New computer woes - USB death and buzzing annoyance.

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Caitlin Black

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So, I got a new desktop today. It boots up fine, recognised my monitor, speakers, keyboard and mouse (the latter 2 are USB - important in a moment) and even installed a program from a disc in record time.

Problem 1: It goes Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr the entire frickin' time, and is hella loud.

Problem 2: USB death. There are 2 USB2.0 and 2 USB3.0 ports on the front of the machine, and none of them seem to be picking anything up. The USBs at the back are picking things up fine (that's where keyboard and mouse are plugged in).

So... here's how it's gone down. Tried a 1-day-old USB stick that I'd backed up everything important from my laptop onto in every single front USB port. Nada. No messages, no installing, can't find it in My Computer as an extra drive. Same with a several-year-old USB stick.

Checked the Control Panel for device issues - it says there are no issues.

Then I plugged in a USB extension cord thing from the ports at the back. Plugged in the 1-day-old USB stick and instantly got a message that the device was not recognised. Tried the years-old stick, and nothing - no message or anything.

Gave up and turned on the laptop. Plugged in 1-day-old stick - same message that it's not recognised (despite it being fine this morning) and then a message saying it had failed. Shit. Plugged in years-old stick, and it won't do anything. No message or anything.

So... I'm pretty sure what has happened is that the extension cord killed both sticks (they both worked earlier today and yesterday). However... The errors didn't occur till I plugged into the extension cord, and I had already tried every single front USB port on the new desktop (without the extension) several times - and had nothing in response. So the 1-day-old stick didn't die from the front ports, but I take it the front ports simply aren't working.

The front ports are also kind of... Tight. Like, it's hard getting the sticks into them (well, 3 of them - the other is alright).

...

So. Help? WTF do I do now?

I can't get across to the shop to get the 1-day-old stick replaced until tomorrow at 11, because the shop won't open till then on a Sunday and it's closed now. I have other sticks that I've never used but, honestly, I don't want to screw those up too, y'know?

I got this machine built by a friend of mum's, and I'm planning on ringing him and asking for advice tomorrow. But I want to know that I've assessed this correctly, and what my options are.

It's running Windows 8, but with an awful Windows Classic shell that the tech guy installed so that he could find his way around, because he hates Windows 8. (As an aside, I'm going to have to ask him how to remove that Classic shell. It's crap, if you ask me - my brand new machine with modern parts looks like it's running Windows 95.)

...

I also cannot get onto the Internet on the desktop. I need a WiFi receiver plugged into it, which is USB and won't be found.

I'm going to go to bed soon, because this is frustrating as shit, so don't worry if I don't respond for the next 10 hours or so... I'm rage-sleeping. :)

(Many thanks in advance.)
 
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Kerosene

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The Brrrr noise can be a lot of things. If there's no CD in the drive tray, it's not that. It could be any one of the fans, including the PSU fan, or the hard drive (some are loud, or just bad), or could be some kind of whine from the motherboard/psu/whatnot. Describe it further, please. Or try to locate where the sound is coming from. My bet is on a crappy, or loud fan.

The USB thing thing, aside from the flash drive, sounds like your friend didn't connect the front panel to the header on the motherboard. The power button works, right? Reset too? How about the audio on the front? If it's just the USB from the front, then it's probably not connected somewhere.

The flash drive... I dunno. Did you eject the flash drive before removing it? Not doing that won't hurt the flash drive or the USB port, but can corrupt files and make Windows not want to work with it. Other than that... I don't know.

On a side note: Your tech guy should have gotten you Windows 8.1--it's a prettier, faster running Windows 7.
And, yeah, ring him up. It kinda sounds like he didn't do the best job--no offense.
 

Reziac

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Noise is either fans or vibration -- might need a bit of tape or cardboard between two almost-touching parts. This is a common problem with larger cases. I once saw a computer with a block of wood in the bottom of the case as a vibration inhibitor, and I've owned plenty that wound up with cardboard or duct tape as noise-stops.

Noisy fans -- same thing, sometimes they cause vibration (in one box I had to put the main intake fan on rubber mounts, cuz it made the case resonate otherwise), sometimes it's just where the fan is located making something else vibrate via the airflow. (This seems to be an issue with a lot of top-of-case fans.)

Occasionally one gets an optical drive that sounds like a lawnmower ALL the time, and never spins down. Toshiba CDROMs used to be like that. It's one reason I became a LiteOn bigot -- they spin up and down properly, on demand, and do so without any needless noise.

