AW Amazon Store

If this site is helpful to you,
Please consider a voluntary subscription to defray ongoing expenses.


 

Welcome to the AbsoluteWrite Water Cooler! Please read The Newbie Guide To Absolute Write

Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: [Publishing svcs] WaveCloud / BookFuel

  1. #1
    figuring it all out praktikle1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    91

    [Publishing svcs] WaveCloud / BookFuel

    Does anybody out there have any experience with WaveCloud? Pros? Cons? Any input will be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks

  2. #2
    I got it covered Undercover's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Not here, but there
    Posts
    10,009

  3. #3
    figuring it all out praktikle1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    91

    Yes

    Quote Originally Posted by Undercover View Post
    Yes that's it. Have you heard of it?

  4. #4
    Grr. Argh. Thedrellum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    786
    It looks to me like a money-pit, though a well-designed money-pit.

    My main note is that they don't say who they are. If I'm going to pay someone 5 cents a word to edit my work, I want to know who it is I'm paying and what their experience is.

  5. #5
    Tech Support for Authors LetterBright's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    18
    Which services of theirs are you looking at, specifically?

    They say they have a partnership with Ingram, which is a reputable mainstream book distributor. I'd be curious to know more about what exactly that partnership entails.

    It's not clear to me how they distribute your book. It looks like it may only be available on WaveCloud? I hope I'm wrong about that, but if that's the case I would beware.

  6. #6
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,569
    Quote Originally Posted by LetterBright View Post
    They say they have a partnership with Ingram, which is a reputable mainstream book distributor. I'd be curious to know more about what exactly that partnership entails.
    Ingram includes just about anything with an ISBN on its lists, so that bookshops can order them in if someone comes along and asks for a copy.

    Getting a full distribution contract with Ingram involves a whole lot more, though: publishers usually have to have a history of publishing a reasonable number of books over a year, and of selling a good quantity of them; and they also have to commit to a good marketing spend on their forthcoming titles.

    I suspect that their relationship with Ingram does not involve full distribution. Which makes it insignificant.

  7. #7
    figuring it all out praktikle1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    91
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Ingram includes just about anything with an ISBN on its lists, so that bookshops can order them in if someone comes along and asks for a copy.

    Getting a full distribution contract with Ingram involves a whole lot more, though: publishers usually have to have a history of publishing a reasonable number of books over a year, and of selling a good quantity of them; and they also have to commit to a good marketing spend on their forthcoming titles.

    I suspect that their relationship with Ingram does not involve full distribution. Which makes it insignificant.
    Thank you for the input. After reading into it a little more I do see that WaveCloud has a charge for everything. (Money-Pit) They even have a "Get Discovered" package. I am published on Amazon, Draft2Digital and Smashwords. I am looking for other sites to publish for free to get my first book out there. Any suggestions?

    I will check out your Blogs

    Thanks

  8. #8
    figuring it all out praktikle1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    91
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    Ingram includes just about anything with an ISBN on its lists, so that bookshops can order them in if someone comes along and asks for a copy.

    Getting a full distribution contract with Ingram involves a whole lot more, though: publishers usually have to have a history of publishing a reasonable number of books over a year, and of selling a good quantity of them; and they also have to commit to a good marketing spend on their forthcoming titles.

    I suspect that their relationship with Ingram does not involve full distribution. Which makes it insignificant.
    I can't get on the "How Self Publishing Really Works" Blog

  9. #9
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,569
    First up, it's not "How Self Publishing Really Works", it's "How Publishing Really Works".

    Second, it's closed right now. Try again in a week.

    Third, I'm not quite sure what this has to do with this thread.

  10. #10
    figuring it all out praktikle1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    91
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Hack View Post
    First up, it's not "How Self Publishing Really Works", it's "How Publishing Really Works".

    Second, it's closed right now. Try again in a week.

    Third, I'm not quite sure what this has to do with this thread.
    First up, it probably doesn't have anything to do with this thread.

    Second, I assumed since you posted the link to your blog it might have some importance, so I gave it a click.

    Third, You and I both know what happens when one assumes....
    Last edited by praktikle1; 10-08-2013 at 02:25 AM.

  11. #11
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    3

    Forum Etiquette?

    This is Bill Van Orsdel. I'm one of the leaders at WaveCloud, and I thought it would be helpful to provide some information relative to the posts in this thread.

    However, I don't want to violate any rules or norms here, so I thought I'd ask if it's okay to post information about our company or services here.

    I appreciate any feedback.

