Restaurant scenes

Hamilton · Mar 18, 2013

,You could pace waiter interruptions specifically so they occur only during less tense parts of the conversation. For instance, there could be a heated exchange, followed by an awkward silence as the characfters cool off. The server appears with the plates, leaves, and conversation starts up again. Maybe the female character takes advantage of the food's arrival to construct an appropriately scathing response.

You could exploit the interactions, too. She feels out of place, while he's casual? Have him interact with the server in such a way to emphasize that. He chats casually with the server for a minute, while she sits fuming. Maybe they don't stop talking when the server comes, just get less specific in their comments.

I'd say, either use the setting to your advantage, or change the setting so suits what you're going for better. I do think, if you're trying to gradually raise tension in a conversation, mentioning the food arriving in a brief aside would actually reduce tension. We're no longer "in the moment". However, if there are natural pauses in the conversation, mentioning it briefly would work. If the scene does not have those kinds of dips in action, either use it, by making interactions with the server and the food itself an integral part of the scene, or lose it, by putting the scene somewhere else entirely.

Phaeal · Mar 18, 2013

I'd go for a low-service option (fast food joint, cafeteria, etc.) if I didn't want the characters interrupted. If, on the other hand, the restaurant staff could contribute to the scene, I'd go for a high-service option.

Debbie V · Mar 18, 2013

kaitie said:
Yeah, it's close third for her POV, which is probably why there's more tension. He's nervous, but he handles it better than she does. She's got some serious concerns that he might try to murder her or something.

I know this doesn't answer your question, but if these are her concerns, why would she let him select the meeting place?

They need neutral ground. In nice weather, park or beach - crowded but no one is paying attention and you can be far enough from others to keep from being overheard. In nasty weather - shopping mall bench or food court. You will need to keep your eyes open for approaching folk, but a quick shift in conversation can do wonders.

Krystal Heart · Mar 18, 2013

Phaeal said:
I'd go for a low-service option (fast food joint, cafeteria, etc.) if I didn't want the characters interrupted. If, on the other hand, the restaurant staff could contribute to the scene, I'd go for a high-service option.

In a past WIP, I had a scene where the main character and a minor character had a conversation in Burger King, it was very, very late, and they weren't interrupted by anyone ordering food or by they ordering food. They were interrupted by a group of thugs waiting for the MC outside to beat him up.

WeaselFire · Mar 18, 2013

kaitie said:
The problem I always have with scenes in restaurants is that being in a restaurant is filled with mundane useless crap.

If it's mundane or useless, ignore it. If it's useful, keep it. Simply acknowledge that it's there:

"After the waiter filled our glasses, Jane said..."
"Jane's comment made Mary choke on her tartar, gaining a concerned look from the neighboring table..."
"I couldn't concentrate on the conversation, distrated by the waitress' low cut blouse, short skirt and eye patch..."

Or have them meet in an alleyway, dog park or rail yard.

Jeff

NeuroFizz · Mar 19, 2013

It is understood that the waitstaff will make appearances in a restaurant, but that doesn't mean they have to happen in the scene. Have the waitstaff appear if it is useful to the scene. If not, there is no need for an appearance. Keep in mind that a restaurant scene is going to have potential issues with the "talking heads syndrome" since the characters will be stationary, and mostly only their upper bodies will be available for actions and reactions that will break up the dialogue. In situations like these, occasional outside actions are useful to counter the risk of having the motions in the scene rendered to all manner of facial twitches, shoulder shrugs, and arm/hand gesticulations. Interruptions may also be helpful in a scene that is very dialogue-heavy.

timewaster · Mar 19, 2013

kaitie said:
Okay, I've been working on a scene and come across a problem I've had a few times before. My characters are meeting in a restaurant to have a big important discussion. They're meeting there because it's both public, but relatively private, but the important stuff is obviously the conversation.

The problem I always have with scenes in restaurants is that being in a restaurant is filled with mundane useless crap. The waiter taking drink orders, bringing drinks, taking food orders, bringing food, asking about refills, blah blah blah. Even if I can cut out the majority of the latter stuff by giving them a crappy waiter or something, the ordering drinks/food thing is always still there. It's annoying because I don't want to write about that (or read about it). I just want to cut to the important stuff.

