The W1S1 Check-in and Chill Lounge and Bar

Aggy B.

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I guess I don't worry about whether a publication is "selective" or not unless they're paying for my work.

And with paying markets I always start with 'pays the most' and work my way down to 'pays the least' even when there's pretty much no chance they'll take my story. (Like Clarkesworld, which publishes only 12 unsolicited stories a year.) The exception, in my list of "who do I sub to" is Tor.com. They're rates are high, but the response rate is miserably slow so they usually come toward the end of my submission run.

Ah. Reminds me, I have an erotica story that needs to be sent off before I run up against the deadline.

Aggy, still trying to compose an appropriate 50 word bio
 

AlwaysJuly

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I sent a Twitfic off to Seedpod without looking at how selective they are. But, I don't know, to me microfiction is just sort of a fun weird thing to post a link to from my blog. I wasn't thinking of it as a "real" fiction credit, kwim? Maybe that's been the wrong way to look at it.
 

AnnieColleen

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Entirely off-topic, but "Nanoism" in this context always makes me laugh. To me it does not mean what they think it means.

(But then I'm entirely off-topic for W1S1 at the moment, trying to decide if the beginning of Chapter 2 should resolve the Chapter 1 cliffhanger, or if a different scene should come in between.)
 

Aggy B.

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No, I'm sure I'm in the minority.

Shelley

It never hurts to consider these things. I just know that personally, I don't consider acceptances in non-paying venues the same way as I do a paying market. (Notice I say venue because with many of these publications that's all they are, a place to display work.) It has a purpose. And I don't send stuff out willy-nilly whether it's a piece of Twit-fic or a short, whether it's a paying market or a non-paying venue.

I do know that when someone says "I sold something" I get a bigger sense of happy than I do when someone is simply getting something published.

Ugh. I should stop talking now. I'm tired and confuzzling even myself.

Long story short: your advice is valuable because it made me think about how I strategize my subs. :)
 

Izz

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Well, on an entirely unrelated to writing topic: i'm supposed to be going to a movie in a park tonight (it's a thing our city does over summer--though we're now autumn, which is probably why this is the last one of the series). And it's raining.

Meh--i didn't like Inception the first time i saw it anyway.

#

Well, apparently the movie's been called off because of the rain. Oh well. Perhaps i shall have the evening to write instead.

(i've just learnt how to merge posts. How fun!)
 
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Izz

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Turns out the plan is now to watch movies inside. How utterly passé.
 

Izz

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Well, that's the second time i've seen Inception. Didn't like it this time around, either.




Hmm--i seem to be making twitter posts. Interesting.
 

Nathaniel Katz

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I get what you're saying, Shelley, and I generally agree, though I doubt any twitter fiction credit would be weighted all that heavily. For now, I'll focus on the paying markets and go onto others later. The dollar/dollar fifty's not a particularly important amount of money, it's just a pride thing.
 

soapdish

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I get what you're saying, Shelley, and I generally agree, though I doubt any twitter fiction credit would be weighted all that heavily. For now, I'll focus on the paying markets and go onto others later. The dollar/dollar fifty's not a particularly important amount of money, it's just a pride thing.
Mmm, I don't know that I agree with that, exactly. The credit might not be weighted as heavily (though, I'm not sure I agree with *that* either) but the connections you make with other writers/editors by working with their publication is sometimes better than the credit (or $$) for the sale.

I've learned recently that the writing biz is as much about who you know, as what you write. I have a really hard time accepting that (see my current user title :tongue) but it is what it is. Ever notice how many names you see repeatedly published in the same zine? Especially twitter zines? Well, I've noticed. And it sometimes feels like it's more about networking and staying connected with those in the field, than it is about that *one* story you sub.
Does anyone else think of it that way?
 

WildScribe

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Mmm, I don't know that I agree with that, exactly. The credit might not be weighted as heavily (though, I'm not sure I agree with *that* either) but the connections you make with other writers/editors by working with their publication is sometimes better than the credit (or $$) for the sale.

