Categorizing your novel as LGBT

JLCarver

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This question may have already been discussed on this forum, but I didn't see it in a cursory search. If it's been discussed before, I apologize. The question came up recently over on KBoards, and I thought I'd bring it up here too, because it's an interesting question: How do you categorize your novels when you're writing LGBT stories?

This might be a question geared toward those of us who indie publish as we're the ones with the most control over how our novels are categorized. Trad. Pub. novels, I imagine, don't have the option to choose a category. I could be wrong, though.

This conversation started when it was discovered that an online ebook distributor was caught blurring out all of the covers in the LGBT category. The distributor lumped all LGBT books in with erotica, regardless of whether or not the book had any sex scenes at all. The Picture of Dorian Gray by Oscar Wilde, for instance, was among the covers being blurred. I'm happy to say that, with the collective outcry of several indie writers, myself included, and a few stern emails later, this distributor altered their algorithms to only blur true erotica covers and show unblurred other LGBT titles. So problem solved there.

But, the question was raised about whether or not it was a good idea to categorize novels with LGBT characters as LGBT or if it was better to list your book under the main category such as sci-fi, fantasy, thriller, etc. without the LGBT tag. This is mainly in the case of a book--like the one I'm writing--that has an LGBT protagonist, but is far removed from any sort of LGBT issues. My protagonist is someone who is also gay. His being gay has no other bearing on the novel other than, instead of the hetero girlfriend, he is trying to rescue his boyfriend from capture. The point was brought up by one respondent, Bards and Sages (Julie) on the KBoards forum, "a lot of people see LGBTQ tag on a book and they are going to assume the book is ABOUT being LGBTQ, not that the main character is LGBTQ. People who might otherwise pick up your thriller or mystery or urban fantasy might pass on it because they think it "isn't for them." You are sacrificing one group of readers to access another. Instead of making the sacrifice, we should push for a better solution."

So what do you all think? Should you label your novels LGBT if you're not writing a story about coming out, dealing with homophobia, or some other issue that affects mostly the LGBTQ+ community?
 
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Viridian

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But, the question was raised about whether or not it was a good idea to categorize novels with LGBT characters as LGBT or if it was better to list your book under the main category such as sci-fi, fantasy, thriller, etc. without the LGBT tag.

From a practical standpoint...

As you pointed out, if a book is labeled LGBT, a lot of readers will assume it's about LGBT issues and pass it over.

The publishing industry is constantly changing. Gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender, and asexual protagonists are becoming more common. So I think we should push forward. The idea of having an LGBT protagonist should be normal-- no different from having a blond protagonist or a short protagonist.

So yeah. That's my answer. Treat it like a mainstream book. Help your book reach more readers.
 

Latina Bunny

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From my reading experience, LGBT novels outright labelled as LGBT tend to be focused on LGBT themes (like "coming out" stories, etc).

Otherwise, they would be under whatever genre they fit in (ie. Scifi; fantasy; paranormal; etc.) If it's Romance between two LGBTQA characters, and is heavily focused on the main Romance, then you can get more specific and label it ad M x M; M/M/F; and so on.

I love Romances (from het to Les/Gay), so you can guess what label I like. XD
 
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JohnnyGottaKeyboard

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Well, I'd wonder about losing those of us who are more interested in Sci Fi/fantasy Stories featuring an LGBTQ protag but who may never hear about your story because it is included in the deluge of the general SciFI/Fantasy wave.

Also, where are you wondering about the labeling? On Amazon, my mysteries are listed as:

"Kindle Store > Kindle eBooks > Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual & Transgender eBooks > Mystery & Detective" and

"Kindle Store > Kindle eBooks > Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual & Transgender eBooks > Literature & Fiction > Gay Fiction" and

"Books > Gay & Lesbian > Literature & Fiction > Fiction > Gay"

but when I walk into a Barnes and Noble, they have them in the mystery section.

Also, it would appear that the Kindle store allows more than one listing.

And you were right about the publisher making the decisions. I was asked for no input other than the genre I listed in my initial query.
 
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Rhoda Nightingale

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Honestly, how your book gets categorized might be one of those things you can't control. Even if the publisher puts it somewhere that makes sense to you, it might wind up anywhere depending on the distributor and how they choose to shelve things. (Like with Dorian Gray, as you pointed out, which by all accounts should be filed under "Classics." (Speaking of which, that is my favorite book, so I'm having some RAGE on its behalf right now. How Very Dare They?!?!))

Call it a mystery/thriller/drama and let your publisher decide where to put it. Also, to hell with that ebook distributor blurring all the covers.
 

