Identifying Runes & A Supernatural Experience

Rufus Coppertop said:

Looks interesting but.........

This is the one.

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In the series, the team takes part in the medieval construction project at Guédelon Castle[SUP][2][/SUP] in France

Orianna2000 said:

Anyone have any thoughts about the lines carved in the prison at the fort? (See post #24 for a picture.) I'm really curious what the "experts" think those lines could be.

I may even combine this with the story of the archaeologist. Maybe she visits Blackness after having her vision of the past at Linlithgow, and she sees the lines on the wall, touches them, and has a vision of a prisoner being held unjustly, keeping track of the days until his parole. Could be creepy, if done right.

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I'm not an expert, but those do not look like random marks. Because of the angle of the photo it's impossible to read, or see clearly, all of the marks, but some look like Runes, but it could be another alphabet.

To me, those look like common or garden chisel marks suitable for a roughly-squared stone. Three questions: a) how big is it? b) what sort of stone was it - it looks like granite to me, and that's a nightmare to do anything with by hand, and c) were there any more like that, or were all the rest of them flat, neat and tidy?

The blackness markings don't look random to me either. But like Neptune, the angle's wrong to be able to tell with any certainty. The flash also fades some of the images on the left. I still don't think it's just random markings.

frimble3 said:

I don't suppose it could be anything so pedestrian as a mason's mark identifying the stone itself? Accidentally left to view instead of on an inner face, or obliterated?

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Mason's marks aren't always hidden; sometimes they're left on show as a sort of advert for the mason in question - particularly the more skilled ones. It's actually quite common if you keep an eye out for it.

Oh my goodness. I JUST saw that mark again. In ROSSLYN Chapel. No, I wasn't actually there. I was watching TV earlier and was watching some show where this guy was going on about the different conspiracy theories regarding the Knights Templars. (Yes, I'm a total geek. I love stuff like that.) Anyway, it made me remember the different places that have some rumors and conspiracies surrounding them, like Rennes-le-chateau in France, and Rosslyn in Scotland (which, by the way is supposed to be in line with Rennes in some way...). ANYWAY, I started looking up Rosslyn again, and I found a site that mentioned that this guy was studying the cubes in Rosslyn, which are decorations in the chapel. He noticed the symbols on each of the cubes and he realized they actually signify musical notes. You can read about it here:

http://www.crystalinks.com/rosslynchapel.html

Just scroll down until you see a picture of a man and the heading "Stuart Mitchell". He recreated sound of the music (I believe with actual medieval instruments) and he thinks that if it's played in Rosslyn, it will unlock some kind of secret, based on the vibrations of the notes. (Hey, there are sealed chambers under the chapel. They haven't tried to open them because they're afraid the chapel will collapse. The chambers are supposed to have white sand in them, along with lead vaults. I think they did some kind of imaging to discover that.) The only problem with that is I believe that it said that there are two cubes missing. I don't know if that means they went missing before he started studying them, or after.

Anyway, I thought it sounded interesting, so I followed the link to a YouTube video of the actual musical composition, which I LOVE the sound of. Anyway, the video eventually starts showing the individual cubes. Watch the video, and on one of them, you'll see your mark! It shows up around the 46 second mark. I almost fell out of my chair when I saw it. Here's the link to the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy2Dg-ncWoY

So you have a few possibilities here. First, since St. Clair brought in masons from all over to build Rosslyn, and Rosslyn's in Scotland, the same mason could have worked on your castle, depending on when it was built. Second, this mason could have learned from the mason who made the mark in the castle and used it (but I'm not sure if that was common or not. I thought mason marks were individual. I could be wrong about that, though.) Three, the symbol could stand for a group of masons. Again, not sure how common that would have been, either. Or this symbol could have significance that we know nothing about. Read up on Rosslyn, and you'll discover how unusual its design and decoration is for the time period. It contains Green Men from paganism (and a Green Woman), symbols of Judaism, and symbols of other religions. It could also have something to do with the conspiracies surrounding the Knights Templar. I mean, one of the legends surrounding Rosslyn is that the Holy Grail is there. Another is that it contains (or once contained) the mummified head of Jesus (another said the mummified body).

