The Walking Dead - AMC

Cyia said:

I'm sticking with the physical position the actor was in at the end of the episode. Given it was Carl's shadow on Negan's chest, then the person killed has to be someone on either side of Carl, depending on which direction the lights were shining in relation to his body. That means Aaron or Eugene, unless the presence of the shadow was accidental. That hat is pretty iconic, though.

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I think it will be one of the more minor characters, too - Abraham, Eugene, Rosita, or Aaron - which will make this not only the worst cliffhanger in television history, but also one of the more hack punts as well.

I voted for Eugene right from the moment the episode ended, and I still vote Eugene.

As for the Maggie illness. Yes, she's pregnant, but pregnant women can actually suffer from other illnesses than those that are pregnancy related. Now, I don't remember blood. Can someone confirm for sure? With her symptoms, it could be an intestinal blockage or appendicitis, or some other gut-related infection that has nothing to do with her pregnancy but which obviously still puts the pregnancy at risk. Any illness would, especially if it comes with a high fever. I had thought it was a miscarriage at first, but the fever made me think it couldn't be. So maybe it isn't.

Cyia said:

But having him kill Maggie would mean fundamentally changing the comic book character. Negan doesn't kill women or children. Even though some of the specifics change on the show, most of the core elements are still there.

I'm sticking with the physical position the actor was in at the end of the episode. Given it was Carl's shadow on Negan's chest, then the person killed has to be someone on either side of Carl, depending on which direction the lights were shining in relation to his body. That means Aaron or Eugene, unless the presence of the shadow was accidental. That hat is pretty iconic, though.

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Hm. I didn't know that about Negan. Now I don't know what to think. *throws hands in the air*

Perks said:

I think it will be one of the more minor characters, too - Abraham, Eugene, Rosita, or Aaron - which will make this not only the worst cliffhanger in television history, but also one of the more hack punts as well.

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Meanwhile, in a total twist, Negan pops an aneurysm at the exact moment he was going to kill one of the cast and ends up beaning himself with Lucille. Best. Cliffee. Ever.

Cyia said:

Meanwhile, in a total twist, Negan pops an aneurysm at the exact moment he was going to kill one of the cast and ends up beaning himself with Lucille. Best. Cliffee. Ever.

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You know what? You should be a writer or something.

Can he have an aneurysm AND a seizure of some sort that has him whack Rick? I'd be oh-so-grateful.

I've had 3 miscarriages in my life so I know what it feels like. I'd say menstrual cramps is the closest comparison. Now in Maggie's case, I don't know exactly what they're cooking up that's wrong with her. But if she has a fever--isn't that what characters get when they've been bitten by a walker? So maybe her baby did die and turned into a zombie and this is giving Maggie the fever since they're connected.

Or...maybe she's just got the flu?

Wasn't she eating loads of pickles? Maybe it's just terrible wind.

They won't necessarily keep every Neganism from the comics, so even if he's a total gentlemanly woman-lover in that, doesn't mean he will be in the show. I hate how this cliffhanger has made me want people I totally love like Michonne and Maggie to die. (Anyone that isn't Daryl.)

Perks said:

Lol! Dammit. I spit coffee. Yes, I would also love to see him do Daryl. Wait. That sounds wrong, too.

My favorites were - Matthew McConaughey, Michael Caine, Ewan McGregor, and Harrison Ford losing a sneeze.

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Hee. His Brad Pitt totally blew my mind. But they're all amazing.

Cyia said:

Meanwhile, in a total twist, Negan pops an aneurysm at the exact moment he was going to kill one of the cast and ends up beaning himself with Lucille. Best. Cliffee. Ever.

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I support this.

Perks said:

And I love how they just assign random symptoms to miscarriage. Screaming pain and wringing fever are not usually associated with miscarriage. In this case, her symptoms should only point to the baby having died in utero and the poor thing is hideously zombie-ing its way out. Sadly, I don't think they'll go that route.