Latina Bunny

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Well, I'd wonder about losing those of us who are more interested in Sci Fi/fantasy Stories featuring an LGBTQ protag but who may never hear about your story because it is included in the deluge of the general SciFI/Fantasy wave.

Also, where are you wondering about the labeling? On Amazon, my mysteries are listed as:

"Kindle Store > Kindle eBooks > Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual & Transgender eBooks > Mystery & Detective" and

"Kindle Store > Kindle eBooks > Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual & Transgender eBooks > Literature & Fiction > Gay Fiction" and

"Books > Gay & Lesbian > Literature & Fiction > Fiction > Gay"

but when I walk into a Barnes and Noble, they have them in the mystery section.

I assume the reason your detective book is found in mystery section is that readers who enjoy reading detective stories would be able to find your detective book? Isn't the mystery section is where detective books are often found?

Now, if you're asking why isn't it in a LGBT section, that could be two things: 1) Your book doesn't touch upon common LGBT issues that are usually found in LGBT books, and 2) Some bookstores don't have a dedicated section for LGBT stuff.

Maybe the publisher (or bookstore?) thinks the book will appeal to a more broader audience who enjoy detective stories.

Ok, to get more on topic: I understand the frustration of trying to specifically find just those books that have LGBT characters. I get that. (I also have had some frustration myself in finding LGBT characters in genre fiction.)

Here's what I've been trying to do recently:

-Google LGBT (insert genre)

-Search for Goodreads lists that have readers' choices of books with LGBT characters.

-Look at LGBT (literary) organizations and LBTQA (literary or entertainment) websites.

-Look for websites that review LGBTQA

-There are also websites and blogs that provide lists of well-known Bestsellers with LGBT characters in various genres. (I found this with the Google searching).

-There are also recs on some AW stickies, or you can ask AW members themselves for recs.

-Of course, Amazon and other online retailers.

-Amazon's "Customers also bought..." feature can help as well. :)

-If you want a specific pairing, you could search for them on Amazon and various Romance ebook sellers.

-Check out some pubs that specialize in LGBT material, if you want just LGBT content (ie. Dreamspinner does gay romances of various genres; etc)
 
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JohnnyGottaKeyboard

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I assume the reason your detective book is found in mystery section is that readers who enjoy reading detective stories would be able to find your detective book? Isn't the mystery section is where detective books are often found?

Now, if you're asking why isn't it in a LGBT section, that could be two things: 1) Your book doesn't touch upon common LGBT issues that are usually found in LGBT books, and 2) Some bookstores don't have a dedicated section for LGBT stuff.
All valid points but my gist was more that categorizing (I'm not sure I like the term "labeling" for some reason) is rather random and usually beyond the author's control. Which is why I asked where they were wondering about the categorizing--as in what venue? Amazon? On Amazon I would think a categorizer's (new word, [SUP]TM[/SUP]) goal should be for most visibility while not sliding into false advertising.
 

JLCarver

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From a practical standpoint...

So yeah. That's my answer. Treat it like a mainstream book. Help your book reach more readers.

That's pretty much where my head is at. I'm writing an urban fantasy novel, and I'll definitely slot it in the urban fantasy section on Amazon when I publish. But a part of me still worries about [sarcasm]delightful readers[/sarcasm] filling up a book with one-star reviews because it contains a gay main character.

And then there's what Johnny says:

Well, I'd wonder about losing those of us who are more interested in Sci Fi/fantasy Stories featuring an LGBTQ protag but who may never hear about your story because it is included in the deluge of the general SciFI/Fantasy wave.

That's where the conundrum lies. I want LGBT people to be able to find my novel. I think it's important for LGBT people to find themselves in heroic roles, and that's what I'm trying to do with my story. But I also don't want other readers to pass over my novel, because they think it's only about LGBT issues. As I said above, the only LGBT part of the book is that the protagonist is gay and he's trying to save his boyfriend. I think it's a story that will appeal to a lot of people beyond those who are LGBT.

Also, where are you wondering about the labeling? On Amazon, my mysteries are listed as:

It's mostly on Amazon and other ebook retailers. This is a series that I plan to publish through KDP Select at first, then I'll probably go wide after the three-month lock-in to Select is up. (Depending on sales. If the sales are doing good in Select, then I'll hang out in there for another three months...)

Honestly, how your book gets categorized might be one of those things you can't control. Even if the publisher puts it somewhere that makes sense to you, it might wind up anywhere depending on the distributor and how they choose to shelve things. (Like with Dorian Gray, as you pointed out, which by all accounts should be filed under "Classics." (Speaking of which, that is my favorite book, so I'm having some RAGE on its behalf right now. How Very Dare They?!?!))