I've learned recently that the writing biz is as much about who you know, as what you write. I have a really hard time accepting that (see my current user title :tongue) but it is what it is. Ever notice how many names you see repeatedly published in the same zine? Especially twitter zines? Well, I've noticed. And it sometimes feels like it's more about networking and staying connected with those in the field, than it is about that *one* story you sub.
Does anyone else think of it that way?

Well, sure,but a twitter "zine"? As in, no startup costs, no profitability, no payment for authors and therefore no need to maintain any specific level of work? I'm not putting anyone in particular down here, I'm just not sure if the people who start twitter zines are exactly the kinds of connections you need to make to get a hand up in the rest of the publishing world. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here, but that's just my thoughts on the matter.
 

sisco

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Some twitter zines are connected with publishing houses as well so they can segue into other associations with said publisher. And I look at twitter-fic more as platform building than sales. In that light the best places to submit for twitter would actually be the ones with the biggest followings. I admit I didn't really pay much attention to where I was submitting it the few times I did twitter fic, I just pulled a few names off of Simon's list and sent them there.
 

AnnieColleen

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So I wrote a drabble (100 words). Tweaked it a little -- a couple of character details -- to fit a theme issue.

And it decided it wants to grow up to be a novel trilogy (or so).

I think that's some kind of personal record.
 

alexshvartsman

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I am in total agreement with Shelley on the whole TwitFic thing. Sending to a 100% acceptance market (or even a very high acceptance market) feels kind of like phoning it in.

I do not truly "get" Twitter fiction, and only ever wrote one - but then I decided to try and submit it to see what happens, and read various TwitFic publications for a few hours to determine where to send it. I settled on Nanoism based on the quality of published work (my second choice would have been Trapeze). I only later found out that they are tough for a Twitter market, and can be slow to respond, to boot. My TwitFic has been sitting there for a couple of weeks, and no word yet. I wonder how many submissions they get, that they fall behind in reading 140-character slush.
 

sisco

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Honestly I never knew seedpod's acceptance rate until after they had accepted my piece. I generally don't worry much on market research for something that takes so little time to write. Also I've noticed a lot of people tend to think pretty highly of trapeze but it is also a non-paying market. While there are places like PicFic that often get looked over. PicFic is a paying twitter fiction market and according to duotrope has a lower acceptance rate than trapeze.

I'm not sure I see a lot of difference between two markets that do not pay such as seedpod and trapeze. If the piece I had submitted to Seedpod had been speculative I probably would have submitted to trapeze, because most of my work is speculative and I'd rather make a name for myself amongst speculative fiction readers, but it wasn't so I sent it to the first appropriate market I found just to get a response on it. I wasn't concerned enough to spend more time researching markets on it than I did writing the thing.
 

shelleyo

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Let me clarify that the advice I offered was simply my own personal advice, because those are my personal opinions. I am not casting aspersions on anyone's publications, submissions or desire to submit whatever, wherever they want. For me personally, I start at the toughest market I have a desire to be in and work my way down, and I get much more satisfaction if the story is accepted more quickly before I get too far down the list. I get more satisfaction out of being in a journal that's more selective than I do one that takes close to everything. And I would never list a journal that takes close to everything in a cover letter, so that's something I consider when planning submissions. I give advice based on that. I realize that everyone's goals are not mine.

I approached the two Twitter submissions I made in the same way I do the others, but again, that's just me.

Soapdish, networking is important. The first writing job I ever had as a freelancer, a column for high-end hobbyist magazine, became mine simply because I was in the right place at the right time. The conversation went like this:

"Want to consider doing this?"
"But I don't know anything about the topic."
"You'll learn."
"But I've never written professionally before."
"You'll learn."
"Mmm, okay."

Best decision I ever made, and a huge opportunity that came from simply having a passing association with the person who had an opportunity open up. But then, most importantly, I didn't suck. Had I taken the opportunity and then sucked, all the networking in the world wouldn't have helped.

