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Thread: Three dimensional political compass

  1. #1
    "What's-it on the wall." Michael J. Hoag's Avatar
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    Three dimensional political compass

    Here's the three-dimensional political compass Don asked for:

    http://www.politicalcompass.org/

    The quiz takes just a few minutes. Awe jeez. A cute little quiz at AW. This place is just like facebook.



    Me, I'm way, way, waaaaaaay down in the lower left. Sigh.

    The analysis page includes historical figures (based on academic analysis: )

    http://www.politicalcompass.org/analysis2
    Last edited by Michael J. Hoag; 07-03-2010 at 11:08 PM.

  2. #2
    Prodigiously Hanged
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    It's as faulty as any other visual representation of political beliefs. By the way, that's only two orthogonal axes.

  3. #3
    "What's-it on the wall." Michael J. Hoag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPMiller View Post
    It's as faulty as any other visual representation of political beliefs. By the way, that's only two orthogonal axes.
    Bwaa haaa haaaa.

    Two-dimensional. A beautiful tribute to my dopeyness captured forever in the title of this thread.

    I love it.

  4. #4
    ~~~~*~~~~ backslashbaby's Avatar
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    It has me about as 'right' as Dennis Kucinich up there, but more 'Libertarian'. Or, more conservative by a bit but close to Mandela.

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  5. #5
    Is me. Monkey's Avatar
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    The quiz placed me smack-dab in the middle of the green square. Apparently, I'm very slightly more liberal and somewhat more libertarian than Ralf Nader.

    Interesting, considering where the other two "rate yourself politically" threads put me (I'm near the top of the Liberal/Conservative thread and near the bottom of the Individualist/Statist one).

  6. #6
    practical experience, FTW Shadow Dragon's Avatar
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    For me:
    Economic Left/Right: -1.50
    Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.26
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  7. #7
    I usually end up somewhere near The Dalai Lama.
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  8. #8
    They've been very bad, Mr Flibble Mr Flibble's Avatar
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    Don't know how you got all those other dudes on your picture, but apparently I'm more libertarian than Ghandi, and almost as left too.

    WTF? I don't even know what that means! Can someone explain what libertarian actually is?




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  9. #9
    Watching for the New Year! Synonym's Avatar
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    I'm about half-way between Gandhi and Freidman. Now that's quite an accomplishment. LOL
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  10. #10
    All Living is Local Don's Avatar
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    libertarian: grade school edition

    1) tell the truth
    2) keep your promises
    3) don't take other people's stuff
    4) don't boss other people around
    5) share your toys
    I wrote a blog.
    Economics puts parameters on people’s utopias. ~Peter Boettke
    The 'social contract' is to the politician what 'original sin' is to the priest. ~Don
    The vision of the helpful and protective state is the most pervasive and counter-productive ideology in the world today. ~Don

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    If they'd get it right, we wouldn't need Don pointing out that they'd gotten it wrong.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don View Post
    libertarian: grade school edition

    1) tell the truth
    2) keep your promises
    3) don't take other people's stuff
    4) don't boss other people around
    5) share your toys
    Man, if there were ever a clearer argument for why libertarianism could never work in the real world...

  12. #12
    All Living is Local Don's Avatar
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    Economic Left/Right: 1.00
    Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.95

    My left-right would be higher, except the test's authors assume that corporations are a fact of nature, rather than a legal construct created by the government that supposedly controls them.
    Last edited by Don; 07-04-2010 at 12:45 AM.
    I wrote a blog.
    Economics puts parameters on people’s utopias. ~Peter Boettke
    The 'social contract' is to the politician what 'original sin' is to the priest. ~Don
    The vision of the helpful and protective state is the most pervasive and counter-productive ideology in the world today. ~Don

    I tend to blame the Feds for Don, actually.
    If they'd get it right, we wouldn't need Don pointing out that they'd gotten it wrong.
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  13. #13
    All Living is Local Don's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPMiller View Post
    Man, if there were ever a clearer argument for why libertarianism could never work in the real world...
    Srsly? Because that's still pretty much the rules I live by, and I'm getting by just fine. Then again, I do whatever I can to primarily associate with people who play by the same rules.
    I wrote a blog.
    Economics puts parameters on people’s utopias. ~Peter Boettke
    The 'social contract' is to the politician what 'original sin' is to the priest. ~Don
    The vision of the helpful and protective state is the most pervasive and counter-productive ideology in the world today. ~Don

    I tend to blame the Feds for Don, actually.
    If they'd get it right, we wouldn't need Don pointing out that they'd gotten it wrong.
    ~ Medievalist

  14. #14
    Mostly annoying Hallen's Avatar
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    That "test" is so horribly and intentionally rigged that the resulting graph is completely unusable. Many of the questions cannot be answered with a simple agree or disagree. Many of the questions propose ridiculous situations.

    The graph has me ending up to the left of John Kerry. I can assure you, there are very few points of agreement between me and John Kerry. From a role of government and economic standpoint, there is almost a 100% disagreement there.

