I’m not sure what genre my novel falls under.

msd · Jan 5, 2013

I’m not sure what genre my novel falls under. I think its science fiction but a friend told me it might be alternate history.

My book takes place during the ancient Persian Empire, about 500 BC. My characters traveled through time to get there from the twenty first century and they do intermingle with the real historical personages of that time. No changes are made to the historical accuracies of the events and when they come back to our time, history is not rewritten.

Can it be more than one genre? Since it has a lot of action along with a mystery to solve, can it be a mystery – action - science fiction novel?

Kerosene · Jan 5, 2013

I'm unfamiliar with SF subgenres, but yes, SF all the way. Your characters come from the future where time travel is possible=SF.

Mystery, action, drama, comedy; all that just folds in. Unless its something that completely flips the normal genre, like horror or romance, just keep to the straight definition.

EDT: Oh, there is a time travel subgenre, but I don't think that there'll be any shelves of that particular sub-genre in any stores. If you're querying, the summary should make perfect sense that they are time travelling, so just call is Sci-Fi.

James D. Macdonald · Jan 5, 2013

Alternate History is a sub-genre of Science Fiction. The same agents and publishers handle both.

virtue_summer · Jan 5, 2013

I'd say science fiction. It's a time travel story. If you don't change history there's no alternate history.

alleycat · Jan 5, 2013

I was just going to post when I noticed Will's edit. Yep, SF, Time Travel.

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

How do they travel through time? Technically anything with time travel is space opera as current science doesn't support the possibility of it but if you have technology to explain it, sci fi would stretch. On the other hand if they use a genetic quirk that's not sci fi. Magic powers puts it into fantasy.
When they go back what do they do? If it explores a what if this changed scenario it may be alternate history. A few more details might help nail it for you, and it is important when you reach query stage that you know which speculative sub genre its in.

Edit, sorry there's an anorak everywhere...

jjdebenedictis · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
How do they travel through time? Technically anything with time travel is space opera as current science doesn't support the possibility of it but if you have technology to explain it, sci fi would stretch. On the other hand if they use a genetic quirk that's not sci fi. Magic powers puts it into fantasy.
When they go back what do they do? If it explores a what if this changed scenario it may be alternate history. A few more details might help nail it for you, and it is important when you reach query stage that you know which speculative sub genre its in.

Sorry, but I have to quibble! First, space opera is also a type of science fiction.

Second, it's not that important to know what the book is beyond "science fiction". The agent only really cares where it would be shelved in the bookstore.

This is because genres exist not to accurately label books, but to funnel readers who like those sorts of books to the correct shelf in the bookstore. It's about marketing, not precision.

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

jjdebenedictis said:
Sorry, but I have to quibble! First, space opera is also a type of science fiction.

Second, it's not that important to know what the book is beyond "science fiction". The agent only really cares where it would be shelved in the bookstore.

This is because genres exist not to accurately label books, but to funnel readers who like those sorts of books to the correct shelf in the bookstore. It's about marketing, not precision.

I'm sorry to disagree

within sci fi the sub- genre is really important to the agent. For adult sci fi there are very few specialist agents and they will be looking for placement within the genre that is currently selling. If it turns out to be hard sci fi that means specialist sellers, space opera is a bit passe at the mo, but coming back ( baen books are doing well) and science fantasy is in vogue due to eg Mievielle and others. Few other genres are so precise in their subgenre and whilst the OP can say sci fi, that actually tells the agent very little in terms of marketability. And that is what an agent is focused on, not where it gets stocked. ( John Jarrold is very interesting about this and insists that if you want to pitch to him - and every sci fi writer does - that you must name 3 recent bestsellers your story is similar to, and that means knowing your subgenre.)

melnve · Jan 5, 2013

I have been toying with a similar idea (different time period though) where the protag travels back via a freak accident. I've been hesitant to refer to it at SF though since the only part of it that is SF is the accident. My research seems to suggest that all time travel is SF though, so I'll be interested to see what other posters have to say!