As it happens, I have had a miscarriage at approximately the same stage Maggie was supposed to be in. (I was also a midwifery student for a time.)

The pain of miscarriage can vary, but it usually centers on moderate to severe cramping (the fetus and placenta and all that hormonal goop are small and dilute enough that the mechanisms of giant labor contractions wouldn't likely be activated.) The oft-portrayed-in-film-and-fiction instant, searing, fall to the knees, screaming pain wouldn't even be consistent with regular labor, much less an early miscarriage. That sort of pain could be indicative of an ectopic pregnancy (where the fetus implants outside the uterus) but they've already shown us that Maggie's baby was at least in the right place with that implausible, post-apocalyptic sonogram.

The fever makes no sense at all unless she's ill with something else that is inducing the miscarriage as well - which wouldn't produce that sort of acute pain. Even so, that's not the everything's-fine-wait-everything's-not-fine scenario they used to ignite this subplot in the scene with Enid and Maggie in the kitchen.

No, they're doing the goofy thing that a lot of fiction does - because apparently pregnancy is so mysterious that they think they can get away with just showing a woman grab her belly, then tack on any cascade of bizarre, showy symptoms to indicate that "something is wrong with the baby" when in real life, it never happens like that.

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Completely agree. I have had a miscarriage as well and I was thinking that's not how it works!! Took me out of the story.

I think the death has to be Abraham or Eugene, I guess Glen wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility either.

I have a theory about Maggie's illness...
Enid poisoned her.
First, I know she's probably good (even though I don't completely trust her) and probably taking over Sophia's role in the comics, so I don't totally believe this but see it as a possibility because of one suspicious thing I don't think the show explained. And I haven't seen anyone else mention it as a theory on any site I go to (I didn't read this whole thread, so apologies if I'm echoing someone else)
How exactly did the Saviors know Rick and Co. were headed to Hilltop and have time to coordinate all those roadblocks? They had to know in advance, and maybe they were watching Alexandria the whole time, but maybe they had this meeting with Negan planned for weeks, and had Enid poison the pickles to get them to need Hilltop's doctor.

As for who got the bat? My guess is whoever's POV we had been seeing in the dark all episode long.

JenniferLee said:

I have a theory about Maggie's illness...
Enid poisoned her.
First, I know she's probably good (even though I don't completely trust her) and probably taking over Sophia's role in the comics, so I don't totally believe this but see it as a possibility because of one suspicious thing I don't think the show explained. And I haven't seen anyone else mention it as a theory on any site I go to (I didn't read this whole thread, so apologies if I'm echoing someone else)
How exactly did the Saviors know Rick and Co. were headed to Hilltop and have time to coordinate all those roadblocks? They had to know in advance, and maybe they were watching Alexandria the whole time, but maybe they had this meeting with Negan planned for weeks, and had Enid poison the pickles to get them to need Hilltop's doctor.

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Interesting theory. My husband asked the same question--how did the Saviors know Rick and company would head off to Hilltop? Because really, they would not have if Maggie hadn't needed a doctor. And my husband was also saying that it would take quite a bit of time to set up all those roadblocks. I think it's a real possibility that Enid poisoned the pickles.

JenniferLee said:

I have a theory about Maggie's illness...
Enid poisoned her.
...maybe they had this meeting with Negan planned for weeks, and had Enid poison the pickles to get them to need Hilltop's doctor.

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rhymegirl said:

I think it's a real possibility that Enid poisoned the pickles.

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I hope you guys are right because it's the only way I'll forgive Carl for locking her in the closet.

I saw a meme with Shane in one frame and Negan in the other. Shane was saying, "Don't you wish I was there when this A-hole showed up?" Much as I disliked Shane, I have to say yes. Too bad Rick couldn't keep Shane around, like in reserve, and when in trouble, release him. Instead of 'Release the Kraken', it could be 'Release the Shane'.

*** SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS ***

Just leaked: The outline for Season Seven:

Season 7 Episode 1: Follows Morgan and Carol with the folks who rescued them. Morgan reveals that he learned to ride a horse when he was with the Clyde Beatty Circus, and that he knows how to fit a dozen clowns into a tiny automobile.

Episode 2: We see Gabriel back in Alexandria and how folks are doing there. They're doing pretty well. When folks ask if he thinks that Rick is okay, he reassures them that Rick can handle anything.

Episode 3: A flashback to what Gabriel was doing back before he met up with Rick and the gang. The answer is: Not much.

Episode 4: Carol recovers her strength and shares her casserole recipe

Episode 5: Carol and Morgan discover that they have a lot in common and discuss poetry.

Episode 6: Gabriel sends a scouting party east, and discovers an intact Wal-Mart! No more supply problems!

Episode 7: Retells the story of Season Six Episode 16, this time from the point of view of Dwight, and all the trouble it takes to build gigantic walls of flaming logs.

Episode 8: Mid-season cliffhanger! Will Carol find the last jar of canned pineapple she needs to make Upside Down Cake?

We're promised that in the exciting second half of the season we'll find out who Negan killed!

After the hiatus....

Episode 9: We're in a flashback scene, with Daryl, when he was working in a motorcycle repair shop before the Walker Apocalypse. It fades back to the present day, and we're back in Dwight's point of view, as Negan beats someone to death, just off-screen.

Episode 10: It's a lovely day, and Glen and Maggie are playing with their child, now a toddler. Rick and Abraham and everyone are all there, all clean, well-dressed, well fed, and fit. Eugene has become a stand-up comic. As the episode ends, we discover that this flashforward was just a fantasy in Maggie's feverish mind as she watches Negan pace back and forth, counting eenie meanie minie mo....

Episode 11: The cliffhanger is resolved: Carol did find the canned pineapple! Everyone at the place Morgan and Carol are living really enjoy Carol's Upside Down Cake!

Episode 12: Enid breaks out of the closet, climbs the wall, and heads out into the woods. She comes face-to-face with a horde of showrunners. She hides in an abandoned refrigerator.

Episode 13: A flashback to the night in Alexandria when Rick and the gang put on the Alexandria Light Opera Company's production of West Side Story. Sasha plays Maria, while Jessie plays Anita. Rick is typecast as Officer Krupke. Everyone agrees that Spencer was a brilliant Tony and Gabriel showed unexpected singing and dancing talent as Riff. The walkers attack in the middle of the rumble between the Sharks and the Jets, but our heroes are able to defeat the shambling dead without missing a beat.

Episode 14: Carol and Morgan find a unexpected trove of crossword puzzle books and bring them back to their new friends. The episode ends in confusion when they discover that no one has any pencils: they decide to go in search of some.

Episode 15 The first half of the season climax two-parter! We stay in Negan's POV as he waits in his trailer to make his big entrance. We watch him learning and rehearsing his lines. He freshens up Lucille's barbed wire. As the episode ends, we're back in the firelight with Rick and the gang kneeling before the strutting Negan.

Episode 16: Looking through a crack around the door of her refrigerator, Enid sees a wall of flaming logs. She heads out to investigate. Meanwhile, Morgan and an entire clown-car full of armored fighters are driving around the countryside. Morgan sees the light of a burning wall of logs, and heads that way to investigate. Gabriel has decided that Alexandria needs a prayer meeting, but needs some torches to continue after dark. A burning wall of logs seems to be the perfect place to get those torches. Carol and Morgan arrive, thinking that if they can't find pencils then burned bits of logs will serve to do crossword puzzles.

We end in Negan's point of view as he brings Lucille down on the head of a kneeling person just off camera. The shot cuts to black, and the final credits roll.

The showrunners congratulate themselves on making the audience wait an entire year to find out who got killed, and discuss how this will increase the audience when Season Eight starts the following October.

James D. Macdonald said:

*** SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS ***

Just leaked: The outline for Season Seven:

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I see you've put a lot of thought into this. I simultaneously see this line of story as utterly preposterous and completely possible, considering past seasons. You got a couple of chuckles out of me. Very nicely done!

