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Thread: Mistaken Identity Shooting (Killer Cop Related)

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    Mistaken Identity Shooting (Killer Cop Related)

    The attorney representing the two women shot by mistake by police officers looking for Charles Dorner (the LA killer former cop) is alleging that police fired on them without warning, and without giving them a chance to give up. Also, the truck they were driving is both a different make and a different color than Dorner's truck. Now, we all know that attorneys will spin things in whatever way will most benefit their clients (it's their job to do so). But if he's accurate about this account, then there are some more cops who need to have their careers terminated. This appears to be a totally reckless and egregious mistake.

    http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...wyer-says?lite
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    A woman said to write like a man. Plot Device's Avatar
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    The cops in LA are VERY freaked out. Never good to be carrying a gun when you are not in the right frame of mind. Even worse if you actually draw the damned gun while your head is in that sort of zone.

    The photos of the vehicle AFTER the shootout show a total Swiss cheese job of bullets all over the vehicle's backside. Yeah, those cops went way the frick overboard.

    Bottom line: not professional, very reckless, and they are damned lucky no one got killed. I'm sure LAPD will settle out of court.
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    Why do we allow cops to go all vigilante and willie-nillie execute suspects?
    Judges and juries are supposed to make that decisions.

    Some cops and cop organizations can get so out of hand they present a real danger to society. It's a serious problem.
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    Here is a video and report from KTLA 5. It wasn't the only vehicle fired upon that morning.

    The above story also details another truck was shot up a few blocks away shortly after the 71 yr old woman was shot and her daughter injured by flying glass.
    The second incident, which involved Torrance police officers, happened around 5:45 a.m. at Flagler Lane and Beryl Street.
    The Torrance officers had apparently heard about the nearby incident, and while en route they encountered a dark pickup that looked similar to Dornerís.
    They opened fire on the pickup. The man who was inside was not hit. So far, there has been no word of plans for a lawsuit from him.

  5. #5
    You can't sit with us! missesdash's Avatar
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    I can't believe they're just shooting at trucks. How idiotic. Do they really think he's going to be casually driving around in his truck anyway?

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    It's too hot Mclesh's Avatar
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    The news here in Los Angeles has covered this story pretty much nonstop.

    I watched as the news reporter interviewed neighbors on the street where the newspaper delivery driver and her passenger were shot. There were bullets lodged in neighbors' cars, garage doors, as well as the truck the two WOMEN drove. I think they call this a "spray-and-pray approach."

    There is really no excuse for this. Don't drive a truck in Southern California right now, I guess.

  7. #7
    A woman said to write like a man. Plot Device's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mclesh View Post
    I think they call this a "spray-and-pray approach."
    That is exactly what it is called. When you are a sloppy shot, or if you're so scared at the moment that your aim is off, the more bullets you can pump out in mere seconds, the better --all in the hopes (and prayers) that ONE of those bullets will meet its intended target of either a knee cap or (better) a vital organ or the center mass of a skull.

    (I wonder what the capacity of their respective magazines was.)
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    Well, it's probably safe to drive a truck now, since he apparently drove to Big Bear Lake and burned it.

    However, it does appear that Southern California cops right now are more dangerous to the public than Dorner.
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    Lost in the Fog rugcat's Avatar
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    Clearly they believed, for whatever reason, that Dorner was in that truck. Clearly, he wasn't.

    Stupid, stupid, stupid.
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    I don't think "stupid" is the right word for what happened. I believe it to be a deeper and more serious misconduct than mere "stupid".
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    A woman said to write like a man. Plot Device's Avatar
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    I think it was nerves frazzled beyond anything those cops had ever been trained in. Jittery, trigger-happy, scared shitless cops shooting at shadows.
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  12. #12
    Lost in the Fog rugcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sulong View Post
    I don't think "stupid" is the right word for what happened. I believe it to be a deeper and more serious misconduct than mere "stupid".
    Don't forget, this was not just a random truck. These cops were apparently on a protection detail for an officer they believed Dorner was coming after. Maybe the truck was approaching the target house, and slowing down -- you know, like if they were delivering a paper.

    The cops jumped to an erroneous conclusion. I'm sure they were positive it was him, and believing they had a heavily armed suspect intent on killing them at costs, decided not to give him the chance. They certainly weren't about to walk up to the truck and announce, "You're under arrest."

    They were operating in panic mode. They were stupid, because they acted on an assumption without regard to other possibilities.

    But there's no point in assigning ulterior motives, or assuming they were simply firing on random trucks, just in case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rugcat View Post
    Don't forget, this was not just a random truck. These cops were apparently on a protection detail for an officer they believed Dorner was coming after. Maybe the truck was approaching the target house, and slowing down -- you know, like if they were delivering a paper.

    The cops jumped to an erroneous conclusion. I'm sure they were positive it was him, and believing they had a heavily armed suspect intent on killing them at costs, decided not to give him the chance. They certainly weren't about to walk up to the truck and announce, "You're under arrest."

    They were operating in panic mode. They were stupid, because they acted on an assumption without regard to other possibilities.

    But there's no point in assigning ulterior motives, or assuming they were simply firing on random trucks, just in case.
    I understand what you're saying about assumptions and all. I wasn't attempting to imply an ulterior motive ether.

    But, the big black guy the cops are after, looks nothing like a 71 year old woman, or a 40 something year old woman.

