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Thread: NineStar Press

  1. #51
    paranormal interest Jennifer Robins's Avatar
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    I'm sure they are busy, and I'm willing to wait as usual. Thanks Filigree.

  2. #52
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer Robins View Post
    Its been four weeks now for me. Haven't heard anything yet. I really like the name of this pub, for very personal reasons, so dear to my heart. It seemed like an omen to sub to them.
    I heard about them for my novella in a few days, but its getting close to two months I've been waiting for my novel. Like Filigree said, they are busy, and I'm guessing the longer the project, the longer it is going to take them to decide.

  3. #53
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
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    I'm sort of curious if their contract improved since I submitted to them. They made me an offer for a novella, but their base contract was just unacceptable to me, and they wouldn't negotiate it at all, likely because I don't have a name in the industry. I mean, there are certain unfairnesses I'm prepaired to deal with in contracts, of course, but the one they offered me had some deal breakers that I just really couldn't accept (e.g. they retained the right to make content edits against my will). Of course, how much they're willing to negotiate depends on a variety of factors, but I didn't get anywhere with them at all, so I ended up having to reject the offer. I'm not terribly bummed out about this since that novella was something I wrote as an experiement and was never terribly desperate to publish, but some time has passed since then, and I'm curious if they improved their contract at all.

  4. #54
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demiurge View Post
    (e.g. they retained the right to make content edits against my will).
    I don't recall that being in my contract. The only thing they can change without my permission are minor things, like punctuation or grammar, but any content changes have to be agreed upon by both parties before it moves into the final copy editing phase. I didn't try to negotiate, because my piece was barely a novelette (7500 words) and any other place I would have published it would have been a lit mag or e-zine that didn't negotiate anyways. I'd approach things differently if it were a longer work though.

  5. #55
    Mildly Disturbing Filigree's Avatar
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    My contracts for both novella and novel allow me final say on editorial changes. The legal indemnity stuff is pretty much the same as other small presses, something I figure into my business plan. But everyone's mileage may vary.

    This M/M space opera
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  6. #56
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
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    That's good. I guess at least they removed that part from the contract then. Or maybe they have different base contracts which they offer depending on how valuable the author is to them.
    Mine gave them last call on edits, and they wouldn't budge on it when I attempted to negotiate it, claiming that they need to make sure the book is marketable, etc, so they need to have last call. And there was a pretty high early termination fee, which would mean that if they wanted to impliment a change I didn't agree to, they could, and I couldn't even get out of the contract, because I couldn't afford that fee.
    I've definitely seen far better warranty and indeminification clauses than NineStar's, but yeah, none of them are going to be great, so you have to consider them depending on your own situation.
    It's possible it would have all gone swimmingly and none of that would have mattered, but as they say, the contract is not for when everything is great, it's for when things start going to hell, so I decided not to risk it.

  7. #57
    Mildly Disturbing Filigree's Avatar
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    For me, the right reversion processes are the most important part of the deal. If NineStar goes belly-up, as many new small presses do, I get my story back easily and cleanly.

    This M/M space opera
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  8. #58
    Thick Skin Pre-Installed Zombie Fraggle's Avatar
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    Ninestar has an anthology call for submissions out right now that's right in my wheelhouse, but their terms for anthologies are not good.

    • Royalty-split with not even a token advance. Rankings, number of reviews, and some rudimentary mathematics don't add up to much of a payment.
    • Exclusive two-year term, which is great for novels but uncommonly long for short stories/novellas included in anthologies.
    • Rights taken are for ebook, print, and audio formats. One anthology is not in print, and I see no evidence that Ninestar has exploited audio rights for any of their titles to date, anthology or otherwise.


    Compare with a competing LGBTQ+ small press, Less Than Three. (Disclosure: I have one story in a LT3 anthology but am otherwise unaffiliated).

    • Anthologies pay a flat fee of $200 per story.
    • Rights taken are ebook and print only.
    • Three-year term, but it's nonexclusive after six months following publication. At the expiration of those six months, you are free to sell the story to another press/magazine or self-publish. Doesn't get much better than that for a small-press anthology.


    I do love Ninestar's covers, though.

  9. #59
    Mildly Disturbing Filigree's Avatar
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    Yes, one reason I haven't submitted to NSP anthologies. The sales ranks on Amazon aren't strong enough to support royalty-only.

