Lethe Press

I do hope this thread isn't going to devolve into the usual nonsense that if you aren't with Random House you shouldn't expect perks like editing and accurate accounting. Usually followed by 'you people are mean'. We people just like the exact nature of press and what it will or will not deliver to be utterly clear.

So, is the statement that you do not provide copyediting correct? Because that does mean you either need to be a particularly impressive kind of writer, or pay for that service, right? This is the question that we were hoping to clear up.

Steve Berman said:

As for Beth's collection, she conveniently forgot to mention that what drove me to drop her book from the list was a very insulting and demeaning public post about Lethe she made in her livejournal account. Though she deleted it, it was clear that she was unhappy with the relationship as well as so difficult to work with it was clear that, no matter how much we tried to deal with minor mishaps, she would never be satisfied.

I told her agent that her book would be dropped by the end of the week. Not by the end of the weekend. Her bewilderment does not make any sense--if either her or her agent had expressed any interest in discussing the matter, they never sent any email of the kind. They ignored my statement and so the book was put OP.

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Be that as it may, is it true that there is no OOP clause in the contract? I'm not a lawyer, but I would have thought there'd need to be some kind of language there for you to drop the book, especially at such short notice. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

I'd also point out that that kind of behaviour, regardless of motivation, does not make people feel inclined to submit to you or support your press by buying from you. I obviously don't know what was in the offending post, but there must have been a more mature - and professional - way to deal with it than to just drop the book from the list.

the bunny hugger said:

So, is the statement that you do not provide copyediting correct? Because that does mean you either need to be a particularly impressive kind of writer, or pay for that service, right? This is the question that we were hoping to clear up.

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No, we do copyedit the ms. We also make sure that the author receives a proof to look over what we have done. And, if there are errors that both author and press miss, we instantly correct the POD files.

pangalactic said:

Be that as it may, is it true that there is no OOP clause in the contract? I'm not a lawyer, but I would have thought there'd need to be some kind of language there for you to drop the book, especially at such short notice. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

I'd also point out that that kind of behaviour, regardless of motivation, does not make people feel inclined to submit to you or support your press by buying from you. I obviously don't know what was in the offending post, but there must have been a more mature - and professional - way to deal with it than to just drop the book from the list.

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Her agent approved the contract.

And I would ask how you, if you were the publisher, facing obvious antagonism again and again, as well as besmirching your company's reputation would deal with it. It was clear that Beth was not happy with the relationship. This way she can take her property elsewhere.

Steve Berman said:

I thought I should log-on and set a few misunderstandings straight.

First off, Lethe does not force any author to pay a copy editor. We encourage authors to do the utmost possible to turn in a clean manuscript. Too often authors submit manuscripts that are full of typos, spelling errors and problems with the formatting.

Beth herself stated that we do not charge for copyediting.

On one occasion, when an author sent us a manuscript that was interesting but weak, we suggested she turn to a book doctor for assistance.

As for Beth's collection, she conveniently forgot to mention that what drove me to drop her book from the list was a very insulting and demeaning public post about Lethe she made in her livejournal account. Though she deleted it, it was clear that she was unhappy with the relationship as well as so difficult to work with it was clear that, no matter how much we tried to deal with minor mishaps, she would never be satisfied.

I told her agent that her book would be dropped by the end of the week. Not by the end of the weekend. Her bewilderment does not make any sense--if either her or her agent had expressed any interest in discussing the matter, they never sent any email of the kind. They ignored my statement and so the book was put OP.

Lethe has dealt with many, many authors. Our books have been nominated for awards (and won some!) and have been favorably reviewed by industry magazines. Yes, on occasion, there have been mishaps, but we are a small press of part-timers.

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One of many wise things I learned from my parents: two wrongs don't make a right.

And doing the very same thing you're criticising her for doesn't exactly cast you in the best of lights.

Steve Berman said:

Her agent approved the contract.

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This strikes me as an ignorant statement. That clause is there to protect you as well so there are no ambiguities as to why a title is being taken out of print. The usual reasons are for lack of sales, not because they said something about you. All contracts should contain OP language.

And I would ask how you, if you were the publisher, facing obvious antagonism again and again, as well as besmirching your company's reputation would deal with it. It was clear that Beth was not happy with the relationship. This way she can take her property elsewhere.

