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Erotica Tropes and Cliches!

Thread starter RosyMaylor
Start date May 1, 2015

RosyMaylor

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May 1, 2015

#1

What erotica tropes and cliches do you love, hate, hate to love or love to hate?

Mostly I just want to get to know you guys and maybe entice some of the lurkers out of the shadows!

Okay, so the other night I was reading an excerpt by a published author in which a) the heroine repeatedly put herself down as not being attractive enough to catch the hero's attention b) resorted to extreme hyperbole to describe her attraction to the hero "My heart rate increased to near fatal degrees!" c) it was obvious the hero was going to be obsessed with her regardless d) the hero was described as "stalking through the room like panther or other large predatory cat" and e) all of this was within seconds of the cute meet.

I was nearly crying with laughter and my partner asked me what was so funny? Ever since he's been stalking around our apartment making cat noises and checking in with me to see if I need CPR to deal with all the sexy.

When was the last time you just-couldn't-even and had to stop reading? What tropes make you cry with laughter or see red?

dangerousbill

Retired Illuminatus

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May 1, 2015

#2

Where to start? Virtually all of erotica is tropes and cliches (which, to be sure, are very different things).

In my own ~~kink~~ subgenre of female domination, the chief cliche is the cold-hearted bitch with opera hose, a Nazi hat, and a dungeon full of torture devices. It succeeds because there are men whose fantasies revolve around cruel women.

Another cliche is the secret island/castle/dungeon/club, where the rules of civilization don't hold. Naked men crawl around on their knees, serve as coffee tables and hassocks, and are whipped at arbitrary intervals just for fun. Here, the prospect of total loss of power is the attraction to male readers.

These cliches serve large markets, but the one thing they have in common is that they live almost no room for character development, and accordingly, one story is pretty much the same as another. The fact that they continue to sell indicates the power of these cliches with men of a certain bent.

It must be pretty obvious by now that I try to avoid these. I like to make my stories into a voyage of discovery for the participants, male and female, where they find new dimensions of themselves.

Last edited: May 1, 2015

ElaineA

All about that action, boss.

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May 1, 2015

#3

RosyMaylor said:
Mostly I just want to get to know you guys and maybe entice some of the lurkers out of the shadows!

I'm not an erotica threads regular but, Hi Rosy, nice to meet ya.

RosyMaylor said:
Okay, so the other night I was reading an excerpt by a published author in which a) the heroine repeatedly put herself down as not being attractive enough to catch the hero's attention

This made me sad. I saw an editor tweet about it the other day and I was like, is that really a thing? I've read scads of historical romance where the FMC thinks of herself as not attractive, but I can't think of a time where her thought process was "I'm not pretty enough for him and I am worthless and I want him so bad." Most of the time it's "he'd never look at me, meh" which is on the same spectrum, I guess, but not so self-destructive-feeling?

I don't have any tropes/cliches to contribute, though I agree with you, over-description is a nose-wrinkler for me...even though I'm prone to it in first drafts... :Shrug:

:Shrug:

RosyMaylor

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May 1, 2015

#4

Ha! Yeah, kidnap/damsel in distress fantasies offer a similar wish fulfillment fantasy in my neck of the woods. Although women's submissive fantasies pretty much always end with a happily ever after even if the guy's a jerk. It's all okay because -- love.

And I can definitely see the appeal of pure fantasy.

In my own stories I prefer more realistic characters and consensual antics. And humor! Real life BDSM is best practiced with a sense of humor.

I agree about the voyage of discovery too. There's a whole world of insight when you go down that rabbit hole and so many opportunities to write about them go by the wayside when all the focus is on ripped muscles and heaving bosoms and billionaires. Don't get me started on the billionaires.

Now I'm curious to read your stories!

RosyMaylor

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May 1, 2015

#5

@ElaineA It's so a thing. And yes, it's sad.

RosyMaylor

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May 1, 2015

#6

@ElaineA Also, I'm more forgiving of it too in a historical setting because women were brought up to believe their place in society was mostly decorative. Haven't we progressed beyond that now? Some insecurity is human, but most often it comes across as shallow and immature.

Maryn

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May 2, 2015

#7

Yet don't we all know women who feel that way about themselves, justified or not? Done well, it could add realism. Done poorly, it's like anything else done poorly.

