The Daily Rejection, Vol. 2

I scanned through MSWL a little, but it seems that when agents get an idea in their heads about something they want, it's often fairly specific. That almost seems like a negative if my work doesn't match their picture. I've heard a number of stories from others about this—it causes extra frustration when you think you're giving them what they asked for and they form-reject it anyway.

Wow, everybody is soooo productive. Actually, me too. I've finished Chapter Ten on the Shiny. I'm hoping to write straight through August and surprise myself with accomplishing a shockingly high word count. Well, RWA is over and editors should be back to work. Maybe I'll hear something this week?

OK guys, I have two conundrums:

1) Agent A requested a partial in early June. Normally, I give folks 3 months before nudging on partial or full, BUT according to some folks on QT, she's generally quick to respond to partials. So I'm wondering if I should nudge to make sure she even received mine (she sent no confirmation; I didn't worry about it at the time, as not all agents send them)... Or should I wait the full three months? (It'll be 2 next week)

2) Agent B has had my partial since mid-April. I nudged once, about a month ago, and got a prompt, really nice/polite/professional response from an assistant, apologizing for the delay and saying that my MS is still in their queue and coming up 'shortly.' I realize 'shortly' in Agent-speak doesn't mean the same thing as in regular English, but... Any thoughts on if/when I should nudge again? The agency has a lovely track record of not leaving people hanging.

Thoughts? Words of wisdom?

MC: I'm not sure there is a correct answer. I'll give you words, and you can decide if they are "of wisdom." Agent A -- I'd nudge because she's usually quick and you've heard nothing from her. Nothing wrong with seeking confirmation that your work has been received; you wouldn't be seen as a pest. Which brings me to Agent B -- I wouldn't nudge a second time for at least, say, two months. You know they have it. You've been assured it will be read. To nudge a second time in three months seems too much. Have you seen where this agent is in responding to subs? Of course, Query Timeline on QT needs to be taken with a grains of salt, preferably around the rim of a margarita glass. According to it, I've not yet submitted my R&R. When I look at my query history with my agent, everything is there correctly. Computers, huh?

Wendy: looks like you need to write a gritty, erotic, Eastern MS. Get to work. I'd love to read it

Wendy--Congrats on finishing your first draft!

Moonchild--I don't know exactly how to handle either, but I can say what I, as another querying author who is generally very patient and also very concerned about coming across as an annoyance, would do. I personally wouldn't nudge Agent A until 3 months are up, as who knows if she's been excessively busy these last weeks/backed up with reading/something? But I do think, since you didn't get a confirmation email, you probably could nudge to check she received it, and that would be just fine. For Agent B, since you did get confirmation of receipt and even the however questionable claim that it was coming up "shortly," I would probably wait another 3 months. Since I'm exceedingly careful and patient, though, I suspect you could get away with nudging sooner, but I don't know when.

I've been watching MSWL today in hopes of 1) finding agents I hadn't heard of to add to my current query list, and 2) trying to figure out which of my next projects might be the best bet (I mean, I know what agents want now might not be what they want in ~9 months, but eh). So far, 1) has found me 1 agent (who has a poor track record on QT at responding and not a great sales record on PM either, so...), and 2) my current ms apparently has some characteristics of the "hot" stuffs now, but all of my new ideas don't. Makes me not very optimistic for the future if this ms crashes and burns.

MC - I agree with Hathor. For the first one I think it would be okay to check in to make sure she got it. But for the second one I'd probably wait.

Ok so now I have my own question. I had one agent request fulls of my PB and MG novel during pitmad. She asked for a sample final illustration earlier this month. I gave it to her and let her know that I had another MG novel as well. She didn't reply. I'm seeing that she's posting on mswl requests that are exactly on point with my second MG novel. Do I email her again but as a follow up based on her mswl tweets? Or is it too much to email her so soon after my email earlier this month that she didn't reply to?

Hathor said:

Wendy: looks like you need to write a gritty, erotic, Eastern MS. Get to work. I'd love to read it

Click to expand...

Yup. Next MS is going to be about a female assassin from Azerbaijan who experiences Stockholm Syndrome and falls for the rugged Ağac Kişi who has been tasked with torturing her secrets out of her.

Funaek--Not sure I know the answer here, either, but I do know agents generally like to consider one work at a time, and it's bad form to query a second project to an agent who hasn't yet decided on a request. I sort of suspect Agent might not have responded to your comment about your other MG because she wants to decide first on the one she has? And so nudging her to mention said MG matches some of her mswl tweets might not really help anything. But I'm really just guessing.

