The No News is No News Purgatory Thread, Vol. 7

I guess my only contribution to the "What works in publishing" discussion is that patience, persistence, and professionalism have paid off for me in my non-fiction writing. Breaking into women's glossies (as they say-- er, pork chop) seemed pretty unattainable to me just a few years ago, and my first big magazine clip was from a totally cold pitch. Literally an INTERN wrote me back to say she was forwarding it on to the big eds.

I haven't done so well with my fiction so far, but I have a lot of faith that the same approach will eventually pay off for me in some way.

But as everyone else is noting, there's not much that can be controlled about what the payoff will be. I'm just taking it one step at a time, I guess.

Blond I think if you ever get tired of all the wonderful ventures you participate in now you could always have a career in business advising.

Reading this is all so educational.

Fire, I love your comments from behind the editor’s desk, especially.

I have so little experience yet that all I have to add is that I’ve done some hard looking at my mystery while revising, and in figuring out how to address all the completely legit concerns she has, here’s what I’ve got:

I am a good writer. Everyone may not love my style or voice, but it’s good and there will be people who do. I got lucky and hit on an editor who does. But, must point out, it’s been 2 1/2 years since I sent the first query on this novel.

Speaking of queries, you know how I had that insane response rate on my query letter (total of 16 sent, agents and publishers, and I got 11 requests)? But then no takers on the ms? Well, looking at the revision notes I have here, it’s no wonder. The query promises a kick ass heroine who’s the perfect modern southern belle. What the previous version of the ms, written during a “I want a white knight to come rescue me” phase actually delivers is ... TBH, a kind of mooney, sappy chick who is smart and sassy and does all right until the guy shows up, and then she goes all Donna Reed. So, in being honest with myself and figuring out what to work on, I know that was the issue all along. No one pointed it out before, possibly because when I went in looking at it that way, it’s so damned obvious they probably figured I meant to do it that way.

I feel very fortunate to have happened upon a bighearted editor who liked my writing enough to help me fix this.

I know when you’ve gotten little love for your stuff, it’s very hard to think you’re good at this. But I think x-cin and my hubs kind of have the right idea, hybrided with Dee’s point: maybe you don’t write just what you love, but write because you love it.

Because writing makes you happy, and you feel odd and discombobulated if you don’t. If you want to sell, you can try to write something commercial, but in the end, no one really knws what magical star configuration makes a book deal. Not even the agents. Sometimes, not even the editors. So do it because you love it, and then don’t take the industry BS personally.

you guys.

Lily, woohoo!

*Goes back to lurking and revising.*

firedrake said:

This.
There are different types of book love from my point of view.
There's the books I love to read personally.
There are the books that give me an 'oh hell yeah' buzz when I'm editing.
There's that fizzy excitement love when I read a great new sub.

So, yeah, I do have to love a book. I am not going to be happy if I have to edit a book I hate. I'm grown up enough to put my all into editing a book even if the plot/characters/etc. do nothing for me. I know enough about the erotic romance genre, to know what works and what doesn't.

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doubling down on the 'this'

CP's agent this morning was tweeting a reminder to people not to write first person queries. Her reason? "I'm interested in YOU, not just this one manuscript." And a few weeks back, mine randomly got four submissions in one day that "blew her away". Did she end up offering on all four? No.

For all the us-vs-them that it can sometimes start feeling like, agents struggle as much as we do to pick projects. Sometimes they pick the wrong ones, sometimes they let one slip that they end up regretting. There's no equation or magic formula. Even if you do get feedback from one agent that says why it is or isn't marketable, they could easily be wrong. As we all know, readers get and take what they like from fiction.

TheCaleb said:

Isn't that the truth! BUT I think the YA horror writers are paving a new road for adult horror in the near future.

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I fucking hope so.

And Happy 15th Anniversary to Xiao!!!

Blondchen said:

I'm not sure I agree with this. I think publishing is significantly more unpredictable than a strategic game. There is no "If I do X and Y, I'll get Z" formula. It's more like craps than blackjack.

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I know. All I am trying to say is that if you want to go the agent route, there are stories you can write that will give you better odds. I'm not talking about writing to trends, because we know that usually doesn't work either.

eta: I should say the workshop organizer who taught me all this is someone the powers that be here at AW really hate, and his message doesn't resonate with everyone. In fact, last time I tried to explain why I thought his message was valuable, I got a really snarky response from someone about how if I had painted my toenails the day before I got an agent offer, I would have credited that, rather than the workshop.

