of authors are either going the self-pub route or sending to big pubs. Many of the small and mid-list pubs are gaining some nasty reputations. Think this is why?
 

Captcha

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I'm wrapping up a self-pubbed series that reminds me of how much I hate self-publishing - I'd much rather have someone else take care of the business side of things! I still make myself self-pub some stuff just as a way to hedge my bets, but I don't like it at all.

In terms of small publishers, I'm happy with Riptide and I'd like to send something to DSP again pretty soon, but for het? I'm not sure there's really an e-first publisher I'd want to send my m/f to these days... anyone have any ideas?
 

V.J. Allison

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I signed on with a smaller romance and erotica e-publisher a couple of weeks ago, who are on Canada's west coast. I'm really surprised they accepted my work, especially after all of the rejections and problems I had with that story from day one of writing - four years ago now. Although their top seller is the M/M stuff, they do accept M/F, which is what I write.

Everyone, I was fit to give up by the time I got the offer. I was so darn down in the dumps about my writing, and so frustrated with everything, that I was just ready to put everything onto my external drive and never try to get published. I never thought they would like my stuff, you know?

I think all of us should just keep trucking with the submissions, and keep writing. Surely there are publishers out there that will give y'all chances, right?

Remember how Stephen King was on the verge of giving up when his wife sent out Carrie? Look at him now.

I think all of you have the potential to do it, either via self publishing or a traditional house.

Don't give up.
 

LJD

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I'm wrapping up a self-pubbed series that reminds me of how much I hate self-publishing - I'd much rather have someone else take care of the business side of things! I still make myself self-pub some stuff just as a way to hedge my bets, but I don't like it at all.

In terms of small publishers, I'm happy with Riptide and I'd like to send something to DSP again pretty soon, but for het? I'm not sure there's really an e-first publisher I'd want to send my m/f to these days... anyone have any ideas?

Have you looked at the digital imprints that are part of Big 5 Publishers? Like Forever Yours, Loveswept, Avon Impulse, or SMP Swerve? (The latter is somewhat new. Don't know much about them.)

I have no interest in self-publishing, and yeah, the whole thing is pretty depressing.
 

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Have you looked at the digital imprints that are part of Big 5 Publishers? Like Forever Yours, Loveswept, Avon Impulse, or SMP Swerve? (The latter is somewhat new. Don't know much about them.)

I have no interest in self-publishing, and yeah, the whole thing is pretty depressing.

I haven't looked at them recently, no - last I heard their sales weren't good, but... maybe that's changed?

I mean, I'm still sending het to my agent and she's looking for print contracts, but since the last one I had didn't sell well, I'm not super-optimistic that I'll be getting another one of those any time soon...

Is anyone working with the e-first imprints? Are they seen as a "training ground' for the print lines, or do most people stay e-first?
 

LJD

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I signed on with a smaller romance and erotica e-publisher a couple of weeks ago, who are on Canada's west coast. I'm really surprised they accepted my work, especially after all of the rejections and problems I had with that story from day one of writing - four years ago now. Although their top seller is the M/M stuff, they do accept M/F, which is what I write.

Everyone, I was fit to give up by the time I got the offer. I was so darn down in the dumps about my writing, and so frustrated with everything, that I was just ready to put everything onto my external drive and never try to get published. I never thought they would like my stuff, you know?

I think all of us should just keep trucking with the submissions, and keep writing. Surely there are publishers out there that will give y'all chances, right?

Remember how Stephen King was on the verge of giving up when his wife sent out Carrie? Look at him now.

I think all of you have the potential to do it, either via self publishing or a traditional house.

Don't give up.

I'm glad you're happy with your sale!

For me personally, the problem isn't that I can't sell to publishers . I've sold to five. I've had releases with three of these so far, and another coming soon. Due to complications with one of the publishers, I asked for a rights reversion and got it.

But my sales are pitiful. I am not happy with selling <100 copies. Some people might be, and that's fine, but I don't think I should be forced to accept that 60 copies is just as good as it gets. So yeah, some of those publishers may be willing to give my books another chance, but I'm not terribly interested in submitting again if their track record with my books is so poor. There are some other publishers that I just don't seem to be able to crack, and if they've rejected so many of my books in the past, maybe they just don't like my voice and there isn't much point in submitting to them? I don't know.

So yeah, I'm pretty down in the dumps about writing. I write contemporary m/f.
 