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

Time traveller's wife - a genetic quirk - is romance despite the sf element. Most time travelling books will be filed under sci fi, subgenre space opera, but it depends how the timetravelling is carried out and how strong the science is.

Buffysquirrel · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
Most time travelling books will be filed under sci fi, subgenre space opera, but it depends how the timetravelling is carried out and how strong the science is.

Umm, no. Space opera is generally set in space. Hence the name. Time travel, per se, does not take place in space.

Jarrold's guidelines want you to name successful authors in the same genre. He does not specify that you identify the sub-genre.

lbender · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
T Most time travelling books will be filed under sci fi, subgenre space opera, but it depends how the timetravelling is carried out and how strong the science is.

This doesn't sound right to me, either. Time travel books are very variable.

Eric Flint's 1632 AssitiShards series is an alternate history, even though the time travel is due to an alien 'time bubble' of some sort. I ignored how it happened and just enjoyed the story.

I have no idea how to categorize Gabaldon's Outlander series. It isn't space opera. Perhaps Romance? Fantasy? Alternate History? Don't know...but my wife loves it.

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

lbender said:
This doesn't sound right to me, either. Time travel books are very variable.

Eric Flint's 1632 AssitiShards series is an alternate history, even though the time travel is due to an alien 'time bubble' of some sort. I ignored how it happened and just enjoyed the story.

I have no idea how to categorize Gabaldon's Outlander series. It isn't space opera. Perhaps Romance? Fantasy? Alternate History? Don't know...but my wife loves it.

That was my point, i might have made it badly. We need more info from the op to know which genre their time travelling falls under, but it is unlikely to be pure sci fi ( and it might not be space opera, either, or paranormal, or fantasy) but to sell speculative, it needs to be clarified. Sorry if i was unclear.

Also, when John asks for three authors he wants ones that are similar to your book, similar enough he can pitch to publishers to stock it alongside. In sfff that means the same, or a closely linked, subgenre.

Buffysquirrel · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
Also, when John asks for three authors he wants ones that are similar to your book, similar enough he can pitch to publishers to stock it alongside. In sfff that means the same, or a closely linked, subgenre.

That's not the impression I got from the guidelines. Maybe he has clarified this elsewhere?

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/10900-personal-question-s-to-john-jarrold-3.html

The first twenty or so pages are direct from John. The other 80 or so aren't! I have read couple of direct edits done by him, and in them he is very direct and says the three authors must be current/ new, not established, and they must be comparable to your book on a number of parameters, one of which is who to stock you beside. I didn't use him for my sff developmental edit, or i would paste it here as it was really interesting and useful.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jan 5, 2013

I don't know what you heard from this guy, but most agents I've seen do not really specialize in a particular subgenre. They may specify they are looking for a certain something, but they won't trash your submission because you can't name three specific authors in a tiny little slice of the genre.

The books sounds like SF or maybe alt-history. Even if the history isn't significantly altered, the sort of time-travelling described sounds like it would appeal to alt hist readers, at least to an extent.

It's is most definitely not space opera.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
http://www.sffchronicles.co.uk/forum/10900-personal-question-s-to-john-jarrold-3.html

The first twenty or so pages are direct from John. The other 80 or so aren't! I have read couple of direct edits done by him, and in them he is very direct and says the three authors must be current/ new, not established, and they must be comparable to your book on a number of parameters, one of which is who to stock you beside. I didn't use him for my sff developmental edit, or i would paste it here as it was really interesting and useful.

Maybe I'm missing something here, but bookstores stock alphabetically, and rarely even split up SF and F, much less subgenres. Maybe you're talking about catalogue marketing material aimed at store buyers?

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

Liosse de Velishaf said:
I don't know what you heard from this guy, but most agents I've seen do not really specialize in a particular subgenre. They may specify they are looking for a certain something, but they won't trash your submission because you can't name three specific authors in a tiny little slice of the genre.

The books sounds like SF or maybe alt-history. Even if the history isn't significantly altered, the sort of time-travelling described sounds like it would appeal to alt hist readers, at least to an extent.