    Best Regards,

    Bill

  12. #12
    banned as an incurable tosspot
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    6,543
    Bill,

    I'm not staff here, but I've seen many threads where the highlighted organization posted responses.

    I would strongly caution you: The tone of your responses is at least as important as the content.

    And welcome to AW.

  13. #13
    figuring it all out praktikle1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    91
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill.VanOrsdel View Post
    This is Bill Van Orsdel. I'm one of the leaders at WaveCloud, and I thought it would be helpful to provide some information relative to the posts in this thread.

    However, I don't want to violate any rules or norms here, so I thought I'd ask if it's okay to post information about our company or services here.

    I appreciate any feedback.

    Best Regards,

    Bill
    Great. If you can fill us in it would be greatly appreciated. I stumbled upon WaveCloud a few days ago. I looks kinda cool. I was looking for someone to provide some insight with his/her WaveCloud experience.

  14. #14
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    3

    Who is WaveCloud?

    robjvargas and praktikle1,

    Thanks for the feedback. As you recommend, I'll take care with my posts.

    I'm from WaveCloud and we are an author services provider. Our goal is to help independent authors bring their books to market.

    Our web site clearly needs work. It is transition from its prior state - an ebook store supplied with ebooks from traditional publishers via Ingram Content Services, to its future state - an author services company that advises authors and provides production and marketing help to independent authors. Our goal is to help independent authors self-educate about publishing best practices and execute the many steps required to bring a competitive book to market.

    Many of the authors I coach request services from us, but some do not. We are happy to help all authors, whether they engage with us for services or not. We are working to highlight independent authors ebooks in our ebook store, and to give them equal footing with traditionally published books.

    Soon, we will be rolling out a new tool that will provide detailed and specific self-help for authors who are making the journey from "manuscript complete" to "book-on-shelf-supported-by-marketing". We plan to make the basic version of this tool free, and will be inviting authors to participate in the beta to help us improve it.

    I'm happy to answer publishing questions or provide help either in this forum, or through direct messages. Authors are welcome to reach me at bill.vanorsdel@wavecloud.com


    Best Regards,

    Bill

  15. #15
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,569
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill.VanOrsdel View Post
    Our web site clearly needs work. It is transition from its prior state - an ebook store supplied with ebooks from traditional publishers via Ingram Content Services, to its future state - an author services company that advises authors and provides production and marketing help to independent authors. Our goal is to help independent authors self-educate about publishing best practices and execute the many steps required to bring a competitive book to market.
    My bold.

    The problem I have with that highlighted section is that you're misleading writers. Take this blog piece, for example: there are all sorts of errors there that I can see, and a good few phrases where your imprecise wording implies things which aren't true. (I would quote from it to show you what I object to, but don't seem able to: this might be a problem with my computer, but it could be something to do with your site).

    Many of the authors I coach request services from us, but some do not.
    I can't find your bio on the site. What experience do you have in publishing? Have you worked as a writer? What qualifies you to coach authors?

    I've found your LinkedIn profile: it shows that your work experience is in sales and marketing, but shows no publishing experience as a writer or publisher.

    You're offering paid-for publication packages
    , I note, and they're not cheap: I am worried that you're asking writers for money, because when I put your name into Google I found this article, which alleges that

    Businessman William Van Orsdel has agreed to pay $9.6 million to partners in West Glen Town Center [...] The four businessmen and their West Glen Town Center LLC sued Van Orsdel in February, claiming that he had reneged on loan obligations and engaged in various forms of fraud while managing West Glen from 2004 to 2009.
    I know the financial crisis hit many of us hard, and the timing given in that article indicates your problems arose during that difficult time: but when I see allegations of fraud being made against people who are taking money from writers, I get very worried indeed.

    We are happy to help all authors, whether they engage with us for services or not. We are working to highlight independent authors ebooks in our ebook store, and to give them equal footing with traditionally published books.
    What do you mean by this, exactly?

    Soon, we will be rolling out a new tool that will provide detailed and specific self-help for authors who are making the journey from "manuscript complete" to "book-on-shelf-supported-by-marketing". We plan to make the basic version of this tool free, and will be inviting authors to participate in the beta to help us improve it.
    Sites like AbsoluteWrite provide all sorts of information for free, and give writers the opportunity to talk with people with years of appropriate experience. What makes your site better? What do you offer--whether for free or at a price--that isn't already available at sites like AW for free?
    Last edited by Old Hack; 10-09-2013 at 11:12 AM.