    This M/M space opera
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  10. #60
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    I just signed a short story for one of their anthologies. I don't usually sell shorts without at least a token advance, but this one was "fractured" fairy-tale retelling, which is a very hard sell in the speculative short story market (at least, that is what several of the 17 editors who rejected it told me). Plus, the NineStar's editors are really good to work with.

    Zombie Fraggle - I'll check out Less Than Three. It does sound like they are a good deal for short stories

  11. #61
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaraC View Post
    I just signed a short story for one of their anthologies. I don't usually sell shorts without at least a token advance, but this one was "fractured" fairy-tale retelling, which is a very hard sell in the speculative short story market (at least, that is what several of the 17 editors who rejected it told me). Plus, the NineStar's editors are really good to work with.

    Zombie Fraggle - I'll check out Less Than Three. It does sound like they are a good deal for short stories
    One thing to note -- I just checked out LT3 and that $200 is for a novella length anthology submission. It doesn't seem like such a deal. The story I just signed with NineStar is 3,000, although their call was originally for longer stories too.

    $200 would be great for a 3,000 word story...I've sold stories of that length for anywhere between $10 and $300 to lit mags and anthologies.

    For a 30,000 word story? I'm not sure...

  12. #62
    Thick Skin Pre-Installed Zombie Fraggle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaraC View Post
    One thing to note -- I just checked out LT3 and that $200 is for a novella length anthology submission. It doesn't seem like such a deal. The story I just signed with NineStar is 3,000, although their call was originally for longer stories too.

    $200 would be great for a 3,000 word story...I've sold stories of that length for anywhere between $10 and $300 to lit mags and anthologies.

    For a 30,000 word story? I'm not sure...
    That is incorrect.

    They don't even have an anthology call out at the moment, so I think you're conflating their short-story anthologies with their novella collections. The call for 20,000- to 60,000-word stories is a collection of novellas, sold separately and for which LT3's standard royalty system applies. Here's the current novella collection call: https://www.lessthanthreepress.com/collection-calls/

    Here's a Wayback Machine snapshot of their last short-story anthology call. The short stories are minimum 10,000-words, maximum 20,000-words, for a flat-fee of $200. https://web.archive.org/web/20170102...y-submissions/
    My story (not in this particular anthology volume) came in at 10,500-words.

    I wish you the best of luck with your Ninestar story. I'll be interested to hear what kind of sales numbers the anthology pulls down, if you are willing to share that information when the time comes.

    ETA: I just looked up Ninestar's current anthology call (Teacher's Pet), which asks for stories in the 7,000- to 30,000-word range (but will also consider other lengths). Their submissions FAQ states that for multi-author anthologies, they "pay each author an equal share of 50% of the download prices from our website and 50% of the net royalties from third-party vendors."

    Sticking to the stated range, that means an author who submits a 30,000-word story will receive the same royalty as an author who submits a 7,000-word story. Most anthologies I've submitted to that had such a wide word-count range either paid escalating flat-fees for sub-ranges within the overall range, or they paid royalties to the contributing authors based on each story's percentage of the volume's total word count.
    Last edited by Zombie Fraggle; 07-23-2017 at 01:40 AM.

  13. #63
    Oooh, neat to see this thread active again!

    Ninestar signed my entire f/f space opera trilogy. The first is out (its linked in my siggy), and the next comes out in October. Thus far I'm nothing but please with them. Their communication is great, the covers are gorgeous, and the sales are about what I'd expect from a small press. As with any small or medium press, you have to do a fair amount of your own marketing or you won't get good sales. I hear that's becoming more common with big presses, too, so there's that.

    Anyway, if anyone has any questions about Ninestar that haven't already been answered, I'm happy to chat.

  14. #64
    paranormal interest Jennifer Robins's Avatar
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    Still waiting on my novel. It's been a little over two months.

  15. #65
    practical experience, FTW Cobalt Jade's Avatar
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    Thanks for the updated info. I have a story brewing for Teacher's Pet.

  16. #66
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
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    Jennifer, that is strange. I suggest e-mailing to ask about it. It's still within the time frame, but usually you would've heard. Hm.

  17. #67
    paranormal interest Jennifer Robins's Avatar
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    Thanks, I'll do that.

