Genre Stigma

Debeucci · May 29, 2012

Stacia Kane said:
Really? I get, "Oh." And a change of subject.

I wonder if I say it wrong or something? I honestly don't think I've ever had anyone seem even remotely interested or impressed.

It makes me giggle when people say they can now tell everyone they're Published Authors, because my thought is always, "Yes, and no one will care."

I think not so much that it is impressive, but that outside of writing forums and conventions, you rarely meet someone who writes? I'm desperate to find someone locally (in Chicago no less) who treats writing as seriously as i do. It's such a lonely and quite misunderstood thing to do.

Too much media attention goes to celebrities who write (with just a teeny weeny bit of help from their ghost writers of course) books just because they're celebrities.

elindsen · May 29, 2012

It happens in all genres.
Pictures books=not smart enough to write a novel
Romance=not real writing
Mystery/thriller=who gets shot?

There's always a list. As an erotica writer, I get the porn look. A lot.

Bisileyton · May 29, 2012

I struggle with this a lot. My mother is very traditional African woman and I can't explain to her exactly what my zombie post apocalyptic, alternate universe, interracial romance novel is about.

But then the also is the situation with a lot of my friends too.

I'll echo what have been said before, write what you love because you love it. Write the best you can.

Rob Lopez · May 29, 2012

Yes, simply being a writer often translates into 'timewaster', 'daydreamer' or 'slacker' to people I have mentioned it to in the past. Worse still was the phrase 'I'm writing a novel'. If I wasn't already published then clearly I was some sort of fantasising loon.

The best reply I tended to get was 'that sounds interesting', from someone who didn't really want to explore it further. But to be honest, when I used to be a cleaner, nobody could muster even that level of interest in what I did.

I don't bother telling anyone I'm a writer anymore - that's between me and my readers. If I get casual questions about my occupation I tell them I'm either a cleaner or a househusband. They assume I'm a waste of space and I get to stare out of the window some more.

I'm not a socialite. :tongue

Stacia Kane · May 29, 2012

Debeucci said:
I think not so much that it is impressive, but that outside of writing forums and conventions, you rarely meet someone who writes? I'm desperate to find someone locally (in Chicago no less) who treats writing as seriously as i do. It's such a lonely and quite misunderstood thing to do.

Too much media attention goes to celebrities who write (with just a teeny weeny bit of help from their ghost writers of course) books just because they're celebrities.

To clarify, I don't think it's impressive and do not expect anyone to be remotely impressed by me (trust me). I was replying to your use of "impressed," was all.

I rarely meet people who write. They still don't give a damn what I do for a living, or care to ask any questions or express even the slightest bit of interest. *shrug*

elindsen · May 30, 2012

I agree with Stacia. I don't know how else to put it, but people who love writing for the sake of the story don't walk around with flashing neon lights. When I tell people I write, they are more like "okay, cool" than wowed. Its only when I show them it's erotica that they get excited

lorna_w · May 31, 2012

Resurrecting thread because y'all made me think about telling people I write, rather out of the blue, which I haven't done in decades, and I tried some of that at a Memorial Day (a U.S. holiday) picnic with a bunch of strangers. 2/3 people said, "huh," but politely enough, and one 10 year old girl who writes and I had a wonderful hour-long conversation. Her attitude about work habits, audience, and more really impressed me. (She was spookily mature in many ways, in fact.) I mentioned it to a library volunteer yesterday and she said, "I'm jealous," which, since she was retired and could have done it herself confused me a little. So far, no one has even asked my genre, much less insulted it. After I insert, "I'm working on a novel!" into the middle of a conversation, I haven't quite worked up the courage to bore them with what it's about, and they haven't seemed to care.

Jess Haines · May 31, 2012

I sometimes get glazed eyes or a "whu?" response when I say I write urban fantasy. When I say, "you know, like Buffy or True Blood," they nod sagely and edge away. Heh.

These days, I just keep it to myself and don't discuss my writing unless I'm already friends with or have gotten to know the person.

Raventongue · May 31, 2012

Aside from people who read it, barely anyone outside this board knows I write. And from every single one of them I get, "When are you going to sell this?" Ugh. I just say "It's not ready yet!" because otherwise I'd have to explain that I want to have at least three pieces done before I start getting rejection letters so I don't get discouraged and quit.

Those who find out and ask what I write get a one-word response: "Fantasy". Both because I don't think I'll be sure of my genre until at least the third draft, and because how many people besides writers, reviewers and a few very dedicated readers actually know one sub-genre from another?

Uh, my point is, ignore the genre stigma. If they weren't saying stupid things about genre, they'd be saying stupid things about something else writing-related.

aibrean · Jun 1, 2012

I just tell the story. I worry about what genre it is later (unless it's obvious). Then you can have some cross-genre works.

Quiggs1982 · Jun 1, 2012

I write romance mostly, so no one thinks my writing is serious. In fact, when I told my sister I was writing a memoir about our mother, she said, "I'm so glad you are writing a real book."