  16. #16
    Writer is as Writer does Terie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Manchester, UK
    Posts
    4,153
    Quote Originally Posted by praktikle1 View Post
    Second, I assumed since you posted the link to your blog it might have some importance, so I gave it a click.
    (derail) Old Hack didn't 'post a link' to her blog. It's part of her signature, which you can tell by the way it appears under the short horizontal line that appears above everyone's signature. (/derail)
    Changing Gears (available now) -- Winning the race doesn’t equal winning at life.

    The DragonSpawn Cycle: AutumnQuest | WinterMaejic | SpringFire | SummerDanse available for Kindle

    Author website | Author blog

  17. #17
    New Fish; Learning About Thick Skin
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    3
    Old Hack,

    I wanted to be wary of advertising here in the forum. I was just trying to provide more information about our position in the market.

    The link you found to William Van Orsdel appears to be my father. I haven't had the pleasure of being in business with him. His success and challenges remain his own.

    The leaders of WaveCloud are technologists, with publishing industry experience provided by our staff and contractors. As a team, we are on our third company together, having successfully grown and sold two prior businesses.

    Our unique offerings for authors will center around concentrated education woven into book production and marketing timelines.

    We are working on highlighting our author testimonials on our web site, and I have been pleased with the feedback that our customer authors have provided.

    I personally coach authors on the basics of book production and marketing, sharing with them the best practices of the self-publishing industry as we have collected them from conferences, training webinars, forums, blogs and our in-house publishing experts. Most of the authors I speak with are often intimidated and overwhelmed by the task in front of them and need a basic grounding before spending any money. That is that value that we are working to deliver.

  18. #18
    Such a nasty woman SuperModerator Old Hack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    In chaos
    Posts
    21,569
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill.VanOrsdel View Post
    Old Hack,

    I wanted to be wary of advertising here in the forum. I was just trying to provide more information about our position in the market.

    The link you found to William Van Orsdel appears to be my father. I haven't had the pleasure of being in business with him. His success and challenges remain his own.
    Thanks for the clarification, Bill.

    The leaders of WaveCloud are technologists, with publishing industry experience provided by our staff and contractors. As a team, we are on our third company together, having successfully grown and sold two prior businesses.
    So you have no publishing experience?

    Our unique offerings for authors will center around concentrated education woven into book production and marketing timelines.

    We are working on highlighting our author testimonials on our web site, and I have been pleased with the feedback that our customer authors have provided.
    That all sounds very sales-speak.

    I personally coach authors on the basics of book production and marketing, sharing with them the best practices of the self-publishing industry as we have collected them from conferences, training webinars, forums, blogs and our in-house publishing experts.
    You have no experience of working in publishing, but you're personally coaching authors in book production and marketing.

    When I pay for training I expect the person coaching me to have appropriate experience and knowledge.

    If you've collected your knowledge and understanding of "the best practices of the self-publishing industry" on stuff you've collected online, then you're almost certainly going to be misinforming the people who are paying you to help them.

    Most of the authors I speak with are often intimidated and overwhelmed by the task in front of them and need a basic grounding before spending any money. That is that value that we are working to deliver.
    But you've not worked in publishing and you don't have the experience required to provide the advice they need.

    This is proved by your blog post which I linked to above: it's hugely misleading and very ill-informed.

    Tell me: where did your "in-house publishing experts" get their publishing experience? I wonder, because having read a few of your blog posts and a bit of your website, I doubt it was with a good trade publisher, and I'm worried that not only are you at risk of misleading authors, you're at risk of being misled by the "experts" you've employed.

  19. #19
    Writer Beware Goddess Absolute Sage victoriastrauss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Far from the madding crowd
    Posts
    6,670
    From that blog post:
    Currently it is harder than ever for a new author to get a book in front of publishers for serious consideration. It has always been difficult to get your manuscript in front of a publisher, and traditional publishing houses are increasingly cautious now; they can’t afford to take as many chances. They need to be fairly sure they can turn books into bestsellers otherwise they risk losing money. Because of this, first time authors aren’t as attractive as they once were.
    Ah, the traditional-publishing-is-a-fruitless-path meme. Very commonly used by companies or services that claim to offer an alternative and want to steer authors in that direction.

    It's powerful because there's some truth to it--yes, it is difficult for new authors to break in; yes, traditional publishers are more oriented toward blockbusters than they used to be--but those grains of truth are twisted to present false conclusions. Publishers aren't looking only for bestsellers; obviously they want all their books to succeed, but "success" doesn't automatically equate to "bestseller", nor does "non-bestseller" equate to "risk of losing money." As for avoiding first-timers...sure, a first-timer represents a risk. But first-timers also represent huge potential. There are many reasons why your manuscript might not make it onto an editor's desk, and why, even if it does get an editor's attention, it might not be bought; but being a first-timer is probably one of the least important of those reasons.

