The Daily Rejection, Vol. 2

Oof. After a long stretch of silence, two form R’s on a query, and a third really, really nice personal R from an agent that was super encouraging. Crossing my fingers on the agents that are still hanging onto material they requested.

As silly as it sounds, I’m doing my best to emotionally detach myself from this project. I spent way, way too long writing and revising. I’ll query as many agents as possible, but I’m already into a new WIP which has ignited a bit of hope that even if this project doesn’t make it….at least I already have something in the works.

But until I hear back about my fulls I’ll be hyperventilating in the corner.

Out of curiosity, if your query sucks, does the agent even bother to read your sample pages?

It varies. Some agents have said in interviews that they understand it's the book that matters and not the promotional effort, so they're willing to read the submitted pages if the query doesn't "stick the landing." Other agents have said that if an author can't handle a one page query, that's an indicator of possible bigger problems that would also be relevant to a book, so they'd pass if the query was really terrible and not very professional.

Basically you'd have to look up any particular agent you're curious about and see whether they've indicated what their attitude is in interviews, because there's no "union rule" about how they're expected to approach this.

Shoeless said:

It varies. Some agents have said in interviews that they understand it's the book that matters and not the promotional effort, so they're willing to read the submitted pages if the query doesn't "stick the landing." Other agents have said that if an author can't handle a one page query, that's an indicator of possible bigger problems that would also be relevant to a book, so they'd pass if the query was really terrible and not very professional.

Basically you'd have to look up any particular agent you're curious about and see whether they've indicated what their attitude is in interviews, because there's no "union rule" about how they're expected to approach this.

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+1 this comment. Some use the query as a test, other agents have said they don't even read the query first--they jump to the sample pages immediately because sometimes they get pumped by a great query and are let down by sample pages.

Hey, do you guys remember the exciting not-a-rejection I hinted at a couple of pages back? Well, after a week of absolute high-stress madness (including multiple offers, life-affirming kindness from agents, weird snarky grumpiness from other agents, and having my time treated as worthless by a reputable US agent), I can finally be public with my good news. You've probably guessed it involves an offer of rep, and the details are here, with the successful query over here.

I'll still be hanging around this Circle and cheering you all on, and giving advice if I can. I've seen a few writers from the Next Circle still do, like Cameron and PutPutt, and those folks definitely have the right idea.

For now, one thing I learned from the last week: your time is precious. You all deserve agents who will treat you as equal partners, as their priority, not as second-rate. I saw the some posts about 'publishing time' in the Next Circle, about how hanging around through weeks of silence for agent responses is normal... and nah, it doesn't have to be. It certainly wasn't with the agent I chose.

Keep sending those queries out, lovelies. It took me years and hundreds of the buggers, but as long as you stick with it, you'll get there.

Emermouse said:

Out of curiosity, if your query sucks, does the agent even bother to read your sample pages?

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UK agents are known for putting more weight on the sample pages than the covering letter. Traditional UK format has a very short pitch paragraph in the cover letter (an expanded Twitter pitch, sometimes, but you can go a bit longer) so the traditional process here favours the sample pages.

Some UK agents have moved to a more US-style of querying, though, so it's not something you want to gamble your career on.

I would also add that in some cases, the query is absolutely paramount because a particular agency doesn't even WANT sample pages. For them it ALL hinges on the query and they'll only ask for a partial if they see you can manage that. The agent I ultimately signed with was like that, so I was especially glad I made sure the query as was good as it was going to be before sending it out.

YAAAAAAAAAAY Emaree!!! That's amazing!!!!!!!!!!

Oh hey, I got my stats together for another board and thought you guys might appreciate them too.

Agents queried (2012): 79
Full requests: 4
Partial Requests: 3
Personalised Rs: 6
Offers of rep: 1
Did I jump straight for the first agent that offered? Yes
Was this a good idea? No. No agent truly IS better than a bad agent.

One wasted year later, back in the trenches...

Agents queried (2013): 33
Full requests: 1
Partial: 1
Personalised Rs: 6
Offers of rep: 0

Burnt out from a bad agent, I gave up on that manuscript and made a new one.

