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YouWriteOn.com / New Generation Publishing / Legend Press

Anna Magdalena

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I also find it interesting that the Arts Council thinks that just because there's a 'hunger' for something, it's a good thing to supply it even if you're not actually qualified or experienced to do so. Did they not check before they freely handed over our, the tax-payers', hard earned cash? The mind boggles.
 

HJW

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You can't do that to me HJW!

I have curious mind; now I'll be tormented all night!

Ha! I was just saying that knowing how the system works, there's proably very little point complaining to a government department, but that if anyone does do this, it would probably more effective to do it via your local MP.
 

qwerty

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Did they not check before they freely handed over our, the tax-payers', hard earned cash? The mind boggles.

Presumably not. And, thereafter, they apparently don't concern themselves.

Quote from an email received from an AC officer dated 5th September 2006:

"As funders of YouWriteOn.com, we have a limited role in, or influence on, the day-to-day management of the site and its forums. If there is clear evidence that discrimination is taking place, or the site is no longer doing what was agreed after the funding application, we can attempt to change this, but we do not, as a rule, enter into disputes between project managers and customers/clients."

(Edward used to work in a Citizens Advice Bureau and sees his work as being about information and empowerment.)

Can anyone tell me what the bolded bit means? Other than he was empowered to act as he chooses.
 

qwerty

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Interesting link, gothic. So now we know: "Legend Press has shrugged off criticism of its print-on-demand project with YouWriteOn.com"

So, all the disappointed authors (who maybe feel just a tad let down) need to do is shrug it off.
 

victoriastrauss

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From the article:

Chalmers said the project had largely been a success, with books generating a handful of reviews in the national press and one title selling more than 1,000 copies.

Wasn't there an author who bought 1,000 copies him/herself?

- Victoria
 

anneboleyn

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One of the new systems may include a proof reading service, which had been suggested by some of the authors who took part in the project.

Which they will charge us for of course. No, this is all a complete flamingo-up. (Like a cock-up only much, much bigger)

They'll never admit it. They had good intentions, it was just executed badly and I'd admire them more if they stopped spinning the story - we get enough of that from the goverment.

I ain't impressed!
 

Anna Magdalena

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Taken from the link:

Chalmers said the project had largely been a success, with books generating a handful of reviews in the national press and one title selling more than 1,000 copies.

My bold.

That's not my idea of a success. And no mention of all the complaints either.

PS. Does anyone know which title has sold over 1,000 copies or how many of those sales were generated by YWO and Legend's efforts?
 

Old Hack

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Oh, look. I appear to have commented on the Bookseller's article. Just in case it doesn't appear, here's a copy:


I have been contacted by many authors via my blog, How Publishing Really Works, who submitted their work to YWO/Legend on time and yet have since heard nothing, despite the original Christmas deadline for publication having passed some seven weeks ago.

The books which have appeared on Amazon are rife with errors; some of the books which have been bought by the authors are also reportedly full of errors (one writer reported that her covers all have a thick green stripe across them).

I note that the one success Chalmers quotes is a book which has reportedly sold over 1,000 copies: might this be the same book which was rushed through to publication by YouWriteOn because its author placed an order for 1,000 copies? Selling books back to authors, rather than on to readers, is typical of a vanity press, and yet both YouWriteOn and Legend deny that this is a vanity publishing scheme.

While this was touted as a way for authors to be published for free, it's interesting to note that only those writers who paid the £39.99 "distribution fee" (Ted Smith's phrase, not mine--he founded and runs YWO) to attach an ISBN to their books have achieved publication: not one of the writers who went with the completely free offer seems to have been published, and some recent emails sent by YouWriteOn implies that this free offer will not be repeated.

When the writers who were involved in this scheme realised how things were falling apart, what did they do? They tried to contact Ted Smith by email, but received no satisfactory replies; so then they asked questions on the YouWriteOn message board. Ted Smith's reaction was to start deleting comments there; then to delete whole threads; then the week before Christmas he closed down the whole message board and has not yet reopened it.

Meanwhile, there are still writers out there who have no idea if their books are going to be published, while others who have been "lucky" enough to get through YouWriteOn's publication schedule are unable to get hold of their own books.

And yet Tom Chalmers says that "the project had largely been a success". A success for whom? Not for the writers concerned. But perhaps for YouWriteOn, which has recieved over £10,000 in "distribution fees" for this scheme since October 2008.

http://howpublishingreallyworks.blogspot.com/search/label/YouWriteOn
 

Old Hack

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...and just in case anyone's interested, I've just scheduled another blog post about this for 10am tomorrow morning (that's GMT) in which I detail all the Arts Council England funding that YouWriteOn and Ted Smith have received, along with all sorts of interesting links and comments.
 

