Naive question

Old Hack · Sep 24, 2012

cacoethes scribendi said:
I suppose that jumping ship and using another agent in foreign markets to save the sub-agent fee, would be taken as disloyalty by the original agent?

Your contract with your agent wouldn't allow this, and you'd not benefit by doing it: you'd have to find agents in each of the various territories who were willing to take you on, which would be difficult; and once they found that you already had representation in your home market they'd almost certainly refuse to work with you.

quicklime · Sep 24, 2012

cacoethes scribendi said:
Many thanks for this reply. I see. Makes sense. What is the likelihood that the rejecting publisher makes a suggestion?

near zero. they may have rejected a hundred, or more, books that day, so unless they like it enough to tell you how to fix it so they can buy it, they don't tell you what is wrong.

waylander · Sep 24, 2012

If you start receiving individualised rejections, perhaps commenting on some aspect of the sample chapters the agent/editor didn't like, then you know you are getting close.

cacoethes scribendi · Sep 24, 2012

waylander said:
If you start receiving individualised rejections, perhaps commenting on some aspect of the sample chapters the agent/editor didn't like, then you know you are getting close.

Thanks for this insight, it's nice to have an idea of what milestones lie along the way

cacoethes scribendi · Sep 24, 2012

quicklime said:
near zero. they may have rejected a hundred, or more, books that day, so unless they like it enough to tell you how to fix it so they can buy it, they don't tell you what is wrong.

Ah. If an agent is interested and thinks a book is worth promoting, would he/she normally inform you of the submissions made to publishers, or does it all just go into a black hole?

cacoethes scribendi · Sep 24, 2012

Old Hack said:
Your contract with your agent wouldn't allow this, and you'd not benefit by doing it: you'd have to find agents in each of the various territories who were willing to take you on, which would be difficult; and once they found that you already had representation in your home market they'd almost certainly refuse to work with you.

Thanks. I'm not a bad person, but I just had to ask

Little Ming · Sep 24, 2012

cacoethes scribendi, I encourage you to do more research on your own instead of asking all these individual questions. Most of them have been asked and answered multiple times, and it seems to me that you are not very familiar with how things work or some of the industry terms. It makes it harder for members to have to reread this entire thread to figure out what you are asking.

For example:

cacoethes scribendi said:
Ah. If an agent is interested and thinks a book is worth promoting, agents don't "promote" books. Agents "sell" books to publishers. Publishers have their own department to "promote" books. would he/she normally inform you of the submissions made to publishers, I'm confused by your question, because going back through the thread, it seems like this question originated from whether a rejecting publisher would make a "suggestion" (not sure what you mean by suggestion), but here you are asking about agents in the same context. Publishers and agents play different roles, so I'm not sure how you want to answer this question. or does it all just go into a black hole?

I'm not sure what you are asking in this question. As many have already told you, agents are unlikely to give detailed feedback to a non-client. It is possible that if an agent feels you are very, very close you might get some feedback, but again, don't count on it.

I don't know what you mean " inform you of the submissions made to publishers." If you are not a client, why would an agent inform you of their business-dealings?

I'm not trying to be mean, but I really think you will learn a lot more if you just read around. Even just reading random threads can teach you a lot about publishing that you never thought of.

Cyia · Sep 24, 2012

If you sign with an agent - and only if - they will then submit the book to editors (at publishers) they think will be interested. Some agents only tell you if you get an offer, others will pass along any and all communications from those editors. You'd need to talk to your agent up front to determine which method you'd prefer and how your agent prefers to work.

Agents should NEVER be speaking to publishers about books or authors they don't represent. It taints the submission waters for the author if they sign somewhere else.

Old Hack · Sep 24, 2012

Little Ming said:
cacoethes scribendi, I encourage you to do more research on your own instead of asking all these individual questions.

I agree with the need for writers to do their own research but sometimes things that seem obvious to those of us who already know all this stuff are not at all obvious to those who don't have the same expertise that we have, nor is it always easy to understand what it is, exactly, we need to learn, or the questions we need to ask.