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Seriously? You dumped an author because she said something you didn't like? This is publishing, not the fifth grade. You pick up the phone and talk to the author, find a solution to the problem. A professional doesn't pick up his marbles and go home. Geez.

priceless1 said:

This strikes me as an ignorant statement. That clause is there to protect you as well so there are no ambiguities as to why a title is being taken out of print. The usual reasons are for lack of sales, not because they said something about you. All contracts should contain OP language.

Seriously? You dumped an author because she said something you didn't like? This is publishing, not the fifth grade. You pick up the phone and talk to the author, find a solution to the problem. A professional doesn't pick up his marbles and go home. Geez.

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I was trying to find a way to say this without being overly antagonistic, but I'm just going to go ahead and say it; This.

waynewrite said:

No, the press does not do copyediting.

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This being the source of my confusion. It seems that not everyone is on the same page, so to speak?

MR. Berman,

First, thank you for taking the time and making an effort to address the thread. Hopefully, this will allow us to gain a better understanding of how Lethe Press operates. The confusion about copyediting stems from another author with your company, who posted a portion of his/his contract which read:

All authors must secure the services of a copy editor before turning in final manuscripts for publication. Otherwise, such manuscripts will be deemed unacceptable. If an author does not know a skilled copy editor, Lethe Press can offer recommendations. The Author is responsible for paying the copy editors fees. If the Author cannot pay this at the time of submission, the fees will be deducted from his/her forthcoming royalties.

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The idea that Lethe doesn't do edits was supported by yet another Lethe author. I think it might be best if you, the publisher, clarified once and for all what that clause in your contract means and how it applies to your current authors.

As for the situation with Beth, I find it curious that you would--out of apparent vindictiveness--drop her contract because of a post she made on her blog? When one of my authors has a complaint, I endeavor to work with that author and rectify the situation between us. I don't run off and pull her title, because all that does is to make the situation worse. If, as the author indicated, she was questioning some delinquent paperwork and/or a payment schedule, wouldn't it make more sense to address that situation first? As a publisher, you are contractually obligated to your authors to make certain that these things--their tax forms, their royalty schedules and God knows their royalty payments--are where they need to be.

Blog posts don't consitute a reason to terminate a publishing relationship, and considering the very public posts you made in regards to her and to another author on your livejournal, I find it very ironic that this is the reason you cite for pulling her books on one of the premier watchdog sites on the internet.

Most of us have been very surprised at how this situation has unfolded, because Lethe has a well-earned reputation as a fine small publisher, especially in the LGBT world. And you might want to take a moment and look back over this thread. Until yesterday, Beth was the person here who spoke in your defense.

Just sayin'...

I hope you resolve this situation to everyone's satisfaction. But of more interest to this community as a whole is a clarification of the editing situation and your approach to it in your contract.

My experiences with Lethe Press and Steve Berman have been nothing but positive. As a writer, I have received payment in full (with a bit extra) for stories accepted in anthologies and as an editor of an anthology with Lethe ("Tented: Gay Erotic Tales from Under the Big Top"), Steve has been nothing but cooperative and supportive. I did not secure the services of a copyeditor. I edited the MS myself and submitted it to Steve who made some minor changes and sent it back to me for proofing and final approval. We did have, again some very minor, differences of opinion about a couple of the stories which we discussed until we reached an accord. Steve has been nothing but professional in any of our dealings or discussions.

Four new users who've signed up to say how great Lethe is for them in the past two days. Has the publisher been rallying the troops perchance?

My thoughts exactly.

I am a satisfied Lethe author and I do not need to be "rallied." I would, however, have to be paid a great deal of money to ever post in this forum again. I have never seen so many amateurish, ignorant, self-proclaimed "writers" in my life.

I support Steve Berman and his actions. I also support his decision not to take abuse from authors. I wouldn't take it either, and I'm not taking it now--I'm outta here.

I always find being insulted makes me totally change my mind about an issue. What a cunning strategy.

waynewrite said:

I am a satisfied Lethe author and I do not need to be "rallied." I would, however, have to be paid a great deal of money to ever post in this forum again. I have never seen so many amateurish, ignorant, self-proclaimed "writers" in my life.

I support Steve Berman and his actions. I also support his decision not to take abuse from authors. I wouldn't take it either, and I'm not taking it now--I'm outta here.

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Wow.

waynewrite said:

I support Steve Berman and his actions. I also support his decision not to take abuse from authors. I wouldn't take it either, and I'm not taking it now--I'm outta here.

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It's important to note that publishing is a tough business and requires a very thick skin. Yes, there are times when an editor and author clash. But a professional does not dump an author's book out of retaliation simply because he doesn't like what they said. They work through the problem in an adult manner.