    So what were the cops shooting at? The dark?
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    A woman said to write like a man. Plot Device's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sulong View Post
    I understand what you're saying about assumptions and all. I wasn't attempting to imply an ulterior motive ether.

    But, the big black guy the cops are after, looks nothing like a 71 year old woman, or a 40 something year old woman.

    So what were the cops shooting at? The dark?
    They shot up the back-end of the truck. They were shooting at a tailgate.
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    Lost in the Fog rugcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sulong View Post
    I understand what you're saying about assumptions and all. I wasn't attempting to imply an ulterior motive ether.

    But, the big black guy the cops are after, looks nothing like a 71 year old woman, or a 40 something year old woman.

    So what were the cops shooting at? The dark?
    I think we're almost nit picking here about the exact degree of incompetence and culpability. But we can all agree that it was a fuck-up of monumental proportions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rugcat View Post
    I think we're almost nit picking here about the exact degree of incompetence and culpability. But we can all agree that it was a fuck-up of monumental proportions.
    Agreed
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plot Device View Post
    That is exactly what it is called. When you are a sloppy shot, or if you're so scared at the moment that your aim is off, the more bullets you can pump out in mere seconds, the better --all in the hopes (and prayers) that ONE of those bullets will meet its intended target of either a knee cap or (better) a vital organ or the center mass of a skull.

    (I wonder what the capacity of their respective magazines was.)
    Actually, the local news here said LAPD official policy is "shoot to stop" (not shoot to kill, nor shoot to disable), which they said does not mean a shot in the arm or leg because it won't stop an armed assailant (or uh, little old lady delivering newspapers). Which means basically the plan is a shot aimed at the center of the chest if they believe they or another person is in danger. They don't shoot at people's limbs.

    http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/lo...190485001.html

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    Look! a blue truck! that has to be him!

    bangbangbang

    ...there's another blue truck!! shoot again!!!


    I know they are freaked out but if they can't work under stressful conditions like this maaaaaybbeee they shouldn't carry guns for a living.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Atlantis View Post
    Look! a blue truck! that has to be him!

    bangbangbang

    ...there's another blue truck!! shoot again!!!


    I know they are freaked out but if they can't work under stressful conditions like this maaaaaybbeee they shouldn't carry guns for a living.
    Especially when the suspect was driving a gray truck.
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    A woman said to write like a man. Plot Device's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atlantis View Post
    Look! a blue truck! that has to be him!

    bangbangbang

    ...there's another blue truck!! shoot again!!!


    I know they are freaked out but if they can't work under stressful conditions like this maaaaaybbeee they shouldn't carry guns for a living.

    My feeling is that THIS situation defies everything they have ever been trained to handle. This is a guy who is killing the families of cops. Therefore, this is psychological warfare, attacking the minds and nerves of the cops. And that attack is succeeding in its goal of messing with their heads to the point of near-incapacitation. Succeeding in spades. That Swiss cheese blue pickup truck is Exhibit A as far as the evidence of his success.
    It's NOT the end of steam, it's the end of CHEAP steam.
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plot Device View Post
    My feeling is that THIS situation defies everything they have ever been trained to handle. This is a guy who is killing the families of cops. Therefore, this is psychological warfare, attacking the minds and nerves of the cops. And that attack is succeeding in its goal of messing with their heads to the point of near-incapacitation. Succeeding in spades. That Swiss cheese blue pickup truck is Exhibit A as far as the evidence of his success.
    As I said in the other thread, the LAPD is not renowned for their amazing competence.

    This should fall WELL under what they're trained to handle. It's a guy who wants to shoot cops. That's not novel. That covers a lot of people, from pissed-off random citizens to former arrestees with a grudge to people trying to commit suicide,.

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    As someone I heard from LA (other Angelenos please confirm) that the LAPD do not offer the same pay as the Los Angeles Sheriff department and thus constantly has difficulty drawing enough qualifying candidates to fill the job. In the 80s and early 90s, because of the pay issue, few people from within the city took up the positions available in the LAPD, forcing them to hire folks from the rural South (aka Deep South.) Their lack of understanding of urban crime issues and the racism of the folks they hired ultimately led to the LA Riots of 1992. Looks like this pay issue is coming to a head again. Sounds like some consolidation/amalgamation of services is going to be needed.

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    I think the "cops are freaked out and trigger-happy" theory seems to be the most legit at the moment. They're firing at any perceived threats - because the threat is specifically targeting them - and sacrificing the safety of civilians in order to protect themselves.
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    We have these kind of shootings all the time in Mexico. If anything, the war on drugs showed the current government forces are even bigger idiots than we previously thought.
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    All Living is Local Don's Avatar
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    When you multiply the impact of one lone yet well-trained crazy by the number of ex-military personnel who belong to organizations like Oathkeepers, then add in even a tiny portion of the 80 million gun owners who might fall off the fence in their direction if push came to shove, the whole "armed citizens are no threat to the government" argument begins to lose its luster.

    What's the answer to the equation "Charles Dorner times whatever number you arrived at in the above exercise?"

    Now factor in the possibility that some portion of those actors, or those who sympathize with them, may well still hold posts of substantial influence in the organizations they are battling against. Toss in some history and whatever your answer, "the status quo" isn't even in the running.
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