Saudi Women Drive Cars on 17th June in Defiance of Saudi Law

How cool! Good for them!

... the USA really needs to find ways to be less dependent on Saudi oil. The thought that we are economically supporting a regime that treats women in this way is disturbing.

Maybe we should all NOT drive to support them driving.

... I don't myself. Can't afford an auto. I do take the bus though. So I still am consuming oil, indirectly. I like your idea though. Even if we just reduced our dependence on oil a bit it'd maybe make a difference and give the country more leverage.

I don't drive because it kind of freaks me out. Public transport uses oil, but more efficiently.

Ken said:

... the USA really needs to find ways to be less dependent on Saudi oil. The thought that we are economically supporting a regime that treats women in this way is disturbing.

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You see how the US is treating its women these days?

third person said:

You see how the US is treating its women these days?

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I was about to say too, that from the outside it doesn't seem to be that much different.

But yeah, good for the women!

As others have said, good for them.

When it comes to civil rights in countries dominated by antiquated religious doctrine, nothing's going to change unless people who aren't allowed to sit at the front of the bus... decide to sit at the front of the bus. Let's just hope the extreme media coverage that's no doubt present will keep the lashings to a minimum.

I can't not drive. I live in the 'burbs. Some days, I'd gladly sell my car for a horse. But if I could boycott driving, I would to show my support.

I hate driving, but need to appreciate how lucky I am not to be Saudi.

The next time I get behind the wheel, I'm dedicating the drive to these courageous women.

Damn. If I'd known in advance, I could have actually organized a driving boycott here.

Alessandra Kelley said:

The point of this thread was to express support for Saudi women's rights, not to say how bad we have it over here. I know you are sympathetic and alarmed for women's rights here too, but there are plenty of other threads for that.

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I think the point was that it is hardly surprising that the US will not stand up for women in Saudi Arabia by refusing to economically support the country, considering its attitude toward its own women.

It is true that they have it much worse. We are truly lucky to live in a country where we can practice civil disobedience and not worry about being bullwhipped.

Celia Cyanide said:

I think the point was that it is hardly surprising that the US will not stand up for women in Saudi Arabia by refusing to economically support the country, considering its attitude toward its own women.

It is true that they have it much worse. We are truly lucky to live in a country where we can practice civil disobedience and not worry about being bullwhipped.

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This. These women and their families and supporters are incredibly brave, and we American women should remember all that we have to lose if we don't stand up for the rights of everyone, including women in places like Saudi Arabia.

muravyets said:

...and we American women should remember all that we have to lose if we don't stand up for the rights of everyone, including women in places like Saudi Arabia.

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... spot-on observation. And it's true of all our rights and liberties. We've got to look out for one another or we'll all lose out in the end.

Alessandra Kelley said:

We still have it considerably better than Saudi women, even with the scary anti-woman laws being proposed and in some cases (I'm looking at you, Texas) passed in the US.

The point of this thread was to express support for Saudi women's rights, not to say how bad we have it over here. I know you are sympathetic and alarmed for women's rights here too, but there are plenty of other threads for that.

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What I meant was, with how the US treats its women it should be no surprise that we support countries that are themselves so backwards.

I am by no means defending the repression of women in Saudi Arabia or anywhere else. But keep in mind, we're talking here about a country that not too many years ago finally formally outlawed slavery and that is basically a collection of tribes run by a family. More a family business than a nation as we usually think of nations. And the fact that it is immersed in one of the more conservative branches of Islam doesn't help it become modern.
On the other hand, they've made some progress recently under King Abdullah, a Bedouin leader who has made what has to be some tough steps forward, given that, although he has exceptional power, he still must please the religious leaders, a bunch of tribes people with a shocking illiteracy rate, and other members of the large Saud family. That ain't easy.

We need a strong ally in the region for any number of reasons, not all of which pertain to oil. Counter balance for Iran, etc., etc. While we can deplore other countries' treatment of minorities and women, and can try to gently persuade them to improve, if we refuse to be friends with any country that doesn't meet our high ethical standards (cough! cough!), we'll have damned few friends.


When I was in Saudi, in 1976-77, one woman, and only one, could be seen occasionally driving in her own car, and with her veil thrown back yet. I was told she was a highly respected Egyptian doctor, and she was left alone by the authorities.

The progress is agonizingly slow, but it's happening. I think we can have more influence through friendship and persuasion than through demanding.

Archerbird said:

I was about to say too, that from the outside it doesn't seem to be that much different.

But yeah, good for the women!

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From the inside, it feels quite different. I haven't been lashed or seen anyone stoned to death in a while.

I worked with a guy who had lived in Saudi Arabia. I hope his stories weren't true about the public executions he saw there I can't fathom the horror of it, and he didn't even know what the woman had been sentenced for.

I can't speak to the veracity or not of someone else. I do know that Westerners are normally very much discouraged from being present at executions. (They take place, in Riyadh, at what we knew as "Head Chopper Square," and I have looked at the chopping block and rings to which the condemned is cuffed, but never an execution itself. Not that I would have wanted to watch one.)