I'll admit it Episode 12 made me giggle.

So I think I'm going to stop watching.

I don't mean that in an angry, tantrum-y way. It's just that I've totally lost faith in the showrunners and this show has stopped being fun for me.

Sigh. I really liked this show, too.

If they have the balls to kill Daryl or Rick, I might come back. But that's pretty much it.

Viridian said:

So I think I'm going to stop watching.

I don't mean that in an angry, tantrum-y way. It's just that I've totally lost faith in the showrunners and this show has stopped being fun for me.

Sigh. I really liked this show, too.

If they have the balls to kill Daryl or Rick, I might come back. But that's pretty much it.

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That's the saddest part. I want to love this show. I love this comic. I keep watching, only to feel miserable about it every week - and then to question my love of the comic. At that point, it's not really fun anymore. It's not a tantrum to admit you've lost your passion for it and you have serious doubt about the direction/efforts of the people writing and directing the show. It doesn't have to make me happy. It just has to be good.

I don't mean that in an angry, tantrum-y way. It's just that I've totally lost faith in the showrunners and this show has stopped being fun for me.

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There's a lesson here for writers of all kinds: Once your readers lose faith in you as a guide, they lose faith catastrophically. They are more than likely to abandon you, and all your future efforts.

Personally, I've been having a hard time staying connected to this show since the second half of season four. But I stuck with it because there were moments of hope, especially when Morgan came back (and they totally let me down with that).

This season...I stopped watching the first half after the Glenn incident, and frankly I was very bored. They had characters who know better doing things they would never do (IMHO). I had a little hope for the second half of the season but I was left incredibly disappointed. Now, I have absolutely no desire to watch season 7. At all. I've lost complete faith in the writers. I don't even care who dies by Lucille. I just do not care at this point.

This makes me very sad.

I cannot remember a time I was this excited for a season opener! Well, yes, I can. It was for GoT. But I have not been this excited other than that.

Ummm....OMG.

Spoilers...my thoughts as I watched this episode, in order:

1.I was right with my first guess of Abraham. This guess was based on the preview when Negan called the person he killed Rick's "Right-hand man." Negan doesn't know them, so he'd think Abraham - the biggest dude - was the right-hand man.

2. FUCK! Rick! Dammit!

3. my second guess was right. I knew the person he killed had to be someone we all loved. Glenn.

4. Is that Carol hanging from the bridge?

5. He's hitting everyone?!?!

6. He cannot fucking ask Rick to do that!

7. Oh, Carl....oh you sweet boy.

8. Rick is broken.

9. Please don't take Daryl away. Oh, fuck, please don't hurt him or his spirit!

10. Oh Maggie...I'm so sorry.

11. Oh...how are they going to keep going? How can they possibly keep going???

And throughout the whole thing...tears. I cried like I haven't in a long time. And certainly not over a TV show. They built this up with such intensity, and Negan is so incredibly terrifying. Genuinely terrifying. I am so devastated to see them in this horrible, new world. I am...this is going to be a tough season to watch.

Okay...I am officially a huge nerd. But this has affected me more than I thought it would.

It's too bad my thought is that the season is going to slide downhill after a strong opener.

I am still nauseous. Seriously. Nauseous. I couldn't wait to see the episode, and now that I have I'm numb and in shock and actually afraid I might have nightmares. I don't usually get affected like this by shows, but this one was way past my Holy Sick meter. Having not read the comics, I had NO idea what was coming and...yeah. I cried. I'm a woos. I'm devastated. But I'm also interested to see the direction the show goes Pre-Negan/Post Negan.


SPOILER DON'T READ IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE EPISODE YET!

Alpha...yes to everything you said, though I had NO idea who was going. But Glenn was my favorite character and I remember crying when I thought we had lost him the first time by the garbage dumpster. And I cried big time. The acting in this episode was incredible.