Nice!

fireluxlou · Jun 1, 2012

I've just got to say the negative comments I have received for only writing Y.A. have mainly been from other writers on other writing websites, who tend to scoff at the thought of writing for teens and how they think its 'low brow' (LOL) it is.

WeaselFire · Jun 1, 2012

I tell people I write what the voices tell me to. That way they leave me alone and I can write more.

Most of my published work is technical books. The problem with that is people hear what I write and their eyes don't glaze over and they don't leave me alone. They ask me why their new iPad won't connect to their neighbor's wireless the way their cell phone does.

As for real genre snobbery, my wife loves Paranormal Romance (did that genre even exist before Stephanie Meyer...?). I automatically bypass them because they seem silly, and I prefer a good mystery. But then I pick one up and find that it's a well-crafted mystery. It just happens that the hero's special talent isn't that she's ex-CIA or NYPD, she happens to see dead people. She has no special crime-solving training, it just is easier to find out what happened when you can ask the victim who killed them. The writing is awesome, it just happens to have a paranormal side to the story.

I hate being a genre snob. I hate it even more when I find out I really did judge a book by it's cover.

Jeff

Noirblanche · Jun 1, 2012

Not many people know I write, and when they ask and I answer "Fantasy" I can see the wheel turning in their heads, and I know from then on they tend to take me even less seriously than before.
I think my family would be happier for me to write something... yeah, more serious. Or to write the next LOTR but make millions (who wouldn't want that part, I admit).
But my better half loves fantasy (and I got to introduce him to Terry Pratchett's world, which is something that makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside), and I suppose that's partly why I am with him and not with somebody else. And his friends like it enough so that I content.
But my classmates from the past and similar people: daydreamer and all that, can't deal with real life (maybe true, but I don't necessarily think it has to do with the type of stories I keep finding in my head).

And I agree. I have no choice in what genre I write.

I would be so interested and thrilled to meet somebody else that writes that I probably wouldn't be able to stop asking them questions.

retromovie · Jun 2, 2012

One not very successful literary writer referred to thrillers as not requiring much research relative to historical novels, which I found quite ignorant.

thethinker42 · Jun 2, 2012

LJD said:
Romance writers get this an awful lot...

dangerousbill said:
Try being an erotica writer...

Word up.

Once! said:
Those who can, do. Those who can't, criticise.

I wouldn't worry. No, really, I wouldn't. People criticise what they don't understand. They criticise what they cannot do themselves. They criticise to feel better about themselves. Anything different, anything new, anything challenging.

Very true. Still gets tiresome after a while, but I've learned to either ignore people's reactions or (in the case of people I'm not terribly fond of) mess with their heads.

WildScribe said:
My very favorite reaction was the lady at Starbucks who struck up a conversation with me about what I was doing on the laptop. When she wouldn't stop pestering me for details I finally told her that I was writing lesbian erotica. She went silent, dug through her purse, pulled out a bible tract thingy, set it on my keyboard, and took her coffee and walked away.

LOL! Awesome.

I'm absolutely unashamed of what I write, BUT when I'm stuck next to someone on a plane for 10 hours, I'm not terribly inclined to announce I write gay erotic romance simply because it can make for a very, very awkward flight. That said, the guy next to me on the way back from Japan saw that I was working on a manuscript (before I got drunk, but that's another story). He asked what I wrote, and I kept being vague about it, but he kept asking.

Finally, I bit the bullet and said, "I write gay romance."

He blinked a couple of times. "So, like, two girls?"

"No. Two guys."

Cue incredulous stare for about 2 seconds. Cue me dreading the next 8.5 hours.

Then his eyes lit up and he said, "OH MY GOD! My boyfriend would LOVE THOSE!"

(And then we got drunk.)

thethinker42 · Jun 2, 2012

Squinkies said:
There's always a list. As an erotica writer, I get the porn look. A lot.

I get that look too. The exact same one I got when I was actually working for a porn company.

Followed by...

"And you write it under your real name?" (Yep.)
"Does your MOTHER know you write this stuff?" (My mom's read everything I've ever published.)
"Doesn't it, you know, squick you out/make you uncomfortable to write...that stuff?" (If anything, I get squicked out/uncomfortable writing the violent scenes in my suspense novels.)
"Do you actually do all the things your characters do?" (My sex life is none of your business.)

etc. etc. etc.

thethinker42 · Jun 2, 2012

retromovie said:
One not very successful literary writer referred to thrillers as not requiring much research relative to historical novels, which I found quite ignorant.

I've observed over the years that a statement about "Genre X doesn't require as much research as Genre Y" is usually made by someone who has never attempted to write Genre X.

I may have said something similar about thrillers at one time in my career. (That's not being evasive, I honestly can't remember if I ever thought one way or the other about thrillers.) Now that I've written a few? Good God. Not as much research, my ass...