USB not working in front -- most likely those ports just aren't hooked up to the motherboard. Front ports are part of the case, and need a connector cable (which may or may not be included as part of the case) to the mobo; they aren't connected to anything on their own. Back ports are usually built into the mobo. The mobo might not have any USB headers (some don't) in which case those front ports are not usable regardless, or your builder might have just not done the hookup, or plugged 'em in backwards (either is all too easy to do, no matter how experienced you are... especially when the damned header pins aren't labeled and you have to guess which way the plug goes).

Also there are occasional motherboards that will only support front or back USB ports, but not both at once. It's a bug. :( This machine I'm using right now is like that (despite that its mobo was fairly high-end in its day). I finally unplugged the front ports entirely, got an external USB hub, plugged the hub into a back port, and my USB devices into the hub.

Failure to "Safely Remove Hardware" when ejecting a USB storage device is probably the biggest single cause of 'death' in USB flash drives. Sometimes they can be recovered, sometimes not. Windows acting like "yeah, it's there, but I can't recognise it or see the files" makes me think it got unsafely-ejected and thereby corrupted. :(

Extension cords are rated USB1 or USB2, and they are NOT interchangeable. It's pretty rare to find a modern device that's still USB1, but cheap cords sometimes are (being they're old stock recycled thru the dollar store and such). Having a cable mismatch usually gets a complaint about "low speed" from Windows, but CAN cause other random errors (especially with printers).

Me, I hate Win8's interface and would be all too happy to have a Win95ish shell. :)
 

Alexys

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Some cheap USB sticks (especially older ones, especially if you pull them out without unmounting them properly) spontaneously destroy their own partition tables and can't be mounted thereafter. They can be recovered for use by repartitioning and reformatting, but you lose whatever was on them. Those sticks are delicate things overall.

As for the shell, if (as seems likely) it's Classic Shell, the uninstallation instruction are here: http://www.classicshell.net/faq/#install_uninstall . If it's something else, you'll have to figure out what it is, first.
 
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Caitlin Black

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1. The Brrrrr noise sounds sort of like the disc drive spinning at high speed. But it sounded like that before, during and after I had a disc in the drive. So... I don't know. Next time I switch it on, I'll make sure to pay attention to where the sound seems to be coming from. One positive is that the case has a see-through section on one side, so I may be able to locate the source of the noise without taking the side off. :)

2. Yes, the USB sticks were removed without clicking "Remove Hardware". This is because when I plugged them into the front ports, Windows was not finding anything to be able to activate the "Safely Remove Hardware" button in my tray. When I plugged the 1-day-old one into the extension, it gave me the error message straight away. The older one never even got picked up, and just seems to be... dead.

3. Hmm. So the USB ports might not even be connected? Odd... I'm pretty sure the tech guy would've used the ports to transfer some files across to help him with his build. Basically, he encountered a number of problems in the construction, and needed extra drivers or patches or something to get things working properly. And yeah - he also put the Classic Shell on there, which may have been via USB. But I'll ask him about how to check if they're connected later.

...

I'm going to wait till after 11am, when I can get to the shop to get the USB replaced, before I call him. Because I know he's probably going to want me to plug in a USB to check if things are working after he's walked me through his fixing options. (If I don't get it fixed myself before then.) And yeah... It'd be nice to actually have a working USB stick to be able to test things out. :tongue

So... How do I check if the front ports are connected? I'm assuming there'd be some sort of cable(s) there, but what then?
 

Matera the Mad

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The tech guy is obviously half-baked, and only half knows what he's doing. And I'm being kind.

I don't like Windows h8 either, but I won't mess with anybody's interface except to put in a couple of shortcuts for Shutdown and Reboot so the poor things don't have to get tangled up in the Charms Bar when trying to leave the scene. Changing things on someone else's computer for one's own convenience is unprofessional and rude.

The noise might be a poorly functioning fan or device...or it might be some loose bit of wire, paper, tape, or whathaveya that touches a fan blade (see paragraph 1). Or just some part of the case that isn't fitting together perfectly somewhere. My previous computer had a case buzz that drove me up the walls. I used to hit it a lot. It also made a purring sound every time I moved the mouse! That's why I named the next one SilentBob, because it was. :hooray:
 

Caitlin Black

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I don't think that was being kind, to be honest. This guy has built me several computers in the past, all with zero issues. So I know he knows what he's doing. He may have messed something up, perhaps, this time, but he's not incompetent.