I would submit to a publication that took everything it was given, even if I read it and thought most of it was awful, if the editor of that magazine was someone I wanted to forge a connection with, absolutely. Seedpod is a publishing company, so someone who wants to forge that connection might have a great incentive to submit there first. And you can't always judge based on now, either, I'll admit. It's a micro-publisher, currently asking for donations to pay for ISBN numbers. It's not somewhere I would submit a novel. Yet, in five years, who knows where the owner/editor might be and how that connection could pay off.

It's wise to make friends where you can and never burn bridges, in writing or any business. In that context, everything is valuable.

I won't name names, but a prolific and well-published short story writer I know, one I've appeared alongside a time or two, submits anywhere. It can be a blogspot blog that just started that has truly dreadful stuff up. But if he can say, "Yay, I got a new publication," he sends them something. I've never understood it, and I could never do it. But it has served him well. I think he's been nominationed for the Pushcart four or five times, and has I don't how many hundreds of stories published, usually, though, for no pay and little recognition. But his goal is hearing the 'yes,' so he's wildly successful. He's been in some really good publications, too. And a lot of the reason for that, and I'm not criticizing his stories by saying this, is networking.

When I see him announcing another publication to a new blogspot blog or a website that just looks so awful and unprofessional that's filled with stories and poems that I think are truly dreadful, I shake my head and wonder why he didn't try somewhere else first. To each his own.

Shelley
 
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Izz

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On a side note: we have a new W1S1 entrant: Regan Leigh. She sneakily joined up in the Hug Me/Kick Me House :)

Yay! :snoopy:
 

shelleyo

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Welcome, Regan!

Shelley
 

Izz

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Oh, damn. There's a method to signing up? Did I already fail? What type of hazings do you have in this place? :scared:
Hazings? Damn, i knew i'd forgotten something ;)

Nah, no particular method. You might want to follow the official blog when you get a chance. That way the organizers can keep track of who's playing. And they have weekly check-in posts where you can give progress reports if you're so inclined.

Other than that, just hang out with us. :cool: Oh, and write and sub stuff.

Thanks for the welcome. :)
No problems. Thanks for joining. :PartySmil
 

soapdish

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So I wrote a drabble (100 words). Tweaked it a little -- a couple of character details -- to fit a theme issue.

And it decided it wants to grow up to be a novel trilogy (or so).

I think that's some kind of personal record.
WOW! That's awesome, Annie. Did you put your drabble on growth hormones? ;) (And if so, can my WIP have some?)

"Want to consider doing this?"
"But I don't know anything about the topic."
"You'll learn."
"But I've never written professionally before."
"You'll learn."
"Mmm, okay."
:roll: But seriously--what a great opportunity.

I won't name names, but a prolific and well-published short story writer I know, one I've appeared alongside a time or two, submits anywhere. It can be a blogspot blog that just started that has truly dreadful stuff up. But if he can say, "Yay, I got a new publication," he sends them something. I've never understood it, and I could never do it. But it has served him well. I think he's been nominationed for the Pushcart four or five times, and has I don't how many hundreds of stories published, usually, though, for no pay and little recognition.
Yeah, I know a few writers with similar MOs and I am in awe of them sometimes.
Oh, damn. There's a method to signing up? Did I already fail? What type of hazings do you have in this place? :scared:

Thanks for the welcome. :)
:hooray: Regan! Welcome!!
 

Nathaniel Katz

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For me personally, I start at the toughest market I have a desire to be in and work my way down, and I get much more satisfaction if the story is accepted more quickly before I get too far down the list. I get more satisfaction out of being in a journal that's more selective than I do one that takes close to everything.

For the most part I agree with you, though, for me, the real deciding factor is my respect for the market and/or desire to be a part of it, a factor that usually - but not always - goes along with selectivity. My first (and so far only) fiction publication is the Historical Lovecraft anthology. That was the first place that I sent the story (which is Lovecraftian in theme, but does not explicitly reference his creations). Could it have gone somewhere more selective? I've no idea, but Historical Lovecraft was an anthology that I decided I'd like to be a part of. Then again, most places that I (and, I imagine, others) read and respect are the ones that publish top quality fiction and are, as a result, difficult to get in.

And, on a totally unrelated topic: Hello, Regan!