I've set this particular scene up so that they're in a Japanese-style restaurant with an intercom/buzzer so that they can request the waiter if needed, which helps eliminate a lot of the problem. I could theoretically have the second character meet the first and be told "I already ordered" (though that takes away the fun of setting up the scene the way I have it now).

I think my solution this time is just going to be for him to order immediately to get the waiter out of the way as he frequents the restaurant and knows the menu, but obviously that wouldn't work every time. I'm just wondering how other people handle scenes like this when you want to skip the boring but keep it realistic.

I think most writers choose the stage business to determine the pace of the scene. Sometimes you want a break after an important statement. It is all about how the scene appears on the page -how much page time you give it. The author controls the interruptions not the waiter- and it is an opportunity to show character, emotional temperature etc. It one of the protags is snappy and rude, the other ingratiating etc that interaction can echo/contrast/undermine the main conversation's content. You don't have to follow the meal the whole way through either you can skip the boring bits and cut to the main course.
If there is no physical context conversations can 'float' and it is usually better to anchor them in a 'real' place with all its distractions.

BethS · Mar 19, 2013

kaitie said:
I think part of what stumps me a little on this one is that normally I'd have no problem saying something along the lines of, "They ordered, and once the waiter had brought the food and left again (whoever) said..."

The problem is, this is the first time these two characters have really met face to face, and if they wait on the waiter to bring food, they're going to have a hell of an awkward silence in the meantime. Which pretty much means I need to actually have the waiter interrupt them. I think it has to do with it being an unusual situation so the typical, every day filler you can expect the reader to supply wouldn't work.

Anyway I do like the idea of just summarizing and moving on as a general rule.

You can summarize anything you don't want to show:

After they ordered the meal, an awkward few moments ensued, filled with much drink-sipping and eye-contact avoiding, and random flurries of small talk.

You can also skip what you don't want to show:

They met at the Newtown Cafe. They were shown to a booth in the back--Darby's request--and once the sandwiches arrived, he got right to the point.

The difference between the first example and the second, besides economy, is that the first one does some characterizing and builds tension. Which may or may not be a necessary addition to the scene.

quickWit · Mar 19, 2013

If the relevant portion of their conversation is long enough to warrant them being interrupted by a waiter, etc., chances are your readers will need a break anyway. If it isn't, don't include one. Just make sure you don't add 30 lines of dialogue your story doesn't need because you're envisioning the enitre meal, the entire encounter.

Just give 'em what they need and move on.

quicklime · Mar 19, 2013

characters poop.....behind teh scenes

kaitie said:
....
The problem I always have with scenes in restaurants is that being in a restaurant is filled with mundane useless crap. The waiter taking drink orders, bringing drinks, taking food orders, bringing food, asking about refills, blah blah blah. Even if I can cut out the majority of the latter stuff by giving them a crappy waiter or something, the ordering drinks/food thing is always still there. It's annoying because I don't want to write about that (or read about it). I just want to cut to the important stuff.

....

I tend to defecate, and I assume my characters do. They also shave, scratch their balls, rub their eyes, eat cereal....most of that won't make it to a book unless it is critical. Even if I start with them waking up, I don't need to detail them voiding their night-swollen bladders, chronicle the likely presence of morning wood, elaborate on if they also passed gas, showered, etc. etc. etc.

some stuff is mundane, expected, and simply gets cut. So barring it somehow serving the story, I don't see any reason you can't bypass the waiter, or give passing mention to him (the waiter returned to their table, and Kelly paused until he was gone. 'Seriously, Dave? I can't believe you are such a fucking piece of shit about this,' she continued.") and move right along past it

Plot Device · Mar 19, 2013

quicklime said:
I tend to defecate, and I assume my characters do. They also shave, scratch their balls, rub their eyes, eat cereal....most of that won't make it to a book unless it is critical. Even if I start with them waking up, I don't need to detail them voiding their night-swollen bladders, chronicle the likely presence of morning wood, elaborate on if they also passed gas, showered, etc. etc. etc.

some stuff is mundane, expected, and simply gets cut. So barring it somehow serving the story, I don't see any reason you can't bypass the waiter, or give passing mention to him (the waiter returned to their table, and Kelly paused until he was gone. 'Seriously, Dave? I can't believe you are such a fucking piece of shit about this,' she continued.") and move right along past it

I don't scratch my balls.

