My Beta reader wants to become an editor

Pisco Sour · Sep 24, 2013

Hi
One of my Beta Readers wants to be an editor. She has a good eye for punctuation and structure. Otherwise, she has no experience, except for reading friend's manuscripts and commenting via track changes. Recently, she did an online course in editing (non-accredited as far as I can make out). She's 43, has kids and well, I don't thing she can afford time and money for a university degree in English.
Can you give me any advice to pass on to her? Not all editors come from the traditional pathway so maybe someone has a suggestion? She's based in the USA.
Much appreciated.

WeaselFire · Sep 24, 2013

Tell her to start editing. There are no entry requirements for the field.

Jeff

Old Hack · Sep 24, 2013

She doesn't need to get a degree to become an editor.

What she does need, however, is good training, and she's unlikely to get that anywhere other than working for an established, successful publisher. Editors usually start off as unpaid interns and work their way up. Internships are notoriously difficult to get, though.

thothguard51 · Sep 24, 2013

There is more to editing than grammar and punctuation...

mellymel · Sep 24, 2013

I don't really know how it works, but maybe she could look into proof reading for college papers? I know Kaplan online has something available to students where they can submit their paper to be checked for grammar, spelling, sentence structure, etc before handing it in to a professor (it's all done online). I'm guessing most online Universities have this available to their students. I don't know what the qualifications are, but it could be worth checking out.

Old Hack · Sep 24, 2013

thothguard51 said:
There is more to editing than grammar and punctuation...

SO much more.

mellymel said:
I don't really know how it works, but maybe she could look into proof reading for college papers?

She could, but what are her qualifications for this work?

As thothguard has said, there's so much more to editing than having good grammar and punctuation. There's a thread here which gives an indication of all that's involved in copy editing: proofreading and editing are no less complex.

Pisco Sour · Sep 25, 2013

Thanks for the info. I met my Beta during a recent self-editing course online, and I know she's hungry for it. I'll pass everything on, including the links. Thanks again.

HapiSofi · Sep 25, 2013

At the house where I've worked longest, she'd be a lot likelier to get hired if she'd worked in a bookstore than if she'd been proofreading college papers. Good proofreading skills will get you tracked into production. Editors do acquisition, so they have to know something about the market.

Biggest thing you have to do to become an editor: move to New York City, or to London if you're in the UK.

TallDrinkofWater · Sep 30, 2013

Editor Wannabe

Hi, all! I am the beta reader to whom Graceful Ghost referred. I appreciate the comments and advice.

Old Hack said:
She doesn't need to get a degree to become an editor. What she does need, however, is good training...

Thanks, Old Hack! I feel fortunate to currently be serving as a beta reader for a couple of published novelists. I continue to gain practical experience, but I know I could benefit from having a mentor. I also recognize that it is in my best interest to take some courses--proofreading, copy editing, even a writing course. But, as Graceful Ghost said, unfortunately, I don't have the luxury of being able to go back to school anytime soon. (I have a BS in Biology and a MEd in Guidance & Counseling in Higher Ed. I'd trade both of those in for a degree in English!) I guess my next move is to search for online workshops.

T Robinson · Sep 30, 2013

Welcome, review the forums and learn. But, I must say this. A degree in English is not necessarily the best path to an editor of publishable books. There is a vast difference between academic writing and editing in general. A freelance editor I know sends her definition of editing to every prospective client that contacts her, because everyone has a different idea of what it is. Go to some of the major editing groups for freelancers and you will see what they consider as editing. It might go from simple proofreading (which some think of as editing, but is only checking for basics) to developmental editing up to ghostwriting. The point is that you need to know what you think of when you think of "an editor," and your best path to that. Academic editors mostly work with students doing papers, following the individual style guides mandated by their university. That is a completely different skill set from the freelancer who has individuals who want their manuscripts critiqued, or have polished it as far as they can and want a professional edit before going to the submissions stage to agents and publishers. Good luck.

veinglory · Sep 30, 2013

There are copy-editing positions out there that are entry level if you pass the skills test.