Maryn, who uses a version of this at times--she hopes not poorly

WriterDude

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May 2, 2015

#8

Maryn said:
Yet don't we all know women who feel that way about themselves, justified or not? Done well, it could add realism. Done poorly, it's like anything else done poorly.

Maryn, who uses a version of this at times--she hopes not poorly

I was given to believe that this was the case for most women, and quite a lot of men too, and that this insecurity is cultivated to the benefit of the fashion and cosmetics industries.

Pisco Sour

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May 2, 2015

#9

Whizzbangs so thick you can't fit your fingers around them and women so "tight" you wonder how they manage to pee everyday.

Now, I will confess I am guilty of writing the above, or variations of, but I WILL reform! In my current wip I shall replace the baseball bats with ping pong handles; loosen up my heroine so her walls flap like wild west saloon doors.

But I refuse to give up my stalking panthers, lions, crocodiles...

Ravioli

Crazy Cat Lady

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May 2, 2015

#10

The hyperboles you described.

Insecure females vs. perfect "breathtaking" males

General physical perfection; has there ever been a fat heroine?

Cheezy, toenail-curling descriptions of body, bodily functions, and secretions, such as exploding in a glittering waterfall of love juices.

And either too cutesy, too vulgar, or too clinical terms for body part. I need neither meat flaps, love portals, nor labia minora, really. Dunno what the best word would be, but it's not those.

Also, get away from me with those one-second seductions where there was nothing between the two, and after a page of "OMG are you feeling the heat going up?" they are suddenly f*cking till the cows come home and madly in love as well.

Maryn

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May 2, 2015

#11

My most recent novel has a heroine who's slightly overweight and not at all fashionable. She's older, too. And, to the character she's intimate with, totally smokin'.

It's amusing to me that so many of us read really awful erotica. Why would we, when there's better out there? Is it because we can't tell it from the bad stuff?

Maryn, who won't read crap any more

RosyMaylor

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May 2, 2015

#12

@Maryn and WriterDude: Yes, we all have insecurities! I think the reason it sometimes rubs me the wrong way, and I just realized this, is that I believe self-esteem and body issues are complex. I don't like the quick solve of, "Okay now a hero comes along who finds this woman attractive, so now she has permission to love herself." It's shallow -- surely self esteem is more than looks? And it's also sexist. Like this woman's entire self worth is based on a man's opinion? It just turns me off. And I see it a lot.

@Pisco Sour lmao

@Naiem Is it okay if I use Glittering Waterfalls of Love Juices as the title of my next WIP? And yes, the insta-love is, in my humble opinion, lazy. Lazy writers writing for lazy readers. (Unless you're Shakespeare. Then you get a free pass.)

Just saw a George Orwell quote on twitter, "Never use a metaphor or simile you are used to seeing in print." Generally, seems like good advice! I'll attempt to take it.

I think that's what made me laugh so hard at the excerpt. Everything in it was something I'd read before, many times. It could have been satire, it was all so exaggerated. Or maybe it just struck me that way because I read too much within the genre?

When it comes to erotica (and all genres really?), isn't that the market? People read a lot of the kinds of fiction they enjoy. So I know it's hard work to come up with metaphors and similes (and plots and conflicts and characters) people haven't seen a million times before. And maybe some writers actually think they are being original, because they don't read much?

I don't want to be too negative! A lot of this stuff falls into the "love to hate and hate to love" category. I'm a fan of preposterous cute meets and improbable scenarios generally. Keeps things interesting.

RosyMaylor

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May 2, 2015

#13

@Maryn Amen to that!

RosyMaylor

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May 2, 2015

#14

I really need to figure out how to do that "insert quote" thing the rest of you are doing... Sorry if my replies are confusing! I'll look go look it up.

Maryn

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May 2, 2015

#15

If I can do it, you'll have no trouble. I'm that low-tech older relative everybody has.

To multiquote, mentioning all or part of several posts in your own, use the button at the lower right that looks like a quotation mark on all but the last one you'll quote. For that one, use the Quote button in the same area.

As a courtesy to the dial-up folks--and AW has plenty, plus people who pay on various plans where more text costs more--we urge people to delete all but the part they're replying to, with something along the lines of <snip> to show text is removed, if it's not obvious.

There, don't you feel smarter already?