  18. #68
    paranormal interest Jennifer Robins's Avatar
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    I asked and was told I have no LGBTQA characters in the story. I really didn't think that matter, but I guess it does. I don't think I'll be getting a contract for this one. I'll have to send it out somewhere else.

  19. #69
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer Robins View Post
    I asked and was told I have no LGBTQA characters in the story. I really didn't think that matter, but I guess it does. I don't think I'll be getting a contract for this one. I'll have to send it out somewhere else.
    Their guidelines specifically say it needs to gave LGBTQA and they say this "Please note that submissions that do not include a complete manuscript or do not have LGBTQIA+ main characters will be deleted."

    Their guidelines make it pretty clear that it matters.

  20. #70
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie Fraggle View Post
    That is incorrect.

    They don't even have an anthology call out at the moment, so I think you're conflating their short-story anthologies with their novella collections. The call for 20,000- to 60,000-word stories is a collection of novellas, sold separately and for which LT3's standard royalty system applies. Here's the current novella collection call: https://www.lessthanthreepress.com/collection-calls/

    Here's a Wayback Machine snapshot of their last short-story anthology call. The short stories are minimum 10,000-words, maximum 20,000-words, for a flat-fee of $200. https://web.archive.org/web/20170102...y-submissions/
    My story (not in this particular anthology volume) came in at 10,500-words.

    I wish you the best of luck with your Ninestar story. I'll be interested to hear what kind of sales numbers the anthology pulls down, if you are willing to share that information when the time comes.

    ETA: I just looked up Ninestar's current anthology call (Teacher's Pet), which asks for stories in the 7,000- to 30,000-word range (but will also consider other lengths). Their submissions FAQ states that for multi-author anthologies, they "pay each author an equal share of 50% of the download prices from our website and 50% of the net royalties from third-party vendors."

    Sticking to the stated range, that means an author who submits a 30,000-word story will receive the same royalty as an author who submits a 7,000-word story. Most anthologies I've submitted to that had such a wide word-count range either paid escalating flat-fees for sub-ranges within the overall range, or they paid royalties to the contributing authors based on each story's percentage of the volume's total word count.
    I was confusing the two, but 10,000 words isn't a short story, that is a novelette.

    Most of my short stories fall well below 10K...so unless they were flexible that still wouldn't work. Honestly, flash fiction is more my thing, and neither press does that.

    I can see the split being unfair though for the person who wrote 10K words for ninestar's anthology and gets the same cut as me, who wrote a 2k story.

  21. #71
    practical experience, FTW SaraC's Avatar
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    They have had one of my novel's for over three months and I queried...they said I should hear this week. Fingers crossed!

  22. #72
    paranormal interest Jennifer Robins's Avatar
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    Yes, SaraC, I knew that, but I thought they had another division as well.

  23. #73
    Mildly Disturbing Filigree's Avatar
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    They have a YA division, I believe, but it has the same restriction of LGBTQIA characters. It's understandable they'd want to specialize, since there are so many publishers (both mainstream and in erom small press) that focus more on cishet characters.

    It can be confusing and demoralizing for someone who writes both, since we're basically asked to choose one focus and ditch the others--or self-pub.

    This M/M space opera
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  24. #74
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
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    I have three stories coming out with NSP in 2018. One is a novella (April release), one is a novella in an anthology (January), and another is a sci-fi novel (January).

    I obviously can't comment on anything post-release, but I've really loved NSP so far. I don't think I'll earn much of anything from my fairy tale novella in their anthology, but personally, that doesn't concern me very much. It was fun to write and I see it as a way to gain experience and develop a reputation that might help support my novel sales.

    Their communication is fantastic. I always feel up-to-date and any time I email an editor I get a reply within a day.

    They are starting to produce audiobooks now, by the way. They've done an experiment with a novel by J.C. Long and have now opened it up to other novels, so you'll see more of those in the future.

  25. #75
    Mildly Disturbing Filigree's Avatar
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    I admire NineStar enough to probably give them a 20-year labor of love in about six days. It's a calculated risk, but at the worst case outcome it sets up the book for later self-pub.

    I'm just waiting on the last agent with a full. She's a bit distracted right now and has a rep for being a slow responder, so I've already let her know the mms will be withdrawn October 1.

    So yes, I'm inclined to trust NSP more than some older small presses.

    This M/M space opera
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