I don't know if that same mark appears on any of the other cubes, because I haven't finished the video yet. I saw the symbol, backed it up, paused it so I could study it, and then came here to let you know what I had found. Now it could definitely be a mason mark, but this also makes me wonder if that same symbol shows up at any of the other sites that are fabled to have Knights Templar connections. Also makes me wonder if the castle is purported to have those connections.

Either way, let your imagination go wild with that story!

I just looked at it again, and it might not be identical. I'll have to look at your picture again... It's still interesting, though!

Is it like any of the designs in this article?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triskelion

It could be that part of it was worn away by something.

Or could it be that someone didn't quite finish drawing, engraving, it?

It could be a variation of the fylfot or a maker's mark shaped like a variation on the fylfot.

Yes, Cat Named Easter, that Pallas asteroid is related to Athena--its full name is actually Pallas Athene. But from what I understand, the glyph symbolizing Pallas was created after our discovery of the asteroid, so if Orianna2000 thinks this symbol was carved before then, it must mean something else.

So, Orianna2000, another name for the diamond shape is "lozenge." You will probably get further in your research by searching on that term than by searching on "diamond." The cross underneath it is a very common and ancient symbol, used in alchemy among other occult areas, to symbolize matter. For instance, the symbol for the asteroid Ceres is spirit (crescent) above matter (cross); the symbol for the planet Saturn is matter (cross) above spirit (crescent). As for the lozenge, have a look at this book:
https://books.google.com/books?id=L...TAM#v=onepage&q=occult symbol lozenge&f=false

If that link doesn't work, go to Google Books and find this book: Stonehenge, by John North. Then search within it for "lozenge," or just go to chapter 12, which starts on p.503. It is ALL ABOUT that symbol.

As for your supernatural experience, that's really cool, and it reminds me of a book that I think you'd be interested in: City of Dark Magic by Magnus Flyte. Trust me on this

Daleth said:

Yes, Cat Named Easter, that Pallas asteroid is related to Athena--its full name is actually Pallas Athene. But from what I understand, the glyph symbolizing Pallas was created after our discovery of the asteroid, so if Orianna2000 thinks this symbol was carved before then, it must mean something else.

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Just wanted to throw this in: there is no way to know for sure when the symbol was carved. While it does seem to most resemble a stone mason's mark and therefore could date to the construction of the building, it could also have been added any time after. Heck, it could even date from well before the existing building if that particular stone was reused from an earlier structure.

If the mark can be traced to a particular mason, or at least appears elsewhere in the building, then that could be evidence that the mark dates to the building of the structure. But if there's no other evidence, dating it will be just about impossible.

Orianna2000, have you emailed anyone at Historic Scotland? If they don't have any information about marks at Linlithgow, they should be able to put you in touch with an archaeologist or historian who does. Or you might try the Dept. of Archaeology at Edinburgh University. Again, if no one there works specifically at Linlithgow they should know who does.

This is a great question and a very interesting thread. I did my own Google search and wanted to relate some ancillary facts. Originally, asteroids were named after females. The first one discovered was Ceres and the second one was Pallus. Pallus was layed by Athena, and afterward Athena regretted it. She apparently added Pallus' name and Athena became Pallus Athena. Athena was the Goddess of Truth and the Goddess of Strategy (That's why you'll often see Athena dresses in armor). As a warrior, Athena had a spear. According to the astronomy websites, your symbol is Athena's Spear. The symbol for the asteroid was provided around 1802, and I am supposing that your symbol existed before 1802, but there is nothing I have found to establish that. However, Athena's Spear was known long before that.

It could well be a stone mason's mark, as discussed. But several of the stone mason marks appear quite exact and precise. But not all.

Your vision is your own. No need to convince anyone. And it would make a great conceit for a story!

Regards,

DrDoc

Read The Hero with a Thousand Faces by Joseph Campbell. I don't know what the rune is by I can recognize the call to adventure. You missed it. Typically, the protagonist would have the vision and then have an adventure in the castle/life. It's okay to miss the call to adventure, you are waiting for the big idea that will end all of your problems. Campbell described it in a pretty fuzzy way comparing the the protagonist who refuses the call to adventure to a yogist. I can't remember. I'd look it up but my copy is a couple of thousand miles away from me.

As someone who had a supernatural experience I can tell you that there is only one person who can tell you what that vision means...that person is you. That's because the people in that vision seem to be gone. If you can track them down, however...