Maryn, who gardened and is still red-faced from exertion

ElaineA

All about that action, boss.

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May 2, 2015

#16

RosyMaylor said:
Just saw a George Orwell quote on twitter, "Never use a metaphor or simile you are used to seeing in print." Generally, seems like good advice! I'll attempt to take it.

Seems like it, and yet sometimes I find myself getting uncomfortable at the contortions authors make to say something ordinary in unique ways. It's all in the execution, though, as always. I recently read a literary erotic flash piece describing breasts "small and peaked like meringues" and it was such a startling description. It totally worked in context, even though out of context here it looks kind of funny.

CraftyFox

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May 3, 2015

#17

I want to throw the book when it's discovered that the reason the character (M or F) like to practice BDSM is due to childhood abuse. I understand the need for a secret or conflict to carry the story but why demonize and stereotype people who practice?

Has anyone noticed how some novels have hidden or not so hidden links to other popular books? In the novel I'm currently reading the MC is at an art show, she's just met the Hero and she storms away from him taking 50 steps, when she looks up she's staring at a naked portrait of a woman painted in shades of grey. Really? Really!

Ravioli

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May 3, 2015

#18

CraftyFox said:
Has anyone noticed how some novels have hidden or not so hidden links to other popular books? In the novel I'm currently reading the MC is at an art show, she's just met the Hero and she storms away from him taking 50 steps, when she looks up she's staring at a naked portrait of a woman painted in shades of grey. Really? Really!

Oh, I have quite a few Doctor Who references in mine. While my MC is letting his attending take adventage of him (too lazy to argue), he's distracting himself looking at one of the Leonid Afremov giclees on the wall and discovers a "big blue box with bright white windows" added to the painting. Such an Afremov vandalization exists, actually.
I think I also have a 50 Shades reference in there somewhere, but I can't quite recall what and where.

CraftyFox

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May 3, 2015

#19

I admit that one particular reference pulled me out of the scene. I think it's fun to find references to pop culture and other novels.. I have a few geeky references in my novel too "our princess is in another castle" is a quote from the antagonist.

RosyMaylor

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May 4, 2015

#20

Maryn said:
If I can do it, you'll have no trouble. I'm that low-tech older relative everybody has.

To multiquote, mentioning all or part of several posts in your own, use the button at the lower right that looks like a quotation mark on all but the last one you'll quote. For that one, use the Quote button in the same area.

As a courtesy to the dial-up folks--and AW has plenty, plus people who pay on various plans where more text costs more--we urge people to delete all but the part they're replying to, with something along the lines of <snip> to show text is removed, if it's not obvious.

There, don't you feel smarter already?

Maryn, who gardened and is still red-faced from exertion

Thanks! Okay, giving it a try!

RosyMaylor

Registered

May 4, 2015

#21

CraftyFox said:
I want to throw the book when it's discovered that the reason the character (M or F) like to practice BDSM is due to childhood abuse. I understand the need for a secret or conflict to carry the story but why demonize and stereotype people who practice?

Has anyone noticed how some novels have hidden or not so hidden links to other popular books? In the novel I'm currently reading the MC is at an art show, she's just met the Hero and she storms away from him taking 50 steps, when she looks up she's staring at a naked portrait of a woman painted in shades of grey. Really? Really!

Oh my God, yes! It was vomit inducing enough in the Book Whose Name We Shall Not Speak. I was just thinking today about how it makes me sad that I don't see myself or my friends in the depictions of kinksters in popular media. I just don't relate to the prevailing stereotypes. And I know so many kinksters! It's ridiculous how far off the mark it can get.

lmao No way on the whole 50 steps thing. I can't even. Also, I feel like there's some kind of sisterhood of the traveling plum dress going on... It shows up everywhere.

RosyMaylor

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May 4, 2015

#22

In my current WIP there's a Star Wars reference. I would enjoy a good Dr Who joke if it was well timed. Why not? But then the more humor the better as far as I'm concerned!

WriterDude

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May 5, 2015

#23

NaeimGiladisLegacy said:
Oh, I have quite a few Doctor Who references in mine. While my MC is letting his attending take adventage of him (too lazy to argue), he's distracting himself looking at one of the Leonid Afremov giclees on the wall and discovers a "big blue box with bright white windows" added to the painting. Such an Afremov vandalization exists, actually.
I think I also have a 50 Shades reference in there somewhere, but I can't quite recall what and where.