Call it a mystery/thriller/drama and let your publisher decide where to put it. Also, to hell with that ebook distributor blurring all the covers.

Yeah, that's why I thought this question might be more geared toward those authors who publish through KDP, Direct2Digital, iBooks, etc. When you're an indie author, Amazon, for instance, allows you to choose up to three categories for your book. Then you can expand those categories by keywords. So you could, for instance, choose Science Fiction, Fantasy, and Literature as your main categories, but then you can expand those categories to include LGBT. But--and don't quote me on this as I could be wrong--I think there are categories that Amazon will automatically slot you into a primary category if you select them as keywords. Erotica as a keyword, for instance, will toss you into the dungeon of Erotica, which is not easily searched through Amazon's search bar. You have to specifically look for the erotica sub-category in order to find anything that is erotica--not that they don't slip through. All it takes is a cursory run through the romance category to realize that plenty of erotica titles slip through the cracks and make it out in the main search. I *think* LGBT is another keyword like that. When you put anything like gay, lesbian, bisexual, etc. as a keyword, I believe it automatically slots you into the Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual & Transgender category. But I'm not entirely, 100% sure on that. (Evenstar over on KBoards explains Amazon keywords much better than I can: http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,205816.0.html )

About the distributor who blurred the covers, they stopped. And they seem to be getting better. The guy who responded to my email was the co-founder of the company, and he seemed genuinely surprised that this was happening. He said that, when they first started the company--and they're a relatively new company--the only LGBT books they received were truly erotica books, so they simply slotted the entire LGBT category as blurred. But, when authors who didn't write erotica found their books blurred, and several people complained about it, they quickly turned it around and stopped blurring the majority of the titles in the LGBT category. As it is now, only those books that are clearly erotica are getting blurred. I'm willing to, at this point, give them the benefit of the doubt. The guy I emailed with seems like a decent guy. He and his company just made a mistake, which they quickly corrected. (And that's also why I'm not mentioning the company's name. I don't want this issue to haunt them too much, especially since they are making real and genuine efforts to move past it and represent LGBT literature faithfully.)
 

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A lot of this probably depends on the publisher. I describe my WIP as a YA/Action novel, but I'm fairly certain that a lot of publishers would describe it as an LGBT novel. Part of my querying process is going to be to determine the best way to reach both audiences (especially LGBT youths, as if I do my job right they're the ones most likely to get a benefit outside of simply enjoyment out of it), and talking to an agent/publisher about this is going to be a major part of it. Seeing what I can do to keep it from being banned by homophobic high schools is going to be a later step...
 

KTC

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My YA novel with my agent is an issue YA...and the issue is LGBTQ. There is no denying...it's an LGBTQ novel. YA Market...LGBTQ. That's what my agent is calling it. Pride Must Be A Place. Even the title is LGBTQ (-:
 

edutton

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A lot of this probably depends on the publisher. I describe my WIP as a YA/Action novel, but I'm fairly certain that a lot of publishers would describe it as an LGBT novel. Part of my querying process is going to be to determine the best way to reach both audiences (especially LGBT youths, as if I do my job right they're the ones most likely to get a benefit outside of simply enjoyment out of it), and talking to an agent/publisher about this is going to be a major part of it.

This is something I've been thinking about a lot as well... my current WIP is an f/f YA romance. It's also a bit of a coming-out story for my bi MC, although that aspect is less important than the love story. In my ideal world, the word "bisexual" would appear somewhere on the cover, but I recognize that may be a big ask. I'd love to hear more about how you plan to approach that issue, and if you have any success in doing so!
 

kuwisdelu

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My YA novel with my agent is an issue YA...and the issue is LGBTQ. There is no denying...it's an LGBTQ novel. YA Market...LGBTQ. That's what my agent is calling it. Pride Must Be A Place. Even the title is LGBTQ (-:

I'm glad some of us are still writing "issue" stories. :)

With so many people clamoring for characters "who just happen to be X", I sometimes have to remind myself that it's okay for my characters to be struggling with their identities, just like I sometimes have to remind myself that it's okay for me to be struggling with my identities.

What's okay for me must be okay for my characters, right? That's why I write them!
 

Latina Bunny

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I'm glad some of us are still writing "issue" stories. :)

With so many people clamoring for characters "who just happen to be X", I sometimes have to remind myself that it's okay for my characters to be struggling with their identities, just like I sometimes have to remind myself that it's okay for me to be struggling with my identities.

What's okay for me must be okay for my characters, right? That's why I write them!