Oh wait ... I don't have balls.

tko · Mar 19, 2013

turn it into character development

Yeah, its a general problem. Not just restaurants, but anywhere you have some conversation, inner dialog, whatever. Do you bore the reader, or leave scene details out? Taxi rides, driving a car, a living room, who cares what they look like?

What I've seen done, and try to imitate, is to use a broad brush to generate a feel in a few words, and then use little scene details to help flesh out characters. How does the MC react to the environment?

Is the MC cheap w/the bill? Ravenous? Hitting on the waitress? Impatient? Upset by certain smells? If the ambiance supports the scene, so much the better. A diner? Sawdust on the floor? A heavyset computer geek at McDonalds and loving it? Work the ambiance in between the natural conversational pauses--you need something there anyway.

Of course, sometimes a restaurant is just a restaurant. In which case descriptions are going to bore the reader to death (a rule I'm learning to cherish - if it bores me to write, it's going to bore the reader to read.) A few carefully chosen words is all you need.

dirtroadfilms · Mar 30, 2013

SianaBlackwood said:
Write in all the details as you see them happening and then throw away the boring stuff later?

Perfect, excellent advice.

Orianna2000 · Mar 31, 2013

Some restaurants, the waiters will hover, always checking on you, always within sight. But in others, they will leave you alone, even when you're anxious for service. When we visited London, we went to a Mexican restaurant where dinner took a couple of hours because the waitress kept disappearing for long stretches. We waited close to an hour to finally get our check. You could use something like that and it wouldn't be unrealistic. It could even be creepy, if you wanted it to be, especially if the restaurant was deserted, such as in the middle of the afternoon, or late at night.

quietglow · Mar 31, 2013

The foodie in me compels me to say: restaurants can be amazingly rich, polarizing, revealings, settings.

For instance: if you want to reveal a char's lack of social confidence (or the opposite), make the restaurant uber-slick and swanky. Want to reveal a germophobe? Time for a stanky taco joint.

I have to keep my characters from wandering into restaurants at every possible opportunity. Seriously: on my first draft of my WIP I realized I ended up with three restaurant scenes (and the book is about a garden).

Ken · Mar 31, 2013

... just skip the trivialities by leaping forward in time. If you start off with them at the restaurant eating then you're set so long as it isn't important for readers to be there when they enter the restaurant, etc. Is it? If not, no problems. Writing chronologically is fine, but you've always got leeway and wiggle room. Readers won't subtract points if you skip this and that. They'll thank you on the contrary. If you find it dull to write about they will most certainly find it dull to read. G'luck. Sure you'll do fine.

dirtroadfilms · Mar 31, 2013

Ken said:
... just skip the trivialities by leaping forward in time. If you start off with them at the restaurant eating then you're set so long as it isn't important for readers to be there when they enter the restaurant, etc. Is it? If not, no problems. Writing chronologically is fine, but you've always got leeway and wiggle room. Readers won't subtract points if you skip this and that. They'll thank you on the contrary. If you find it dull to write about they will most certainly find it dull to read. G'luck. Sure you'll do fine.

Great points.

Restaurant scenes

Hamilton

Phaeal

Whatever I did, I didn't do it.

Debbie V

Mentoring Myself and Others

Krystal Heart

WeaselFire

Benefactor Member

NeuroFizz

The grad students did it

timewaster

present

BethS

quickWit

Totally Ninja!

quicklime

all out of fucks to give

Plot Device

A woman said to write like a man.

tko

just thanks fore everything

dirtroadfilms

Orianna2000

Freelance Writer

quietglow

chocolate. stat.

Ken

dirtroadfilms