WendyN said:

Yup. Next MS is going to be about a female assassin from Azerbaijan who experiences Stockholm Syndrome and falls for the rugged Ağac Kişi who has been tasked with torturing her secrets out of her.

Click to expand...

Sounds perfect!

Thanks Ellielle! That's what I was thinking. I just wondered given that she requested two of my pitmad books and now with the mswl tweets. But I'll just wait until she weighs in on the ones she has.

Funaek--I can totally understand wondering, especially since she's already requested two of your books at once, which is pretty unusual (exciting, though!). And I'm no expert, but the way I see it, she'll either offer on the MG novel she has, in which case you can bring up your second book during the call, or she'll reject it, in which case you can wait a month or two, then query the second book and mention it matches her mswl. I don't think mswl stuff expires *that* quickly.

Thanks Hathor, Ellielle and Funaek for sharing your thoughts on my little conundrum. I've decided to just mark Agent B as 'to keep an eye on' for now. If I haven't heard in another 2 months (i.e., a full 3 from my original nudge and their response), I'll check in again. As for Agent A, next week will officially mark 2 months since I sent her the partial. I think I can wait that long to check in--unless I find out in the meantime that she does send confirmation emails, but I doubt it. I've waited this long, I figure another week won't hurt.

Funaek - I agree with Ellielle. Maybe wait and see what she has to say about MG MS #1. Regardless of her answer, you'll then be able to approach her with MG MS #2 (if she rejects #1), or mention it to her (if she offers based on #1 and/or your PB!) Good luck!

WendyN said:

Yup. Next MS is going to be about a female assassin from Azerbaijan who experiences Stockholm Syndrome and falls for the rugged Ağac Kişi who has been tasked with torturing her secrets out of her.

Click to expand...

And you can call it FIFTY SHADES OF GOYCHAY. (Yes, I did take the time to find a list of cities in the country.)

MC, does Agent A give a time frame on her website, or somewhere else? I think you'd be safer to nudge if she herself gives a timeframe of 6-8 weeks (or however long).

Hathor, Wendy, that's kind of funny you both thought Channing was a character's name! The possibility for confusion might be a consideration if/when the title discussion comes up.

angeliz2k said:

MC, does Agent A give a time frame on her website, or somewhere else? I think you'd be safer to nudge if she herself gives a timeframe of 6-8 weeks (or however long).

Click to expand...

Nope. No timeline given anywhere. I've just gathered that she often seems to respond relatively quickly through comments on QT and elsewhere on the web. Nothing official on her profile page on the agency website or on her PM public page.

PS: I also thought Channing was a person's name. Oops!

I just saw that the PitchWar mentors bio/wishlist blog hop begins next Monday. Writer applications to mentors are to be made on Aug. 17th.

Wasn't sure if everyone here was aware of this. We haven't been having any nervous chatter about the contest on this thread.

JJ Litke said:

I scanned through MSWL a little, but it seems that when agents get an idea in their heads about something they want, it's often fairly specific. That almost seems like a negative if my work doesn't match their picture. I've heard a number of stories from others about this—it causes extra frustration when you think you're giving them what they asked for and they form-reject it anyway.

Click to expand...

I've noticed that they're either very specific (I want a YA fantasy set in the American Revolution with a protagonist from a traditionally underrepresented group), or they're so vague that they're almost no use at all, like "I want a fantasy with imaginative world building and unforgettable characters." I mean, are they thinking someone will read that and think, "I guess I won't sub to them, then, since my world building and characters are completely dull"?

And sooo many people on the fantasy list are looking for YA and MG. Is fantasy for adults dead or something? I didn't get the memo

I'm up to almost 12 weeks on a full with a time frame of 8-10, but I really really need to stop myself from nudging. The agent is absolutely lovely and she acknowledged the receipt of my full within a day. She's very active on twitter and I know she's been so busy lately. Must. not. nudge.

Flintlock fantasy is gaining popularity (Stina Leicht's Cold Iron just came out). Can you work in some guns?

JJ Litke said:

Flintlock fantasy is gaining popularity (Stina Leicht's Cold Iron just came out). Can you work in some guns?

Click to expand...

I actually had to look that up. And I still don't quite get what it is, exactly.