I think issues books are still important to this day, because, well, there are still issues in the world, lol! :D

For me, sometimes I just get tired of some types of issues books (because some issue books tend to make me wince and feel sad), and I have fantasy/scifi worlds where same-sex relationships are not seen as that big of a deal, so some characters wouldn't really be totally struggling with their sexualities.

However, I still like some LGBTQA storylines. I have a character who deals with a somewhat conservative community, and struggles with the decision of whether to reveal her sexuality in public. (I write for escapism, so it wouldn't get too depressing or serious.)
 

PinkUnicorn

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I think of LGBT as a "theme" and not a genre, and so, I put my books in the genres (usually Dark Fantasy or Science Fiction). I've never put one of my fiction books in LGBT. All of my books have LGBTQ characters, but LGBTQ is rarely, if ever the "theme" of the story and I just don't feel the story having a trans MC is enough to list it in the LGBTQ category. Plus being trans myself, I don't feel like that makes me "a genre".

Because my books (usually) star a transgender main character, I add the keyword "transgender".

Interestingly, I have a book I put both Dark Fantasy and Yaoi, with the keywords "transgender" and "paranormal romance" and Amazon decided to list my book in a category I had no idea they even had:

Science Fiction & Fantasy > LGBT > Transgender Romance

I saw that and went, what the...? It's the perfect category for the book in question, but I had no idea that category even existed.

I tried the same combo on another book in the same series, only instead of "transgender" I put "LGBT" as a keyword. Amazon slung the book in Erotica > LGBT > Gay Romance and slapped the adult tag on it.... uhm... o.0 .... okay. (it has a picture of a covered wagon on the cover and exactly ZERO sex scenes in it.... so NOT Erotica in any way possible) I ended up having to email them and ask them to do a manual review, to get it removed from Erotica and get the adult tag taken off of it.

I've tried adding LGBT as a keyword to other books (again, no sex scenes in the books, and one the cover was of a car, the other of a house) and in both cases, adding the "LGBT" keyword, caused Amazon to b-slap the book into the dungeon and sling it into the Erotica category. Ouch! Since when does LGBT = Erotica? Not that using that keyword on Amazon again.

I've only used the LGBT category once. It was on a non-fiction book with deals with LGBTQ issues and therefor I put that one in LGBT> Politics> Transgender Issues
 

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Hmm. A lot of my story centers around a sexually confused character and dealing with denial but there's more stuff to it as well. I don't plan for it to be categorized as LGBT but rather drama, psychological thriller, or whatever it is. I don't know, though. I'm not even sure where it really fits, to be honest.
 

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I've been considering this lately because about half the major characters in my WIP are LGBT, but that isn't really integral to the plot. I wouldn't mind it being classified as an LGBT book, but I suspect most would classify it as a fantasy with some LGBT themes.
 

Latina Bunny

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I've been considering this lately because about half the major characters in my WIP are LGBT, but that isn't really integral to the plot. I wouldn't mind it being classified as an LGBT book, but I suspect most would classify it as a fantasy with some LGBT themes.

I would just call it fantasy. Or fantasy, with LGBTQA characters/themes, if they're really a big part of the story, and the agent mentioned wanting LGBTQA characters/themes, etc.

If the LGBTQA stuff is strong enough, then readers, industry critics, and websites will probably mention the LGBTQA factor. (Or the publisher and editors will help market that aspect, if it's important enough.)

Besides, LGBTQA characters have always been in SFF stories, so it's not unusual. SFF is a pretty broad genre, for the most part. :)

When it comes to Amazon, it usually tends to put LGBTQA in either Erotica, Romance, or Nonfiction. At least, it used to. I don't know if they changed their policies regarding LGBTQA stuff.

When I hear that a book is "LGBT", I usually think of major LGBT themes and issues, like coming out, acceptance, dealing with discrimination and bullying, empowering LGBT, and so on, or dealing with LGBT relationships.

I personally feel that the LGBT part (whether it's the issues/themes and/or LGBT relationships) should be an important or big factor in the story, somehow, if a book is labelled LGBT.

If I want to find a particular genre that has minor LGBT themes or just have characters that happen to be LGBT, that's when I have to dig deeper and look up SFF lists on Goodreads or various LGBT websites, etc.

This is just my two cents, of course. I just tend to have a specific mindset and certain expectations when a book is labelled as an "LGBT" book.
 
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DarienW

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I hope it's okay to revitalize this topic, as it's something I've thought a lot about about. My first book, Don't Tell Anyone, is about a confused kid, but really it's a mystery. Calling it LGBT would be overstating it, and also, a bit of a spoiler, however, the sequel, How Winter Kills has multiple gay characters. So far, very few of my betas were gay, and none of them had a problem with the gay subject matter.