Threatening authors with OP sends a very powerful message that Lethe authors better toe the line or they'll be dumped as well. Seems pretty Draconian and immature to me. If anyone is being abusive here, it's the publisher. The complaints being lodged at this publisher aren't insignificant.

Agreed. Particularly when the root issue of the problem between the writer and the publisher are missing or delayed royalty schedules, tax forms and royalty payments. If an author questions those missing items, that's not 'abuse' on her part. That's sound business sense. And when the publisher in response determines that those reasonable questions about something the house is contractually obligated to provide and has not constitute abuse and sends her book out of print as a result, that's even more concerning. To an outside observer, that's a huge red flag.

It would be nice if instead of drive-by posters talking about their great experiences with this publisher or the publisher showing up to abuse the author, the actual situation was addressed in a mature and professional manner.

priceless1 said:

The complaints being lodged at this publisher aren't insignificant.

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This.

mscelina said:

It would be nice if instead of drive-by posters talking about their great experiences with this publisher or the publisher showing up to abuse the author, the actual situation was addressed in a mature and professional manner.

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And this.

Rallied troops or not, new AW member authors of this press need to remember that how they conduct themselves in this thread directly reflects on the image of their publisher.

I would strongly recommend you take a few minutes to review the profiles of members who have posted in this thread before posting comments.

~brianm~

I have many colleagues who've worked with Lethe Press, and I can no longer say that none of them have anything bad to say about Lethe or Steve.

It's not a question of anyone else having something 'bad' to say. Several Lethe authors have come forward in this thread questioning the editing policy. And another Lethe author has come forward with the information that her book was sent out of print because the publisher didn't like something she said. On her blog. I'm sure many authors have had positive experiences with Lethe Press. As I said before--Lethe had a solid reputation up to this point, especially in the LGBT community.

However, all those good experiences do not address the questions raised in this thread. And it would be infinitely better for the publisher, if he wants to post in this thread, to direct his energies toward addressing the questions B&BC has instead of encouraging his happy writers to do drive-by postings and then using his posts to vilify the character of an unhappy writer without providing any substantial response to the very real concerns that not one but multiple authors have expressed.

It is not a case where every happy author 'cancels out' an unhappy one. If even unhappy one has a genuine greivance, then the press has a genuine flaw, and that is a valid piece of information for this forum. It is great that Lethe has satisfied authors but that doesn't tell us whether a) only some authors are not getting paid correctly and on time and getting accurate tax material (perhaps it was an isolated glitch), or b) only some authors notice/care about this kind of problem. Or of course the Press might challenge that such a problem exists at all or agree that it occurred and explain how they fixed that problem so that it will not happen again.

Or we could just pretend publishing is a popularity contest rather than a business.

Good experiences DO address the questions raised in this thread in that they show them to be isolated incidents. Also, given the implication that the only people speaking up in support of Lethe are newbies to this forum, as a longtime member I thought I would speak up.

We don't know what other people consider good. So, IMHO, they address the questions raised only if they... address the questions raised.

Such as: I have always received my royalties and tax paperwork in full and on time. Or even: sometimes it was a bit late but I always got it in the end. Otherwise, we just don't know.

Then we would know it was perhaps a one-off rather than systemic issue. Which would be informative.

In other threads we have found authors we very happy with treatment others probably wouldn;t be happy with. IMHO again, it is the treatment that matters, not the emotion.

the bunny hugger said:

It is not a case where every happy author 'cancels out' an unhappy one. If even unhappy one has a genuine greivance, then the press has a genuine flaw, and that is a valid piece of information for this forum. It is great that Lethe has satisfied authors but that doesn't tell us whether a) only some authors are not getting paid correctly and on time and getting accurate tax material (perhaps it was an isolated glitch), or b) only some authors notice/care about this kind of problem. Or of course the Press might challenge that such a problem exists at all or agree that it occurred and explain how they fixed that problem so that it will not happen again.

Or we could just pretend publishing is a popularity contest rather than a business.

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This. The hoopla started with Lethe's royalty payment and tax reporting problems. And I've noticed that despite the cheerleading, no one's addressed these specific issues yet. I don't care how "nice" a publisher is -- if it can't handle the business side properly, then I'm avoiding it.

I've written for a publisher who was very nice, but paid late (and later, and later...). Now they're on the verge of bankruptcy and owe other authors thousands of dollars. Gee, should I have encouraged others to write for them because they're so darn nice? Even after they've breached their contract?