Lissibith · Jun 2, 2012

thethinker42 said:
I'm absolutely unashamed of what I write, BUT when I'm stuck next to someone on a plane for 10 hours, I'm not terribly inclined to announce I write gay erotic romance simply because it can make for a very, very awkward flight. That said, the guy next to me on the way back from Japan saw that I was working on a manuscript (before I got drunk, but that's another story). He asked what I wrote, and I kept being vague about it, but he kept asking.

Finally, I bit the bullet and said, "I write gay romance."

He blinked a couple of times. "So, like, two girls?"

"No. Two guys."

Cue incredulous stare for about 2 seconds. Cue me dreading the next 8.5 hours.

Then his eyes lit up and he said, "OH MY GOD! My boyfriend would LOVE THOSE!"

(And then we got drunk.)

That is FANASTIC! Hahaha, what a great moment!

Most of my friends and family are big sci-fi and fantasy geeks so I don't get the genre side-eye so often. But I have actually lost a friend who went all fundamentalist after college and who decided that writing fantasy meant I was an occultist or something. I thought that thing was sort of an internet rumor, but apparently not

E. B. Pike · Jun 2, 2012

Chasing the Horizon said:
Everyone gets this from time to time. Just come up with a really smart-ass answer and leave it at that.

"When are you going to write something serious?"
"You don't take getting chased by monster seriously?! You're weird."

(here's a popular one for fantasy writers like me)
"When are you going to write something about the real world?"
"When people in the real world stop being such idiots."

Ah! This is perfect! I write YA contemporary fantasy and I sometimes get the weirdo look too. I'm totally going to steal your quote about writing something based in the real world.

E. B. Pike · Jun 2, 2012

thethinker42 said:
Word up.

I'm absolutely unashamed of what I write, BUT when I'm stuck next to someone on a plane for 10 hours, I'm not terribly inclined to announce I write gay erotic romance simply because it can make for a very, very awkward flight. That said, the guy next to me on the way back from Japan saw that I was working on a manuscript (before I got drunk, but that's another story). He asked what I wrote, and I kept being vague about it, but he kept asking.

Finally, I bit the bullet and said, "I write gay romance."

He blinked a couple of times. "So, like, two girls?"

"No. Two guys."

Cue incredulous stare for about 2 seconds. Cue me dreading the next 8.5 hours.

Then his eyes lit up and he said, "OH MY GOD! My boyfriend would LOVE THOSE!"

(And then we got drunk.)

This is the best story! I love it when you expect one reaction and someone completely surprises you.

IDGS · Jun 5, 2012

Jeez, why do I always get stuck starting the controversial threads? This one almost got as good as my ill-fated "Drinking And Writing" discussion three years ago, or the "Greek Seaman" debacle I should have never, never brought around.

That being said, excellent answers were found in huge amounts - thank you all for sharing!

This wasn't so much supposed to be a pat on the back for me to let me know it's all going to be okay - I have absolutely no problem with what I do, and wouldn't change it for the world. I write horror, I have written horror, I will continue to write horror. It is definitely nice to see the experiences I've had aren't limited to those in my genre, as I suspected.

Ah well, keep plugging away, all! We've all got work we should be doing.

EDIT: And for the record, in response to the multiple messages / rep comments I got, my DP is myself getting attacked by a zombie from a newspaper shoot last year. It's not Tre Cool from Green Day as I've been asked a good number of times, but thank you very much for thinking I'm nearly as rad as that dude. Thanks for the laugh, though!

CrastersBabies · Jun 5, 2012

You're always going to run into people who act like raging a$$-kayaks when you tell them you write horror, or fantasy, or sci-fi. Most are too ignorant to realize that horror is more than bodies and guts strewn across a room, or that fantasy is more than wizards with pointy hats and gnomes and crap.

Nothing you can really do about it.

My mom thinks all fantasy/sci-fi is "weird," and she always will. She also used to think that D&D was satanic, too, bless her lil' heart.

Tolstoyce · Jun 5, 2012

I've felt this before. I had an English/Creative Writing teacher in high school who I'm still friends with, and he is a huge fan of my writing. He's always supporting me and telling me I'm gonna go far. Then when he heard I was writing fantasy novels, he seemed disappointed. He implied I was "better than that." And though we're great friends, I've always felt like that was very narrow-minded of him. He's seen my writing, he's a fan of my writing...why does he think my "fantasy" work will be of less quality?

missouridalton · Jun 5, 2012

I write paranormal fantasy novels with gay main characters. They aren't romance, but because it can be difficult to break in the market when you have a blatantly gay character in your book (at least one agent told me she was "uncomfortable" trying to sell a book with a gay MC) I ended with a romance publisher. I don't write romance, there are romantic subplots, but I still get that, "You're an erotica writer, right?" from folks who know the publishing house.

It's annoying, because there are all sorts of great folks that don't write erotica in the house, and there are great folks that do write erotica. You definitely get a wide berth from the usual crowd of paranormal fantasy readers when they think it's erotica, and that's a shame.

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