Anna Magdalena

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I look forward to reading it--if look forward is the right expression. You're doing a fantastic job, Old Hack in trying to get to the bottom of this and to see justice done to those caught up in the YWO scheme. It must involve hours of work. If only Ted Smith would show as much consideration to the people he invited to take part in this great publishing 'opportunity'.
 

qwerty

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I've just read Old Hack's excellent blog, and am intrigued by a point over which the Arts Council seem to be being a bit obtuse. (apart from STILL apparently allowing their seal of approval to inappropriately appear on a vanity publishing offer)

The AC says: "YouWriteOn.com receives funding from Arts Council England to run its website forum and professional critique service for writers.

Arts Council England has not funded, and has not endorsed, the separate Print-on-Demand self-publishing service offered through the site
."

The YWO website is powered by Zarr. Funds were supplied by the AC to enable this to happen for the purpose of assisting writers. I think it can be agreed that encouraging vanity publishing is not assisting writers.

And yet, this web site, paid for by public money from the Arts Council, is being used to promote Edward Smith's own private venture.

Even if Edward does clearly state it is a venture funded by himself, the fact remains that he is using a vehicle paid for by others. A web site that was publicly funded for a different purpose.

Isn't there something ethically and/or morally wrong here?
 
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Old Hack

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Not only that, Qwerty, but the forum--which is funded by the Arts Council, after all--has not been available to anyone for six or seven weeks now.

(Thank you for the positive comments, by the way: you're too kind.)
 

qwerty

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Having just checked OH's blog again, I now see this AC paid for site is being used to promote other businesses.

How to Order a Critique
YouWriteOn's fees and manuscript guidelines and terms and conditions are listed below. To order a professional critique, click on contact us or email [email protected] and email us with details of your three preferred literary professionals. View our Literary Professionals.


By clicking on View our Literary Professionals. we see that such people as:

SARA O'KEEFFE - SENIOR EDITOR ORION
GILLIAN STERN - LITERARY EDITOR FOR CURTIS BROWN
MARTYN BEDFORD - PROFESSIONAL AWARD WINNING AUTHOR

Who are all apparently jumping on the bandwagon of soliciting business via a publicly funded site.
 

petec

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The latest from YWO

ywo_logo_large.jpg
 
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gothicangel

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But isn't that what the Arts Council paying for?

I would rather pay the small amount to have a critique from a professional; that some of the idiots that seem to frequent YWO these days.
 

gothicangel

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"We will next be offering free publishing set-up for new talented writers interested in publishing with YouWriteOn."

More likely "We will next be offering free publishing set-up for new writers interested in giving YWO their hard earned cash with minimal return."
 

Anna Magdalena

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I see they're still saying this:

BookSeller Distribution Through The Major Booksellers - If you are interested in your book being distributed and available to order through major booksellers for only £39.99 during the New Year, click here or email [email protected] we will alert interested writers when we next offer publishing in 2009.


That £39.99 is for an ISBN. (inflated price) and has nothing whatsoever to do with distribution as Old Hack and others have patiently explained so many times. Distribution is something altogether different. All books with an ISBN are ;listed on Nielsen Book Data whose lists are used by all bookseller of whatever kind. It does not get your books into bookshops, as it implies.
 

Old Hack

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I emailed Zarr yesterday (which is credited with designing and maintaining YWO's website in an Arts Council report which I've linked to on my blog today), and when they didn't reply I phoned them today. I asked why the YWO forum is down, and when it will reappear.

I was told that Zarr only designed the forum, and is not involved with running it at all now: but that the forum is not open all the time; it only opens when the man who runs it (I assume this means Ted) has time to keep an eye on it. As he's busy with other "Write On" stuff at the moment he "doesn't have time to police it right now", and so he's closed it down.

About a fortnight ago the plan was to reopen the forum in the middle of February, but the man I spoke to wasn't sure if that would happen or not--he has nothing to do with that decision. He did promise to email "Write On", though, and ask Ted to put a message up on the front page to let his members know what was happening.

He sounded surprised when I asked what was being updated on the forum software, and said that was the first he'd heard of any updates and that yes, that would be something he would do.
 

Old Hack

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Petec, thanks for that link: that information has been posted since I checked the site a couple of hours ago.

I find it interesting that YWO has time to update its website in order to hype some of the books that it's published, but doesn't have time to sort out its forum or tell its members what's happening with their books.

I wonder if YWO asked for permission to post that still from The Holy Grail?
 

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Any of you ex youwriteon folk checked the top ten lately? There are a lot of new names and titles but many of the familiar names aren't there any more. Certain titles which used to languish around the middle forties have made it into the middle thirties, and I do take my hat off to that individual for staying power. However, it's a yard stick I think, revealing people have possibly left in large numbers. Without contact, general feedback, dialogue and interaction between writers (unless you have their personal email) the site is faceless and clinical. Ted should kill the site stone dead; it's not worth a toss now. Ted has one success story I'll remember him for; he'd totally screwed up what used to be a good writers forum and review site. Thanks pal!