It's is most definitely not space opera.

John is one of the leading agents for sff. A lot of agents will look at sff, but the number who are considered specialists for the genre are really small. And he makes it clear, in your submission you must name three... It is an incredibly hard genre to get published in (outside of ya sci fi, which is a little easier) and to do so you to get your genre right in your pitch, that's all i am saying, and if the op has a sci fi novel he needs to be sure it falls under that category, otherwise the specialist agents ( in the uk, for instance, there are about five, and two are closed to submissions) have an easy excuse to slush you. And yes, john is talking at the buying level, that he needs to convince publishers there is a market, and to do that he has to convince book buyers.

So, once again, we need more info to accurately advise on a genre and sub genre in a highly competive market. That's all.

And no, the op's doesn't sound like space opera, but if it is time travel it may not be sci fi either.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
John is one of the leading agents for sff. A lot of agents will look at sff, but the number who are considered specialists for the genre are really small. And he makes it clear, in your submission you must name three... It is an incredibly hard genre to get published in (outside of ya sci fi, which is a little easier) and to do so you to get your genre right in your pitch, that's all i am saying, and if the op has a sci fi novel he needs to be sure it falls under that category, otherwise the specialist agents ( in the uk, for instance, there are about five, and two are closed to submissions) have an easy excuse to slush you. And yes, john is talking at the buying level, that he needs to convince publishers there is a market, and to do that he has to convince book buyers.

So, once again, we need more info to accurately advise on a genre and sub genre in a highly competive market. That's all.

And no, the op's doesn't sound like space opera, but if it is time travel it may not be sci fi either.

Actually, he says two or three.

Buffysquirrel · Jan 5, 2013

And he doesn't mention sub genres.

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

He states on his website the reason to do it is to prove you know your genre. If you are pitching space fantasy and you list Peter Hamilton, you evidence you don't know your genre. Or eg in my series work I wri sci fi with special powers similar to Pittacus Lore, but if I was to use that as an eg he writes YA and mine is adult. John may only imply it on his website, when giving direct advic he states it must be comparable, and in sff that means in the same, or closely related subgenre. Not high fantasy compared to an urban, or steam punk cf to weird western... Okay obvious egs but in a genre of very specialist subgenres an easy step to take, for the aspiring author, is making sure they are close.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jan 5, 2013

springs1 said:
He states on his website the reason to do it is to prove you know your genre. If you are pitching space fantasy and you list Peter Hamilton, you evidence you don't know your genre. Or eg in my series work I wri sci fi with special powers similar to Pittacus Lore, but if I was to use that as an eg he writes YA and mine is adult. John may only imply it on his website, when giving direct advic he states it must be comparable, and in sff that means in the same, or closely related subgenre. Not high fantasy compared to an urban, or steam punk cf to weird western... Okay obvious egs but in a genre of very specialist subgenres an easy step to take, for the aspiring author, is making sure they are close.

I'm curious what you mean by "space fantasy"...

James D. Macdonald · Jan 5, 2013

People who call SF "sci fi" don't know the genre, let alone the sub-genres.

Liosse de Velishaf · Jan 5, 2013

James D. Macdonald said:
People who call SF "sci fi" don't know the genre, let alone the sub-genres.

That maybe be true of the older generation, but I know plenty of people who are my age and call it sci fi. I don't see that the stigma applies as much now as it once did.

Jo Zebedee · Jan 5, 2013

Liosse de Velishaf said:
I'm curious what you mean by "space fantasy"...

It is stories set in space which have a significant fantasy element. Goodreads lists eg Dune as such, also Star wars. The cross over genre is science fantasy, but that doesn't neccesarily have a space setting.

James D. Macdonald said:
People who call SF "sci fi" don't know the genre, let alone the sub-genres.

I think that is quite trite, most people I know would use sci fi, sff, sf interchangeably, depending on preference.

I am not sure what the big deal is, my only suggestion was that the op needed to supply more info before the genre could be defined. I am a relative newby, have i overstepped a mark?

I’m not sure what genre my novel falls under.

msd

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