You can't have too many Dr Who references..

I try to avoid clichés as much as possible and the ones about the insecure, and most likely spectacled woman, getting down with the hunk is a proper turn off. Last thing I want read is another meathead getting my share of the wimins

I much prefer to tell a tale of everyday folk with everyday frailties, though I recognise there is a market for beautiful rich people having all the fun.

ETA
That Leonid Afremov giclees comment took me googling and found some fab tardis art on pintrest.

Last edited: May 5, 2015

Ravioli

Crazy Cat Lady

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May 5, 2015

#24

WriterDude said:
You can't have too many Dr Who references..

I try to avoid clichés as much as possible and the ones about the insecure, and most likely spectacled woman, getting down with the hunk is a proper turn off. Last thing I want read is another meathead getting my share of the wimins

I much prefer to tell a tale of everyday folk with everyday frailties, though I recognise there is a market for beautiful rich people having all the fun.

ETA
That Leonid Afremov giclees comment took me googling and found some fab tardis art on pintrest.

I think I need to trim'em down though, although... they all, always, fit. It's not like, I sit there wrecking my brain all like, "Hmm, where can I force in a Doctor Who reference? How can I stir the scene towards a Doctor Who line so I can make this story popular with my fellow geeks?". I'm just writing away, and suddenly - OMG ISN'T THAT DOCTOR WHO OMFG!!!

As I write a lot of M/M stuff, another thing I noticed and got tired of, is the whiny li'l .... / morose twink who's always sniveling, especially when he takes the "huge, fat manhood" he likes so much, up where he likes it so much, so why is he crying? Why does he need cuddling? This is mostly a manga trope though.

But as we're talking whiny twinks, regardless of gender, I hate it when the author obviously wanted some pedo action, but for obvious reasons couldn't do it. So the child is in a vertically disabled adult's body, responds like a child, talks like a child, is innocent and naive like a child, snivels like a child, hurts like a child's small body would, but it's an adult. Yeah, now, the better authors may pull this off as an immature young adult, but chances are, you're busted and the story just got ruined by insulting reader intelligence.
My youngest sexually active character is 17. Thing is, that's 1 year above the national age of consent, and the fact that she acts about it like an 11-year-old is because she's overall immature and a complete bimbo.

RosyMaylor said:
@Naiem Is it okay if I use Glittering Waterfalls of Love Juices as the title of my next WIP? And yes, the insta-love is, in my humble opinion, lazy. Lazy writers writing for lazy readers. (Unless you're Shakespeare. Then you get a free pass.)

You may not, unless you warn me not to buy that title :tongue

:tongue

To the BDSM childhood abuse trope: just as kinksters and BDSMers, leave hookers the hell alone with those unsolicited pity parties. Many do it for the fun, or at least for the money, not because they have daddy issues, got raped, or want to feel lufft.

NonieMaus

Un Petit Chou

Registered

May 5, 2015

#25

dangerousbill said:
Where to start? Virtually all of erotica is tropes and cliches (which, to be sure, are very different things).

In my own ~~kink~~ subgenre of female domination, the chief cliche is the cold-hearted bitch with opera hose, a Nazi hat, and a dungeon full of torture devices. It succeeds because there are men whose fantasies revolve around cruel women.

Another cliche is the secret island/castle/dungeon/club, where the rules of civilization don't hold. Naked men crawl around on their knees, serve as coffee tables and hassocks, and are whipped at arbitrary intervals just for fun. Here, the prospect of total loss of power is the attraction to male readers.

These cliches serve large markets, but the one thing they have in common is that they live almost no room for character development, and accordingly, one story is pretty much the same as another. The fact that they continue to sell indicates the power of these cliches with men of a certain bent.

It must be pretty obvious by now that I try to avoid these. I like to make my stories into a voyage of discovery for the participants, male and female, where they find new dimensions of themselves.

I'm a fan of BDSM erotica, both male and female dominant. I seriously dislike femdom where the woman is cruel and inflicts pain as a sort of punishment on all men. Real BDSM is not meant to cause pain-pain but pleasure-pain. If the sub isn't enjoying it, it isn't erotic. I've come across too many stories on Amazon where it's more of revenge fantasies than consensual, mutually appreciated sex.

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