MumblingSage · Sep 30, 2013

You might encourage her to join some editor and author groups on LinkedIn to compare notes with other editors, especially freelancers.

Also, some pre-publication editors have success finding clients through Craigslist. There's a dedicated section to posting for editing, copywriting, and translation services.

Corussa · Sep 30, 2013

T Robinson said:
Welcome, review the forums and learn. But, I must say this. A degree in English is not necessarily the best path to an editor of publishable books. There is a vast difference between academic writing and editing in general. A freelance editor I know sends her definition of editing to every prospective client that contacts her, because everyone has a different idea of what it is. Go to some of the major editing groups for freelancers and you will see what they consider as editing. It might go from simple proofreading (which some think of as editing, but is only checking for basics) to developmental editing up to ghostwriting. The point is that you need to know what you think of when you think of "an editor," and your best path to that. Academic editors mostly work with students doing papers, following the individual style guides mandated by their university. That is a completely different skill set from the freelancer who has individuals who want their manuscripts critiqued, or have polished it as far as they can and want a professional edit before going to the submissions stage to agents and publishers. Good luck.

I think these are great and useful comments.

My degree wasn't in English, and I'm an editor (though just as T Robinson points out, there are many, many different types of editor). And depending on the area of publishing, I believe a science background can be very useful. I know some publishers are frequently hunting for editors with mathematics/sciences backgrounds, because so many people looking to work in editorial have English degrees or the like.

Old Hack · Oct 1, 2013

TallDrinkofWater said:
Thanks, Old Hack! I feel fortunate to currently be serving as a beta reader for a couple of published novelists. I continue to gain practical experience, but I know I could benefit from having a mentor. I also recognize that it is in my best interest to take some courses--proofreading, copy editing, even a writing course. But, as Graceful Ghost said, unfortunately, I don't have the luxury of being able to go back to school anytime soon. (I have a BS in Biology and a MEd in Guidance & Counseling in Higher Ed. I'd trade both of those in for a degree in English!) I guess my next move is to search for online workshops.

You don't need an English degree to work as an editor.

The UK's Society of Editors and Proofreaders (I think I've got that right) runs some very well regarded courses, and some of them might be online.

I would avoid ChapterHouse.

You could contact some of the better e-publishers and ask if they run online internships for newcomers.

T Robinson said:
Go to some of the major editing groups for freelancers and you will see what they consider as editing. It might go from simple proofreading (which some think of as editing, but is only checking for basics) to developmental editing up to ghostwriting.

I agree that there's often a disparity between what editors do and what people think editors do. But I disagree that proofreading is "only checking for basics": it's a final check of a book's proofs, before a book goes to print.

See? You've proved your point even without meaning to!

Joking aside, there is no clear agreement about what each stage of the editing process is called: the only thing that is clear is that editing is a difficult skill and books which aren't edited well are less likely to sell well than books which are.

MumblingSage said:
You might encourage her to join some editor and author groups on LinkedIn to compare notes with other editors, especially freelancers.

Also, some pre-publication editors have success finding clients through Craigslist. There's a dedicated section to posting for editing, copywriting, and translation services.

I can imagine the sorts of editors one might find on Craigslist. *shudder*

T Robinson · Oct 1, 2013

Alas, as usual Hack is right. "I" think of proofreading as just the basics, because it is the lowest paid of what a client might want. When I worked at a newspaper long ago, it was making sure nothing embarrassing was on the front page,

The true point is as said, there are many definitions. The critical thing to you, is "What is your definition?" When you say you would like to be an editor, what image comes into your mind? Growing up, mine was Clark Kent's editor at the newspaper. That was all I knew about the term "editor."