I do feel the trend is toward more diverse books. I also accept I probably won't have much say in how it's categorized. With all the reviews posted for books, the content will likely be known no matter how it's labeled.

I recently read ALMOST PERFECT by Brian Katcher, which had a transgender girl in it. There was a lot of controversy about it in the comments, but I found it touching. I don't recall it being categorized as a Transgender book, but I got that reading some reviews.

I like the idea of creating strong characters who just happen to be gay (in my case). I'm also writing in the early 80's, and gay cops, so I guess that would qualify the story as LGBT. I've been very moved by how my betas root for them though, and their drama and day to day struggles seemed universal in how they were perceived.

No matter what, I feel so lucky to be in the age we are.

And OMG, now that you mentioned issue books, I think I'm doing that, but like Odile, I'm not sure.

It's great finding you all here! This is such an amazing site. I've been poking around all day! Soon I must write! LOL!

Thanks for letting me weigh in!

:hi:
 

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It depends. I tend to look at a few things when considering this for a book:

-Are the LGBT characters the main/viewpoint character/s or are they side characters?
-Is there a moderate or heavy amount of gay romance?
-Is it an ownvoices story and if so how important do I consider that aspect of the work?

I tagged/sorted my book Shadows of Ourselves as LGBT because while it's primarily an urban fantasy about kissing and killing and magik, it's also an ownvoices story that I spilled a lot of myself into, and that was an important aspect and selling point to the story for me. I didn't tag my book Storm of Masks as LGBT because although it has several LGBT main characters, the focus of the main romance is on a het couple, and the focus of the novel itself is on ghosts.

It can also depend who your core audience is. Are you writing a story for LGBT people or are you writing a story that just happens to have LGBT people can be another big one - who are you trying to get the book to?
 

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For an ebook or a major online retailer I think it is a big advantage to labeling by genreand as LGBT as it increases the audience who will see your listing. In brick and mortar stores it is more of trade off, as it determines (for Barnes and Noble) whether you are on the sci fi shelf, or back in nonfiction/sexuality/selfhelp which as where they put LGBT fiction (been there, done that).
 

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My WIP's gone through some major changes, and now stars a bi elf. His ex, a homosexual aromantic elf, is in the beginning, but my MC eventually ends up with a straight human woman. So since the main romance is male/female but the beginning/protagonist is pretty queer, would it fall under LGBT?
 

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Chiming in late here, but Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint, which has a gay protagonist, is listed on amazon as Books > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Fantasy

Lynn Flewelling's Luck in the Shadows, which also has gay protagonists is listed on amazon as Books > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Fantasy > Epic

Neither of these stories was about being gay, as such, any more than most fantasy novels with straight protags are about being straight. The main characters just so happened to be.

It ticks me off that some publishers treat romances with same-gender couples as inherently more risque than romances with opposite-gender couples. I understand categorizing romance and erotica so people can find the kinds they like best. But blurring out covers that show some couples embracing but not others? That's rather insulting.
 
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Simpson17866

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My WIP's gone through some major changes, and now stars a bi elf. His ex, a homosexual aromantic elf, is in the beginning, but my MC eventually ends up with a straight human woman. So since the main romance is male/female but the beginning/protagonist is pretty queer, would it fall under LGBT?
I would think so.
 

Jade Rothwell

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Chiming in late here, but Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint, which has a gay protagonist, is listed on amazon as Books > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Fantasy

Lynn Flewelling's Luck in the Shadows, which also has gay protagonists is listed on amazon as Books > Science Fiction & Fantasy > Fantasy > Epic

Neither of these stories was about being gay, as such, any more than most fantasy novels with straight protags are about being straight. The main characters just so happened to be.

It ticks me off that some publishers treat romances with same-gender couples as inherently more risque than romances with opposite-gender couples. I understand categorizing romance and erotica so people can find the kinds they like best. But blurring out covers that show some couples embracing but not others? That's rather insulting.

The one argument I would make towards LGBT classification is that when I was coming to terms with my sexuality, it really helped to be able to find books with queer and trans protagonists easily. But for the most part, putting us in our own category kind of isolates and disconnects us from others in our true genres.

I would think so.

Awesome, thanks!
 

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The one argument I would make towards LGBT classification is that when I was coming to terms with my sexuality, it really helped to be able to find books with queer and trans protagonists easily.

Since bookseller classification systems can sometimes be limited, I wonder if there are LGBT blogs dedicated to this sort of thing.