    There are good reasons to choose to self-publish. "I'm a new author and I could never get a traditional publisher to consider me" isn't one of them.

    - Victoria
    Last edited by victoriastrauss; 10-10-2013 at 08:55 PM.

  20. #20
    Formerly Phantom of Krankor. Torgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    7,631
    First-timers are cheap compared to having to poach some other publisher's successful novelist. That's a big plus.

  21. #21
    Write. Write. Writey Write Write. mrsmig's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,924

    BookFuel [Publishing Services]

    This company popped up in my Facebook feed today: BookFuel

    They seem straightforward enough - a company that provides editing, cover design, print layout, ebook conversion, print distribution and other services for self-publishers, either by buying a package or a la carte. Their prices seem reasonable, although if I was in the market for cover art I'd sure like to see some examples of what they offer.

    A quick look at their staff on the About Us page reveals perky, earnest, mostly young people who have cute staff photos and clever bios, but a dearth of actual publishing experience.
    Last edited by mrsmig; 11-13-2014 at 06:47 PM.
    KINGLET: Now available from Fiery Seas Publishing: Amazon Barnes & Noble iBooks Kobo
    FISKUR: Now available from Fiery Seas Publishing: Amazon Barnes & Noble iBooks Kobo
    STONEKING: Releasing February 20, 2018 from Fiery Seas Publishing






    My Website:
    www.donnamigliaccio.com

    And the occasional Tweet.





  22. #22
    Someday. Kayley's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    1,182
    There are some cover samples here:

    https://www.bookfuel.com/services/create-cover-design

    They're okay. Seems fair for the price.

  23. #23
    Maybe this should be merged with the existing WaveCloud thread, since BookFuel refers to WaveCloud as their parent company.
    Last edited by laurasbadideas; 11-14-2014 at 01:45 PM.
    Laura

    My humor blog: Unlikely Explanations

  24. #24
    Ooo! Shiny new cover! Absolute Sage Cathy C's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Hiding in my writing cave
    Posts
    9,909
    BookFuel showed up as a Suggested Post in my Facebook feed today, so I checked here to see if they had a thread after I checked out their site. Since several here considered their prices "reasonable", I wonder if they've changed their practices. $99.00 per MONTH for a minimum of 24 months isn't reasonable IMO. That price only seems to include the cover, formatting and them forwarding the file to Amazon, CreateSpace, iTunes, etc. but there's a note that royalties are "net of royalties the distribution company charges." Charges from distributors, sure. But "royalties"?? That makes me wonder what they're really doing. BTW, the $99.00/month doesn't include proofreading! Um...wow. Oh, and marketing is a separate price and the package seems to only include setting up a Twitter account, a basic Facebook page and doing a Goodreads giveaway.

    For those who posted in past years about this company, did their charges and services change?
    Last edited by Cathy C; 12-12-2015 at 05:57 PM.
    Want FREE reads? Click here!

    Smiles!
    Cathy Clamp
    USA Today bestselling author
    ILLICIT, coming 7/16!
    My Website
    Follow me: Twitter
    Now on Facebook! Come friend me!



    "An entertaining (and occasionally very dark) mystery." -- Locus

    "[Shapeshifter] fans are about to hit the jackpot as Clamp returns to re-energize this amazing series. Searching for layered plotlines and complex characters? Look no further, as Clamp truly delivers!" -- RT BookReviews

    "Cathy Clamp is a visionary author, creating new worlds that are both strong and vividly drawn. Adventure and excitement at its best." -- Yasmine Galenorn, New York Times Bestselling Author

    "A struggling community under attack, compelling action, characters struggling with dark secrets ... FORBIDDEN hit all my favorite notes, and I love the rich world of the Sazi!" - Rachel Caine, New York Times Bestselling Author

  25. #25
    Mostly Harmless SuperModerator CaoPaux's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Coastal Desert
    Posts
    13,108
    There's also FundMyBook for *surprise!* crowdfunding: http://www.fundmybook.com/

    And BookFuel has offered kickbacks to editors (WB Blog)
    ICAO
    ---------

    Censorship always defeats its own purpose, for it creates in the end the kind of society that is incapable of exercising real discretion. -- Henry Steele Commager
    Achievers strive for excellence. Perfectionists drive themselves to extinction. -- A Grapple A Day
    I've never known any trouble that an hour's reading didn't assuage. -- Charles DeSecondat

    II 2016: 2017:

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Custom Search