MumblingSage · Oct 1, 2013

I can imagine the sorts of editors one might find on Craigslist. *shudder*

I'm in DC; we find contractors to do house repairs on Craigslist. A number of consulting firms with actual websites (many of them even typo-free, from what I can see) are advertising in that section. *shrugs* I got over my Craigslist prejudice when I had to find an apartment through it, and wound up Not-As-Murdered-As-Anticipated.

Namatu · Oct 1, 2013

HapiSofi said:
Biggest thing you have to do to become an editor: move to New York City, or to London if you're in the UK.

Not necessarily. I've been an editor for over a decade and have never worked in either city.

One thing to keep in mind is that editors are needed for both fiction and nonfiction, including reference and textbooks. Many publishers provide potential freelancers with tests before adding them to their roster, although even then it can be hard to break in because editorial and production like to use who they know.

Old Hack and others have given good advice. I also suggest trying to increase your editorial experience by taking some publishers' freelance editorial tests.

Debbie V · Oct 1, 2013

Namatu said:
I also suggest trying to increase your editorial experience by taking some publishers' freelance editorial tests.

How do you find out which publishers have these tests? I have seen an occasional call for freelance editors at well known houses, but never something about a test. The calls I've seen all required experience and asked for a resume to be sent in. Do they send the test if they like the resume and cover letter?

Niiicola · Oct 1, 2013

Debbie V said:
How do you find out which publishers have these tests? I have seen an occasional call for freelance editors at well known houses, but never something about a test. The calls I've seen all required experience and asked for a resume to be sent in. Do they send the test if they like the resume and cover letter?

I only know about nonfiction editing, but yes, you usually get the test if they're considering you for the position.

TallDrinkofWater · Oct 2, 2013

Thanks, all. I'm now searching for workshops/classes I can take to add to my resume. Ultimately, I want to do conceptual editing for fiction.

Namatu said:
I also suggest trying to increase your editorial experience by taking some publishers' freelance editorial tests.

Thanks, Namatu, for the suggestion. I found and took one free online test yesterday. Incidentally, I didn't pass it! However, when I looked back at my wrong answers, most of them were correct per Chicago Manual of Style. So, I didn't end up feeling bad about it. I know not all publishing houses follow the same style guide.

Dancre · Dec 18, 2013

I'm glad Thoth said something. My editor did more than point out grammar and punctuation, she pointed out my overuse of pronouns (I'm hating them now.), taught me how to put a spotlight on something that was important, where I was info dumping (didn't even realize I was doing it!!), and helped me with dialogue. I would say go with someone who is more professional and would be able to point out writing technique errors along with the grammar and punctuation.

thothguard51 said:
There is more to editing than grammar and punctuation...

Nimyth · Dec 26, 2013

Pisco Sour said:
Hi
One of my Beta Readers wants to be an editor. She has a good eye for punctuation and structure. Otherwise, she has no experience, except for reading friend's manuscripts and commenting via track changes. Recently, she did an online course in editing (non-accredited as far as I can make out). She's 43, has kids and well, I don't thing she can afford time and money for a university degree in English.
Can you give me any advice to pass on to her? Not all editors come from the traditional pathway so maybe someone has a suggestion? She's based in the USA.
Much appreciated.

My friend is an eng lit major, and was a librarian. She now does tech writing/editing. She on occasion hits the freelance boards, in fact I think that is how she ended up getting into editing. There are several out there that have small projects, I get the impression they don't pay much, but quite frequently she does several in one day so they must be fairly short and simple ones

Erin Kelly · Dec 27, 2013

The biggest question is: What kind of editor do you want to be? Your next step depends greatly on this answer.

My Beta reader wants to become an editor

Benefactor Member

Such a nasty woman

A Gentleman of a refined age...

Such a nasty woman

Hagiographically Advantaged

Born long ago, in a different era

volitare nequeo

Inarticulate Herb

I fight like a dairy farmer

Such a nasty woman

Born long ago, in a different era

Inarticulate Herb

Lost in mental space.

Mentoring Myself and Others

Twitchy

Just have fun.

Writer