1st Person vs 3rd Person

simply put, there is no universal.

many folks have opinions, but even that isn't uniform...you might as well be asking "Medium-rare or well-done, which is a better steak?"

you use either when they work best for you.

chiragthewriter said:

Simply put 1st Person vs 3rd Person, when to use either and when not to?

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If you search this site, you will find a thousand (or more) very useful posts on the subject.

Medium rare.

Use whichever one fits your story or character(s) best genre doesn't have anything to do with it either IMHO, I've read fantasy, romance and sci-fi written from both POVs

chiragthewriter said:

Simply put 1st Person vs 3rd Person, when to use either and when not to?

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There is no answer to that, other than to use the one that best suits the type of story and the voice you want to tell it in. If you don't have a definitive answer to that, then use the POV that comes most naturally to you.

quicklime said:

you might as well be asking "Medium-rare or well-done, which is a better steak?"

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Well, that one's easy. A well-done steak is a ruined steak. So there.

Use the one you prefer. Third person limited is generally considered easier for a new writer to write well, and my experience shows this to be true, but it usually comes down to which you prefer reading. It's difficult to write anything well unless you read a lot of it.

Too many try writing in first person because it seems easier, even when they rarely, if ever, read first person. This seldom works. First person is easy to write, but it's damnably difficult to write well.

Well done steaks--and send it back if the middle's raw. You never know processing details.

Novels are different: My current clients are split between first-person and third-person narrative, and two alternate first- and second-person depending on the primary character's and other POVs. I enjoy them all.

Chase said:

Well done steaks--and send it back if the middle's raw. You never know processing details.

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I like the entire thing raw. A minimum of twenty seconds per side on the grill is the state law here, and that's how I order my steak. Any bacteria is on the surface, whatever the processing technique.

I think it's best to use the one that fits the tone of the story best. For example, first person present tense seems to work best for pacy stories, which is why it's used mainly in YA books like the Divergent series. Third person past tense is more ubiquitous, but also has a slightly slower feeling to it, I find.

I'm not sure if that's just me though.

It depends how important these other characters' emotions are. Also, bear in mind that unless you are prepared to do a lot of constant head hopping in 3rd person, you will probably still stay mainly with one character in each scene.

Switching POVs doesn't bother me, I like to hear what other characters have to say, especially in first person

good luck!

I don't like switching POVs constantly, but most of the books I read are written that way. So it works for most people, I guess. I prefer first person because of the focus. I don't need to know what everyone in the story is thinking or feeling.

Your question can't really be answered because every reader is different. Just write whatever you want to... write.

Regarding the issue of whether to use 3rd POV or 1st, it really depends on the story and your personal taste. (Myself, I usually prefer 1st POV, and only one POV character, over 3rd Person, especially multiple POV characters in 3rd person though I do read some great stories in limited 3rd Person, usually with one or two POV characters. Your taste may be different.)

Regarding the POV changes, it really depends, again, on the story. Also, how well it is written.

Look at some of your favorite books. How often do they change POV characters? Does it irritate you when they change often? How does the books handle POV change? Every few scenes? When something big is happening? When something important happen to one particular character? Every chapter?

When you do make a character transition, if you want the POV to remain only with that character, then you need to be mindful of writing everything in that scene through only that person's thoughts, feelings, and actions. You don't want to be talking about Mary in one sentence, and then John's feelings the next. (Unless she's a mind-reading alien or something, lol.)

My writing is very character - driven, so I usually go with limited third person. But it's all up to what works best for the story and how the writer feels most comfortable.

chiragthewriter said:

Don't know how it turned into a steak discussion but anyways thanks guys.

I was thinking of going first person but was concerned that other characters' feeling won't be presented well enough....?