JJ Litke said:

Flintlock fantasy is gaining popularity (Stina Leicht's Cold Iron just came out). Can you work in some guns?

Click to expand...

I've got simple firearms in my world, but I wouldn't call it flintlock fantasy. They certainly aren't important enough to the plot to figure into the query or to make it a "gunpowder" or "flintlock" fantasy.

I do mention that my setting is early modern and multicultural in the overview/potential markets line, since so many people say they're looking for settings that don't resemble medieval Europe. But a lot of the time, I get the feeling agents are looking for something based on a specific real world culture that isn't Europe, which sort of defeats the whole purpose of secondary world fantasy, imo.

In fact, my setting doesn't really resemble any one culture in our world, and my three main characters each come from a different fantasy country or culture within theirs.

The hardest part is figuring out how to sneak non-essential world building details that make my world stand out from the pack without making it sound tacked on.

With the long string of little to no interest since those early bites in February, I'm beginning to think that my story might just be the wrong mix of tropes people don't really want to see anymore and subversion of tropes people still like.

Moonchild said:

I actually had to look that up. And I still don't quite get what it is, exactly.

Click to expand...

It's just fantasy with guns (so instead of sword and sorcery it's guns and sorcery). In Brian McClellan's books there are powder mages, who have the ability to affect gunpowder with magic. But I don't think all flintlock fantasies have elements like that.

I agree on the MSWL being either crazy specific or crazy vague. Things like "a romance that will make me swoon!" Well, um, I think I've got that? Maybe? Uh...

I think I'm screwed on Pitch Wars. I was really excited to try for it after doing PitchSlam earlier this year. But then this R&R happened, and if I get into Pitch Wars, I can't submit my MS. I exchanged some PMs with Brenda Drake about my situation, and basically if I finish my R&R and send it back before I got picked on September 1 (assuming I did), then it would be ok. Otherwise, if I get picked, I can't submit to anyone. Which seems to include the agent that's waiting for my R&R, and I think that would be a crappy thing to do. So I think I have to not do Pitch Wars. Which really makes me sad, because once I send back this R&R I was planning to pick up and start querying again with the improved MS. And I was really looking forward to the possibility of having a mentor.

Ah, well. It's not the end of the world, I guess. I'm back to working on my revision, but I don't see finishing by the end of August. Meh. The good news is that the book's up to 75K! It's like a real book now!

Jeneral - sorry about Pitch Wars. But I think that you've made so much progress on your R&R, that it won't matter whether you have a mentor or not: you'll still have a much better book by the end of your revision.

Jeneral said:

I agree on the MSWL being either crazy specific or crazy vague. Things like "a romance that will make me swoon!" Well, um, I think I've got that? Maybe? Uh...

I think I'm screwed on Pitch Wars. I was really excited to try for it after doing PitchSlam earlier this year. But then this R&R happened, and if I get into Pitch Wars, I can't submit my MS. I exchanged some PMs with Brenda Drake about my situation, and basically if I finish my R&R and send it back before I got picked on September 1 (assuming I did), then it would be ok. Otherwise, if I get picked, I can't submit to anyone. Which seems to include the agent that's waiting for my R&R, and I think that would be a crappy thing to do. So I think I have to not do Pitch Wars. Which really makes me sad, because once I send back this R&R I was planning to pick up and start querying again with the improved MS. And I was really looking forward to the possibility of having a mentor.

Ah, well. It's not the end of the world, I guess. I'm back to working on my revision, but I don't see finishing by the end of August. Meh. The good news is that the book's up to 75K! It's like a real book now!

Click to expand...

Jen, how long have you been working on the R+R? Could it possibly wait until the end of PitchWars? I ask because I'm always, always leery of writers holding off on subbing (or, in this case, an awesome-sounding competition) for R+Rs. In an ideal world, they'll accept it and offer rep within 24 hours but I have seen the opposite happen, and, to be frank about the worst-case scenario - which I'm sure won't happen - writers often become so discouraged.

Thank you all for the advice regarding my beta critique! It's been tough, I must admit.

I agree that MSWL requests are not too helpful when it comes down to it, because the agent says they want X but X doesn't necessarily cover all of the bases of what they REALLY want. It's a nice idea, though.

I just received an R on a partial from a really well-respected agent. She says I'm a good writer with an engaging voice, but she lacks the "passion" to be my agent, whatever that really means in agentspeak.