Poll Tax?

alleycat said:

Those were just soccer fans who were bored.

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I'm not sure if you're kidding, but that's just not true. It was a riot, and nothing to do with football. Football hooliganism by 1990 was in serious decline.


EDIT: and charging postage on voting forms is nothing like a poll tax in the conventional meaning of the term. It's not actually a tax at all though it is an outrageous bit of skimming by the relevant authorities, and an affront to democracy.

I could only see it as a poll tax if the state had traditionally paid to transport voters to the polling place and that option was no longer available.

Otherwise, it's equivalent: you're responsible for getting the ballot to the right place, whether you pay for the gas or bus fare to drag yourself to the polling place, or whether you pay the post office to deliver the ballot for you while you stay home. It's just that most people don't think about the cost of getting to the polling place because they don't pay it directly and they have more flexibility.

Yeah, I agree. There's nothing stopping Don from hand-delivering his ballot, so he doesn't have to actually pay a fee to vote.

But he's probably not going to pay for postage, anyway. Don looks like the type who reuses stamps. A little steam, a little eraser, viola...

Don said:

As for hand-delivery, this particular time I'm (only) 90 miles away from the clerk's office. Historically it's been a couple thousand miles, a bit far for hand delivery.

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Lincoln would have walked those thousands of miles. In two days. Through snow. Uphill.

The issue of "who pays the postage?" is causing some uproar here in Oregon this year. This is from the Portland newspaper:

http://www.oregonlive.com/mapes/index.ssf/2012/11/charges_fly_in_oregon_secretar.html#incart_river_default

Apparently state law says the voter must pay for postage. But the US Postal Service is delivering ballots that lack postage.

"Ronald Anderson, a spokesman for the Portland headquarters of the Postal Service, says it has long been the policy to deliver ballots even if they don't have enough postage."

It seems to be up to each county to decide, regardless of state law.

"Over the years, county elections offices have made different arrangements with local postal officials over how to handle ballots that don't have adequate postage."

And at least one county, Multnomah (which is where the largest city, Portland, is located), refuses ballots that don't have postage.

"Tim Scott, the Multnomah County elections director, said his county has long refused to accept ballots that didn't have enough postage. It's inconsistent with state law and gives voters a mixed message about whether they should put postage on their return ballots."

Most people put on postage in Multnomah County: "Scott, the Multnomah elections director, said a relatively small number of ballots come in without enough postage, although he didn't have statistics." But those people aren't getting their votes counted.

I dropped mine off at the library this afternoon. About 2 miles away, don't know how much it cost me in fuel. I was out running errands anyway.

Refusing ballots that lack postage? That's idiotic!

The postage is the fee collected by the Postal Service. Does the Postal Service run the elections? No? Then who gives a fuck if they don't mind not getting paid???? Isn't that their business and not the election officials'? That's like saying, "It's up to the voter to pay a kid a dollar to run to the post office for him, and if the kid does it for free for whatever reason, we're going to decide the ballot isn't valid." It's a small detail, but one of those small details that throws both the intelligence and the honesty of the officials into serious question, imo.

So in that county, is it forbidden absolutely to have ballots hand delivered, as by a courier service, or to use FedEx or UPS? Such deliveries won't come with postage stamped on them, either.

Damnation, that is fucked-up stupid. That's the kind of stupid that just pisses me right off.

robeiae said:

Lincoln would have walked those thousands of miles. In two days. Through snow. Uphill.

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Both ways, uphill.