As for the interface, well, yeah, I did find that a bit annoying. But he had various hardware issues that needed to be addressed in the inner workings, which was just easier for him on the shell. As for unprofessional - well, he's NOT a professional. He's a family friend who doesn't do this for a living.

...

And to update on the buzzing: It's coming from the top-back section of the desktop. I could see inside through the glass screen, and it doesn't look particularly like a fan, or a board - more like a box-ish type thing. It has 2 stickers on it: AMD and ASRock - the chip and the motherboard.

But that's where the noise seemed to be loudest, even though I can't really see anything moving. Oh, and the sound was quieter for the first minute or two of booting up this time - but then went back to being too loud again.
 

Reziac

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Box about 3x5 inches or a little larger, top of the back end, is the power supply. It has one or two fans of its own. Fan blade just barely skimming something can make a buzz or rattle. Sometimes a fan isn't made quite square or the way its frame sits, it winds up with the blade zzzzing on something else. It's a hazard of mass-produced inexpensive parts (these fans cost about $5 retail).

Could also be something awry in the PSU itself, tho it's been ages since I saw that make a noise. (Okay, heard... as Matera says below, if this is the issue, it can fry everything else.)
 
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Kerosene

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I wouldn't go as far as Metera, as I don't know the guy, don't know all the problems with the computer, nor have I seen the computer itself. But I've had my fair dealings with people who have "guys" who do "good" work that ultimately end ups shotty and half-assed. Again, no offense.

If I was you, I'd call this guy up. He should be the one dealing with the problems of the build he put together.

If it is the PSU, I'd not turn on the computer until he's looked at it. Cheaper ones can be little bombs if you're not careful.
 

Matera the Mad

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What Will said -- it does sound like it could be the power supply, and if something goes bad there, it can fry the motherboard.

Yeah, I was a tad cruel, but as I said, I don't force my configuration preferences on others. If I make changes -- for the sake of my poor eyesight, for instance -- I restore the defaults.
 

Caitlin Black

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Mmm. Fair enough, I suppose.

The way I see it - regarding me doing stuff to fix it even though he should be doing it himself - is that by the time I was having problems last night, it was A) too late to go get a replacement USB stick to be able to try fixes he suggested over the phone and B) too late to reasonably expect him to come round here and have at it.

So given that there wasn't really much either of us could do until today, I tried my best to become informed, so that when I *do* speak to him - soon - I'll at least know what I'm talking about.

In related news, I just got the 1-day-old USB stick replaced by the store, and am backing things up now. So once that's all backed up (not ALL of my data, but about half, just so that I have something to transfer if I can get the ports working, and enough that it doesn't feel like a bit of a waste of time) I'll give him a call and see if we can figure this out.

He may wind up having to come out here to look at it.
 

guttersquid

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Had a buzz once. Turned out to be a fan blade hitting a wire. Simple fix. Sometimes problems aren't that complicated.
 

Caitlin Black

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Okay, so the tech guy came round after I last posted in here. I just didn't have a chance to come online till now.

The USB3.0 ports had come unplugged in transit. The USB2.0 ports were plugged in, but he changed which socket they were going into just to be safe. He tried 2 of his own USB sticks - and both sticks and every port worked. Tried my replacement stick, and it didn't work in any port. *sigh*

Apparently the loud noise is a fan, and it will be quieter when we have cooler weather. Where the desktop is is in a corner, so the sound reverberates. This case has more air-flow holes than my old one, and also stronger fans, so the sound is louder - but the heat that we've had lately is also a factor. (It's summer in Australia.)

He also said that I really have to get it off the carpet, because it needs air-flow going underneath at the back where the power supply is, or else it might crap out.

So - I've bought a laptop lap-desk that looks sturdy, the legs fold under so height isn't an issue (the desktop is under the desk - only place I can fit it), and as it's designed for laptops, it should be just fine for the desktop for airflow and not-melting-ness and stuff. Measured it in the store, and it'll be a good fit.

Also bought a recommended USB stick.

Now, I haven't had a chance to test any of these things out yet, as I was out for about 7 hours yesterday and just fell into bed when I got home. And I wanted to come online this morning to get my AW fix without having to mess about with the desktop. :tongue

But! I should be spending the next hour or two playing around with the desktop.