I thought that this thread was developing into a really useful primer on how publishing works for new writers, to be honest. And I'm surprised by your reaction to it (and no, I really don't intend that to be mean or critical, it's just an observation).

Little Ming · Sep 24, 2012

Old Hack said:
I agree with the need for writers to do their own research but sometimes things that seem obvious to those of us who already know all this stuff are not at all obvious to those who don't have the same expertise that we have, nor is it always easy to understand what it is, exactly, we need to learn, or the questions we need to ask.

I thought that this thread was developing into a really useful primer on how publishing works for new writers, to be honest. And I'm surprised by your reaction to it (and no, I really don't intend that to be mean or critical, it's just an observation).

It might just be me, but I felt like some of the same questions (or variations of the same questions) were being asked and answered, i.e. the will agents/publishers give detailed feedback question. Of course, that might just be because many members, myself included, answered the same question, so it felt like it was becoming repetitive.

I'll bow out now.

Old Hack · Sep 24, 2012

No, Ming, don't disappear. You're useful and helpful and fine. I think that after we've been here for a while we start to see questions being repeated and it can get old: but it's important that we keep answering and helping where we can, as those questions are new to the people asking them and they need help, just like we did once.

(Except for me, of course: I've always known everything, obviously.)

cacoethes scribendi · Sep 24, 2012

Little Ming said:
it seems to me that you are not very familiar with how things work or some of the industry terms.

This is certainly true and I flag this in the message which started the thread. I hope it doesn't preclude me from asking questions however. I feel encouraged by the fact that I received such constructive and well-informed advice.

Little Ming said:
It makes it harder for members to have to reread this entire thread to figure out what you are asking. For example:

I don't know what you mean " inform you of the submissions made to publishers." If you are not a client, why would an agent inform you of their business-dealings?

This is based on the assumption that an agent has accepted an author as a client. My question is whether agents openly inform authors of the efforts they are making, or if the industry culture doesn't lend itself to this.

Little Ming said:
agents don't "promote" books. Agents "sell" books to publishers. Publishers have their own department to "promote" books.

Definition of promote (source:
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/promote?q=promote)
verb
[with object]
1support or actively encourage (a cause, venture, etc.); further the progress of:
give publicity to (a product, organization, or venture) so as to increase sales or public awareness:

I'm new to this, so I rely on generic terms which I believe are accurate and hope experienced people will see past this

I meant that if the agent likes the book, he engages with the author and promotes it to the publisher, who, if she buys it, promotes it to booksellers, who in turn (if they engage), promote it to readers. I hope that's broadly true?

Little Ming said:
It might just be me, but I felt like some of the same questions (or variations of the same questions) were being asked and answered, i.e. the will agents/publishers give detailed feedback question. Of course, that might just be because many members, myself included, answered the same question, so it felt like it was becoming repetitive.

I feel fairly sure that I didn't ask the same question twice and that each question I asked was built on information provided in this thread. In a few cases, several people kindly provided answers to the same question and I wished to thank them individually as the discussion progressed. Each contribution enriched my understanding of the process and I wished to acknowledge that.

:Sun:

cacoethes scribendi · Sep 25, 2012

Cyia said:
Some agents only tell you if you get an offer, others will pass along any and all communications from those editors. You'd need to talk to your agent up front to determine which method you'd prefer and how your agent prefers to work.

Thanks, will do (if I get that far). I asked the question because in some service industries, the service providers avoid open communication with clients, sometimes admittedly with good reason. I have no reference in the literary agency business of course. A commission only arrangement should act to motivate agents I would think, but personally, I would like to know what is being done on my behalf. I would try to have the discussion early in the process as you suggest.

Naive question

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman

quicklime

all out of fucks to give

waylander

Who's going for a beer?

cacoethes scribendi

cacoethes scribendi

cacoethes scribendi

Little Ming

Cyia

Rewriting My Destiny

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman

Little Ming

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman

cacoethes scribendi

cacoethes scribendi