The world's most dangerous beta

khobar said:

I had a beta who was very reserved in providing any feedback. Then she started giving some feedback that was kinda generic but didn't quite make sense either. Eventually she told me she hadn't actually read my work but if I could format it for iPhone she'd try harder.

Uh, yeah. It's frustrating and annoying, and I wished she had just been honest up front, but in this business you just have to move on. You're right - a harsh but honest critique would have been very helpful. Oh well...

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You know, that really bums me out. When I agree to beta somebody's work, I take it very seriously! If I got something that I couldn't read...for whatever reason, I feel like it's my duty just to tell the person, be honest about the situation and move on. It's not fair to just leave someone hanging!

khobar said:

I had a beta who was very reserved in providing any feedback. Then she started giving some feedback that was kinda generic but didn't quite make sense either. Eventually she told me she hadn't actually read my work but if I could format it for iPhone she'd try harder.

Uh, yeah. It's frustrating and annoying, and I wished she had just been honest up front, but in this business you just have to move on. You're right - a harsh but honest critique would have been very helpful. Oh well...

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@_@

I think you win the Crappiest Experience With A Beta award. Sorry you had to go through that. I've never heard of such an awful beta experience before.

EMaree said:

Yeah, count me in with the betas who find too much honest or blunt critique results in the writer getting too defensive to learn. It's not a great way to beta, in my experience.

I wouldn't call what I do "sugercoating", though -- I don't soften my critique. I just find parts I like and try to focus evenly on good as well as bad. It's a change of focus more than anything else.

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Ditto for me. No offense, but some critters seem to have made it something of a sport to barrel down on other's writing. I've learned not to get defensive but I much prefer listening to someone's tough crits when they also: have something positive to say, encourage to keep writing and are respectful. It took the writer MORE time to write this as much you did to crit. You're not a god. Honestly, I've never experienced such the toughness as an artist. I don't see why people think if you're nice you're going to make the person weak or something? That's ridiculous. It shouldn't be an army bootcamp unless the person asks for it.

Okay, rant over.

Lauram6123 said:

You know, that really bums me out. When I agree to beta somebody's work, I take it very seriously! If I got something that I couldn't read...for whatever reason, I feel like it's my duty just to tell the person, be honest about the situation and move on. It's not fair to just leave someone hanging!

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This is another thing I look for in my beta's. How fast they read what I wrote. I've had them tear through the story in short order, letting me know they are going to provide me the feedback, but they've read it, and the speed in which they do this at times really lets me know that they liked the story. Granted, it may need tweaking and prettying up, but they more than likely enjoyed it.
I like honest beta's. The ones that come in with guns blazing. My job as a writer isn't to sit in the corner and sob about critique, it is to take that critique to make the book as good as I can.
My opinion is, it's better to have one person gut it and make it better, than a page full of bad reviews on Amazon.

EDIT: Maybe I am just demented, but there's more than one person that posted in this thread I'd love to have as a beta if they liked my genre. Finding this type of beta reader is like finding fifty dollars on the sidewalk. You don't just walk past, you pick that bugger up!

benluby said:

This is another thing I look for in my beta's. How fast they read what I wrote. I've had them tear through the story in short order, letting me know they are going to provide me the feedback, but they've read it, and the speed in which they do this at times really lets me know that they liked the story. Granted, it may need tweaking and prettying up, but they more than likely enjoyed it.
I like honest beta's. The ones that come in with guns blazing. My job as a writer isn't to sit in the corner and sob about critique, it is to take that critique to make the book as good as I can.
My opinion is, it's better to have one person gut it and make it better, than a page full of bad reviews on Amazon.

EDIT: Maybe I am just demented, but there's more than one person that posted in this thread I'd love to have as a beta if they liked my genre. Finding this type of beta reader is like finding fifty dollars on the sidewalk. You don't just walk past, you pick that bugger up!

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Forgive me, but you've done it twice so I thought I'd mention this. You don't need an apostrophe when you are making something plural, i.e. beta's.

railroad said:

Forgive me, but you've done it twice so I thought I'd mention this. You don't need an apostrophe when you are making something plural, i.e. beta's.

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Okay. It is a habit that I need to break, and also why I have an editor that is a friend of mine. As you can tell, I really need one.

railroad said:

Forgive me, but you've done it twice so I thought I'd mention this. You don't need an apostrophe when you are making something plural, i.e. beta's.

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It's funny on a beta thread to correct the posters! Ha!

Hah, well I was just corrected on another thread so paying it forward, lol.

railroad said:

Hah, well I was just corrected on another thread so paying it forward, lol.

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On a writing forum I'm surprised it isn't littered with corrections and grammatical bombs going off left and right.
I am still waiting to see a war between the various editors and wannabe editors break out.

phantasy said:

Ditto for me. No offense, but some critters seem to have made it something of a sport to barrel down on other's writing.

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If you see that happening here, report it to the mods. There are a subset of people who give critiques who showboat and snark, but as mentioned above, if you see that here, call it out. I'm no veteran, but I've been here long enough to know that's not part of the culture of this place.

phantasy said:

I've learned not to get defensive but I much prefer listening to someone's tough crits when they also: have something positive to say, encourage to keep writing and are respectful. It took the writer MORE time to write this as much you did to crit. You're not a god.

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It is useful to have a healthy respect for the opinions and time of others. Of course it takes less time to crit than to write - I don't recall ever spending eighteen months on a beta - but that doesn't mean that time has been spent idly.

I would also say that the absence or presence of "positivity" and "encouragement to write" has little bearing on the quality of the crit. Some critters see themselves as softening the blow, others see themselves as getting straight to the point. It's a relationship thing: partly about the person giving the critique, partly about the person receiving it, and everything to do with their relationship.

If those aspects are important to you, then seek out those qualities in a beta; but remember they might not be important or useful to others, and a critter who doesn't do those things is not in any absolute sense a "bad" beta.

phantasy said:

Ditto for me. No offense, but some critters seem to have made it something of a sport to barrel down on other's writing. I've learned not to get defensive but I much prefer listening to someone's tough crits when they also: have something positive to say, encourage to keep writing and are respectful. It took the writer MORE time to write this as much you did to crit. You're not a god. Honestly, I've never experienced such the toughness as an artist. I don't see why people think if you're nice you're going to make the person weak or something? That's ridiculous. It shouldn't be an army bootcamp unless the person asks for it.

Okay, rant over.

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I've noticed that it helps a lot if the person posting for crits let critters know in advance that they prefer gentler crits. In QLH, this is definitely the case. So when you're ready to post something, just add a note like "Please be gentle!" The critters generally keep that in mind.