Happy anniversary, x-cin!

TheCaleb said:

Blond I think if you ever get tired of all the wonderful ventures you participate in now you could always have a career in business advising.

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You wouldn't say that if you saw my "accounting" system. BWAHAHAHAHA

Happy anniversary, Xiao!!

*curls up in corner until coffee time*

Happy Anniversary, Xiao

Very interesting discussion.

I got nothing.

*scampers off to lurk with lwalker*

Blondchen said:

This is exactly what happened to me. Exactly. W'sE didn't sell. In the meanwhile I wrote a passion project (YA historical spy fiction) that my agent felt wouldn't sell in the current marketplace. We never took it out on sub.

Then I wrote P0SSESS.

It took almost three years for me to sell a book just from the time I signed with my agent.

THIS IS A LONG GAME. Instant gratification is rare. If that's what you're looking for, there are other routes available.

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You're giving me hope. One book that didn't sell and one book my agent doesn't think will sell in the current market. Here's to book three - which I'm supposed to have done by October and haven't even started.

Haupe said:

Love this conversation.

Don't forget people also get ghost-writing deals through subbing. They might not have an idea of their own - yet - that the publisher will pay to have executed, but they might have the perfect voice for an in-progress series, etc.

You just never know the offshoots of the sidebranches that will lead to a breakthrough. But this requires putting *something* out there that people can see and react to.
.

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This is me. I get my ghostwriting work through my agent.

Eight more pages done. And I like them so much better this way.

baby’s awake. Time to stop for now.

thanks puglets!

it has been the LONGEST FIFTEEN YEARS OF MY LIFE.

totally kidding.

hahahaha!

the first year dragged a bit.

then it really started to whirl by, *especially*
after i popped out the rabid monkeys.

/bootay shake!

tomorrow, i'll be spending all day at a music
festival chorus performance with sweet pea.
i shall have a book with me.

Awwwww.

So JL's law school is hosting a reception for the graduating class tomorrow afternoon. He didn't even realize he could bring guests until today, so he sends me an email from work asking if I'd like to accompany him. I mean, how cute is that?

Graduation is Sunday morning, and then I arranged a cocktail reception for him in a private room at a restaurant. I'm baking is favorite red velvet cupcakes and ordering wine and some light refreshment. I figure, he needs to celebrate this accomplishment, and he deserves having someone do something nice for him.

So what you're saying, Blond, is that your feminine allure did not, in fact, cause him to flunk out of law school?

CONGRATS to him! What a huge accomplishment.

so sweet, blondie.
congrats to jlaw! what
an accomplishment!

Yay for JL!

JoNightshade said:

So what you're saying, Blond, is that your feminine allure did not, in fact, cause him to flunk out of law school?

CONGRATS to him! What a huge accomplishment.

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I know, I know. I worried needlessly. His GPA wasn't as high as he would have liked, but it wasn't awful either. And he's been getting rave reviews from his supervisors at the law firm externship he's finishing up. Made him feel like maybe this IS the perfect career change for him.

Ok. Finally finished this revision of Peacemaker. (yes, I should have been doing real job work today. So sue me.) I know that I told some folks they could beta for me when this draft was done, but for the life of me I can't remember who all I told! So if I did, please rep me your email address before tonight.

(Hell, if I didn't tell you, and you think you might want to, rep me your email address tonight)

Congrats to JL for graduating and to Xiao and Mr. Xiao for their anniversary!

Lots of writing and personal milestones today!

I'm reading Bitterb1ue now, and I noticed that there's something about all of Cash0re's books where I LOVE them (Fire's a favorite and I've reread Grace1ing too), but I can see all the storytelling and characterization flaws. They are not perfect but I love them more than many other books I admire more. Hunger Games was like that too, although I admired and loved it less than Cash0re's.

Blondchen said:

I know, I know. I worried needlessly. His GPA wasn't as high as he would have liked, but it wasn't awful either. And he's been getting rave reviews from his supervisors at the law firm externship he's finishing up. Made him feel like maybe this IS the perfect career change for him.

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I'm sure there were some trade-offs for the slightly lowered GPA.