Oh, tech guy also suggested that, if I keep having trouble finding a compatible USB stick (apparently it can be hit-and-miss), then a network cable would link between the laptop and desktop to transfer files. It'd be a temporary fix, but would at least get my files onto the new machine. And I'm pretty sure we have a network cable somewhere...

But I'm hoping that this new USB stick works. It's a more-trusted brand than the one I'd already bought, and it's also the same brand as one of the USB sticks that tech guy used on my desktop which worked just fine.

So yes. Things.
 

Reziac

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Ah, so it was basically "not plugged in" :) Yeah, those little connector doohickies can fall off the pins, seen it happen.

On the plus side, if a fan is noisy and it's not due to mechanical interference, it's because it's a high-volume fan. As a general rule, the more air they move (thus the better they work), the louder they are. You can often mitigate the racket somewhat by putting a chunk of thick pile carpet against the wall behind the computer. (And always make sure there's at least an inch of clearance ALL the way around the box.)
 

milkweed

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It's running Windows 8, but with an awful Windows Classic shell that the tech guy installed so that he could find his way around, because he hates Windows 8. (As an aside, I'm going to have to ask him how to remove that Classic shell. It's crap, if you ask me - my brand new machine with modern parts looks like it's running Windows 95.)

That's just wrong and on so many levels.

Is it a shell or is it the original Windows interface? If it's the old interface just right click on your screen anywhere and then click the perosonalize option there you can change it's appearance.

Doing crap like that to my machine is tantamount to borrowing my car and trading it off while you had it in your possession, oh and I knew someone who did this to a boyfriend once so they are out there.
 

Caitlin Black

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Rez, yeah, the connections had fallen out. As for the carpet on the wall... Not sure how I'd attach it without damaging the wall? (And there is at least a couple of inches of free space all around the computer.)

Milk, I'm not sure whether it's a shell or an interface, but only because of technical definitions. Basically, it's still Windows 8 - but he did something that gave me an (ugly as fuck) Start button like Windows 95, and it boots directly to the Desktop screen instead of the Windows 8 Start screen. I mean, yes, it may be more "useful" to have it like that... But my first impression was, "Damn, what a butt-ugly piece of crap!" (I can still get to the Windows 8 Start screen if I want, but the way things are working is different to what I was used to with Windows 8.)

Anyway, I asked him about that while he was here, and he showed me how I could customise the shell/interface/whathaveyou. He changed the Start button from the ugly thing to a Shell picture that's round, like the Start button on Windows 7. There are a load of options for modifying it, so I'm going to explore whether I can make it work for my tastes. He also told me the name of the program (Classic Shell I think it was...) and that to remove it, I just have to uninstall the program the normal way.

(It also didn't help that the background picture was butt-ugly yellow grainy stuff, as I didn't have any of my normal backgrounds on there without my files on it... Though I was mistaken - the bars around folders or taskbar or whatever were Windows 8 bars, but I didn't notice that because of all the other ugly on the screen... And didn't use it for any longer than it took to realise that the USB wasn't working.)

...

Okay! So I've put the desktop on the lapdesk thing now, and turned it on. My new USB stick (the recommended brand) worked like a treat in the USB3.0 port - I didn't try it in the 2.0 because it was already working. I only had the desktop running for about 4 minutes, as there were no files on the USB stick yet to transfer - but! I noticed that the fan wasn't getting extra loud in that time.

Like, it was an acceptable noise level this time. So I'm guessing it was a combination of having the desktop off the carpet and onto something hard and flat, with the very back bit (where the power supply is) overhanging off the back of the lapdesk (still perfectly stable) as well as it being a cooler day today.

So... Things are looking up. :)

I'm transferring files from the laptop to the new USB stick now, and once that's done it'll be time to play around with the desktop. Finally!
 

Caitlin Black

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Files have been transferred, and everything is fine - except the picture quality. Perhaps this is why I thought the Classic Shell looked so ugly? Even after removing the Classic Shell, the image quality is incredibly grainy.

I've tried going through my TV/monitor's settings and found nothing that has helped, and ditto for the computer's settings. It's a HDMI cable that's connecting them, whereas on the previous desktop I used VGA (this one doesn't have a VGA port). Not sure if that has anything to do with it.

So - diagnosis?

It's a cheap monitor, but only about 1.5 years old. No idea about the cable (got it from mum). No idea really about settings. Video card is better than my old one and brand new, so that really shouldn't be an issue. And if it had been grainy like this when the tech guy was setting the computer up, he would've noticed I guess.
 
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