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Depends how well you can write:

maybe your MC is pretty damn astute, and that includes reading other characters. that would show in the writing.

maybe they're clueless, and therefore something of an unreliable narrator, but you get the other characters' moods, feelings, etc. anyway as the reader, because you're not as obtuse as the MC.


either way can, and has, been done many times in first.


and I also favor steak rare, anywhere from tartare for lean cuts to medium-rare for fatty stuff like prime rib, but always at least some pink if I can help it

I've got a mix, and it was the story itself that dictated which one to go with. The first story is a sci-fi. Almost all of the "action" happens right around the MC, and I didn't want to show the antag's POV because that would give too much away. Also, it's told as a story that the MC tells, and he wouldn't be talking about himself in the 3rd. I've got a little nit of 3rd to frame it, and the main body of the story is in 1st past. The second one is a historic with stuff happening all over the place with multiple POVs. I actually throw in a little 3rd Omni to go with the 3rd close. The last one is urban fantasy, and I really like the feel of 1st present for that, because it gives it more of a contemporary feel, and there's a suddenness to the stuff that pops up that I think I'd lose going past or 3rd.

thelastwordsmith said:

I don't like switching POVs constantly, but most of the books I read are written that way. So it works for most people, I guess. I prefer first person because of the focus. I don't need to know what everyone in the story is thinking or feeling.

Your question can't really be answered because every reader is different. Just write whatever you want to... write.

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Which books change pov constantly? Head hopping is generally frowned upon by editors and confusing to readers (unless handled very carefully in order to create a specific effect). In my experience, most examples people give of writers who change pov frequently (or at all) within scenes turn out to be written in omniscient third, not limited (so they're in the pov of the godlike narrator, not ever a character).

quicklime said:

simply put, there is no universal.

many folks have opinions, but even that isn't uniform...you might as well be asking "Medium-rare or well-done, which is a better steak?"

you use either when they work best for you.

Click to expand...

I agree. It's all opinion. I really dislike reading first person POV. When I open the pages and encounter that when I'm browsing, I am not likely to purchase that novel. I am sure that for every one of me there is a person with the opposite opinion and plenty of people have no preference. So I write what I like to read. That's third person for me.

One of the greatest exponents of first person writing was Raymond Chandler, but if you study his writing, it works mainly because the reader becomes so totally saturated in the persona of Marlowe and his responses to other characters and events that any other POV would seem intrusive. First person works well when a single MC is involved on an ongoing problem, where the solution and the journey towards it matter more than the narrowed perspective the POV offers. Of course, it's possible to write in first person from the POV of several characters, each taken in turn, but why bother? I don't think first person works where the canvass is broader and the story has several facets and, perhaps, a number of MCs.. I can't imagine Joe Abercrombie writing books like "The Blade Itself" in the first person, or G R R M. So, really, it's a question of "horses for courses." If your story is of the kind which lends itself to first person narrative, go for it. If not, stick with third.

Calder said:

I don't think first person works where the canvass is broader and the story has several facets and, perhaps, a number of MCs.. I can't imagine Joe Abercrombie writing books like "The Blade Itself" in the first person, or G R R M. So, really, it's a question of "horses for courses." If your story is of the kind which lends itself to first person narrative, go for it. If not, stick with third.

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Actually, I can imagine The First Law trilogy in multi first. The author did such a good job of making the narrative voice different for each pov character, he could have pulled it off, I think. It worked just fine the way it was, though.

I remember reading in his blog (or maybe it was an interview somewhere) that in the version of The Blade Itself Abercrombie originally subbed had Dogman's pov in first (the others in limited third still). His editor felt that keeping it this way would mislead the readers into thinking Dogman was the main protagonist, more important than the others, so he changed it to limited third during revisions, trying to keep the voice and style as close to first as possible.

I don't feel that George RR Martin's novels would work in first, however. There are so darned many pov characters, and he spends a lot more time with some than others. And his style of limited third is a bit more distant. There's some character voice in the narratives, but it's more muted.

I love first-person narratives because they make me ride around inside a character and learn what's going on with them. It makes me feel very invested in that person and makes for a lot of empathy. But I also enjoy limited third narratives when they do something similar. Omniscient can be fun too, if the narrator themselves has a great voice and adds just the right blend of insight and mystery to things.

Rowling hit the right notes there for me, as did Adams and Pratchett. One reason I've had trouble getting really pulled into Scott Lynch's books, though, is because the omniscient he uses feels a bit like it comes between me and the characters' emotions. It's frustrating, because I love his blog, and they're the kinds of fantasy novels I should like in terms of world building and story type.