CEtchison

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I'm currently under contract with Avon Impulse. And yes, it is a proving ground of sorts, but they have had authors move from Avon Impulse up to Avon Books. 10,000 units seems to be the magic number, but I'm unsure how quickly following the release date you have to hit that. I doubt 10K sales over 10 years means much.

To be honest, I'm not sure what's constitutes good or bad sales numbers because I'm such a newbie. My agent doesn't seem concerned. My editor isn't concerned. They both just keep saying it takes time, so here I wait.

In September, I saw a slow down in sales and October felt like falling off a cliff. Of course, I have no real way of knowing until I get the royalty statement in a couple of days. But things took a definite upswing this month. Amazon included book one in the Kindle monthly deals this month and book two has had a nice bump since I received a "recommended read" review from Dear Author two weeks ago.

I'm sure there will be another slow down through the holidays and the next book doesn't release until March. From what Marie Force and others have said is that the contemporary market is pretty glutted at the moment and it's really difficult to get noticed. So I'm just really appreciative of what notice I have received and am doing my best to remain patient.
 

aruna

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I'm not sure there's really an e-first publisher I'd want to send my m/f to these days... anyone have any ideas?

Is anyone working with the e-first imprints? Are they seen as a "training ground' for the print lines, or do most people stay e-first?

Have you checked out Bookouture? They have really good sales. I've been with them for the past couple years (though for historicals, not romance) and most of their authors are doing well. I don't see it as a training ground; though I would love to have sales so good a print publisher would take on the same books! This has happened with a few of the more succesful Bookouture ebooks. The publisher in question is Bonnier.
 

StoryofWoe

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Have you checked out Bookouture? They have really good sales.
See, I read things like this all the time, but I don't ever see actual numbers applied. What equates to really good sales?
And specifically, do they have really good romance sales?

Bookouture has been on my radar for a while, but I haven't seen many signs that point to them being a stand-out publisher of romance, though they accept romance and erotica. Would love to be corrected!
 
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aruna

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They have sold over 7 million books in their four years of existence. I am very much mid-list, but I'm getting lower-mid 4-figure royalties every quarter.
 

aruna

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And specifically, do they have really good romance sales?

Bookouture has been on my radar for a while, but I haven't seen many signs that point to them being a stand-out publisher of romance, though they accept romance and erotica. Would love to be corrected!

Some of their romance writers are very successful. Check out Holly Martin, Lily Graham, Jenny Hale, Sue Watson, Christie Barlow, all of whom have made the top 100 in the UK (not for genre; I mean the overall top100). they write light romance, rom-com or chick lit . Right now I think they all have Christmas romances out!

Here is an example, presently at number 72 in UK Kindle. Published in October 16, already over 90 reviews, mostly 5 star: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01JEMU4KK/?tag=absowrit-21
 
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romance2die4

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aruna

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The billionaire thing to me was always the least romantic set-up possible. The idea that she loves his money more than him is always hovering in the background.
 

chompers

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The billionaire thing to me was always the least romantic set-up possible. The idea that she loves his money more than him is always hovering in the background.
HAHA. I love this comment.
 

ElaineA

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I never understood it either. For one, there aren't that many billionaires, and for two, most of them are 50+. Never could suspend my disbelief for that trope. :(
 

romance2die4

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I never understood it either. For one, there aren't that many billionaires, and for two, most of them are 50+. Never could suspend my disbelief for that trope. :(

I never had a problem with it. I always enjoyed the fact that they never had to worry about money. It is all fairy tale stuff anyway.
 

LJD

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I don't mind the billionaire trope on occasion, but usually I don't like it.

When it comes to my own writing, all I want to do is make fun of it. I wrote one romance in which the heroine's alpha-hole billionaire ex is trying to get her back. He's all, "You're the one who made me believe in love, and I won't take no for an answer." Since he won't leave her alone and starts acting like a bit of a creep, she gets herself a fake boyfriend (the hero) to try to put him off.

I also wrote a short story on Wattpad in which the heroine divorced her billionaire husband... "Marrying a billionaire was not all it was cracked up to be. Romance novels would have you believe that billionaires were men in their thirties with stunning bodies. Even if they sat behind a desk all day, they had huge biceps and washboard abs hard enough to knock you unconscious. But Angie had married a billionaire, and it wasn’t like that at all. The man had a potbelly and a toupee, and he was twenty-five years her senior."
 
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