Agents queried (2016): 48
Full requests: 9
Kind personalised Rs: 7
Offers of rep: 0

And then I took a break from querying to revise and doubt myself a LOT, circling through revision after revision, before writer buddies convinced me to stop revising and GET BACK IN THE TRENCHES.

Agents queried (2017): 20
Full requests: 6
Offers of rep: 2

...So that's 180 queries sent, four years in the trenches, one schmagent nightmare, and two books: one rewritten from the ground up five times, the second one rewritten from the ground up nine times.


Keep at it. No matter what.

Congrats, EMaree!!!!

And thanks so much for posting your submission stats! It's very heartening.

Congratulations Emaree!!! And thanks so much for sharing those stats. My stomach clenches at 9 full requests and no offers (in 2016), but I'm glad that in the end you found a new agent!

Congrats!!! See you over in the next circle. It's fun. No it's not.

Jeneral said:

Congrats!!! See you over in the next circle. It's fun. No it's not.

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I like to imagine you all around a table loaded high with booze just watching the newbie show up.

'Oh you sweet summer child. Sit down. You'll be here a while.'

That's .... pretty accurate, I think.

Yay, Emaree!

Congratulations, EMaree!!!!! So, so happy for you! What great news in this thread!

Congrats!

My form rejections continue to roll in. I'm at 75 'no's or CNRs for this manuscript. Still have 5 fulls out but by this point I assume they, like the fulls before them, will be rejected.

Keep the faith, Collie, it can take a while. My final stats before getting my agent were over 400 rejections for various novels, and over 140 for the book that landed me my agent. It's not a fast process for most of us.

I'm waiting to hear on two short stories submitted to anthologies. One I signed a contract for, but have yet to be paid, and haven't heard from the publisher about the definitive release date (which was supposed to be Decemerish-Januaryish.) The other I was told was shortlisted, but that was about a month ago. I hope for concrete good news on both.

Oh shit, I just got a full request from a query I sent in March, but I've edited the opening since then and now even though I know I've read this advice many times before it's flown from my brain and I can't remember how to respond without sounding like a fool like I do right now!!!

So, what's the proper way to phrase that? "I thought you'd never ask, no seriously, I thought you'd never ask so I started editing and potentially wrecked what you liked about it." I'm pretty sure that's not right.

A little help, please?

Congrats on the full request! I think you'll be fine. If you only submitted some opening pages, or they asked for a partial, and they're only now making a request for the entire novel, the only thing you really need to do when you submit is thank them, of course, and acknowledge that you've done some editing since the initial submission, so there are changes to the opening. No agent is going to freak out just because you've been tinkering a bit, and this probably isn't the last time you'll have to tinker anyway, since the agent will probably be giving you editorial suggestions anyway should a decision be made to take you on.

Shoeless said:

Congrats on the full request! I think you'll be fine. If you only submitted some opening pages, or they asked for a partial, and they're only now making a request for the entire novel, the only thing you really need to do when you submit is thank them, of course, and acknowledge that you've done some editing since the initial submission, so there are changes to the opening. No agent is going to freak out just because you've been tinkering a bit, and this probably isn't the last time you'll have to tinker anyway, since the agent will probably be giving you editorial suggestions anyway should a decision be made to take you on.

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It was the first chapter, which is only seven pages.

Rats, I was set to talk to an agent next week who's critiquing the opening (part of a fundraiser auction deal). So I thought I'd wait for that to start querying again (I only sent out 14 on the first round in the spring, then stopped to do rewrites). I feel weird sending out a full without being in Active Querying Mode.

Thanks, Shoeless. Feeling a little calmer now.

Congrats, EMaree and JJ!

No new activity since my last rejection on September 24, but I still haven't resubbed the last two stories that were kicked back to me. So still have 3 short stories I'm waiting to hear on, plus a long novella (50K).

The novella's been at two publishers since the beginning of August, one of whom uses Submittable and marked it 'In Progress' more than a week ago.

Before the end of the week I'll try to get those rejected short stories subbed to new places. I have a bad habit of giving up after a handful of rejections, and am trying to fight it this time.

You've got this JJ! Exactly as Shoeless says. With any luck the agent will reread the new pages and go, "Egads, her editing is brilliant, clearly she's a genius I must sign her AT THIS MOMENT!" and then you'll have a fantabulous agent in no time.

....A girl can dream, right?