    Hitler was most certainly a socialist and should be nearly the same place as Stalin shows up yet he appears on this graph as being slightly right of center.

    Anybody who looks at this thing as anything more than a joke is fooling themselves.

    Libertarian does not = anarchist. A better description would be order via personal responsibility. If fascist represents totalitarian government that controls all aspects of your life, then Joe Biden, John Kerry and the lot should be much higher on the graph than George Bush. This "test" is just a manipulation to make people think those who are extreme in current politics are actually more centrist than they really are.
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  15. #15
    Still Here! Alan Yee's Avatar
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    Economic Left/Right: -3.88
    Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.56

    In other words, I'm slightly right of the center of the green square.

  16. #16
    ~~~~*~~~~ backslashbaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hallen View Post
    That "test" is so horribly and intentionally rigged that the resulting graph is completely unusable. Many of the questions cannot be answered with a simple agree or disagree. Many of the questions propose ridiculous situations.

    The graph has me ending up to the left of John Kerry. I can assure you, there are very few points of agreement between me and John Kerry. From a role of government and economic standpoint, there is almost a 100% disagreement there.

    Hitler was most certainly a socialist and should be nearly the same place as Stalin shows up yet he appears on this graph as being slightly right of center.

    Anybody who looks at this thing as anything more than a joke is fooling themselves.

    Libertarian does not = anarchist. A better description would be order via personal responsibility. If fascist represents totalitarian government that controls all aspects of your life, then Joe Biden, John Kerry and the lot should be much higher on the graph than George Bush. This "test" is just a manipulation to make people think those who are extreme in current politics are actually more centrist than they really are.
    I think the axes are confusing you becuse they aren't exactly what we usully call right vs left in US politics. For instance: Hitler was most certainly a socialist and should be nearly the same place as Stalin shows up yet he appears on this graph as being slightly right of center.

    Right of center speaks to Hitler's economics, which were more laissez-faire than you must be thinking. Etc.

    I know; it's confusing because it's quite different!

    As far as Bush being less authoritarian than Biden, etc? You'd have to cite me somethin'

    ETA:

    The chart also makes clear that, despite popular perceptions, the opposite of fascism is not communism but anarchism (ie liberal socialism), and that the opposite of communism ( i.e. an entirely state-planned economy) is neo-liberalism (i.e. extreme deregulated economy)
    In our home page we demolished the myth that authoritarianism is necessarily "right wing", with the examples of Robert Mugabe, Pol Pot and Stalin. Similarly Hitler, on an economic scale, was not an extreme right-winger. His economic policies were broadly Keynesian, and to the left of some of today's Labour parties. If you could get Hitler and Stalin to sit down together and avoid economics, the two diehard authoritarians would find plenty of common ground.
    http://www.politicalcompass.org/analysis2
    Last edited by backslashbaby; 07-04-2010 at 12:57 AM.
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  17. #17
    Mostly annoying Hallen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPMiller View Post
    Man, if there were ever a clearer argument for why libertarianism could never work in the real world...
    No, it shows why it is hard. It relies on the individual. It has an understanding however, that those who do not conform to acceptable norms are either punished or removed, usually by their own mistakes. It also does not mean a total lack of some form of government. We must acknowledge that we are simply not that evolved yet.

    IRU, it means you don't want people controlling your life and you don't want to control other people's lives. You believe in personal responsibility and a limited role for government. It also suggest that you believe in a free market economy and that people are inherently honest within specific constraints rather than inherently dishonest. Which is of course, in contrast to being on the left side of the scale which suggests that you believe more in socialism, where the government controls business and the economy to its own ends, supposedly with the idea that all people will be treated 'fairly'. Those two concepts, libertarianism and socialism are inherently at odds with each other.
    Last edited by Hallen; 07-04-2010 at 12:54 AM.
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  18. #18
    All Living is Local Don's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hallen View Post
    No, it shows why it is hard. It relies on the individual. It has an understanding however, that those who do not conform to acceptable norms are either punished or removed, usually by their own mistakes. It also does not mean a total lack of some form of government. We must acknowledge that we are simply not that evolved yet.

    IRU, it means you don't want people controlling your life and you don't want to control other people's lives. You believe in personal responsibility and a limited role for government. It also suggest that you believe in a free market economy and that people are inherently honest within specific constraints rather than inherently dishonest.
    [rant]
    You realize that's all heresy around these parts, don't ya, stranger? Because while The Enlightenment happened for those of us who are smart enough to hang out here, everyone knows the rest of society is composed of pickpockets and thieves, gangstas and crooks, out to rob us blind and leave us dying by the side of the road. Except for politicians and bureaucrats, who are angels sent from heaven to guide those lesser beings on the path to righteousness.

    We know all that, because we learned it in government financed, government controlled schools, from textbooks written on government grants, from teachers paid by the government. And amazingly unbiased.

    So take your "people are capable of acting like grownups" routine somewhere it would be appreciated, like fantasy land.
    [/rant]
    Oh, and if you're still reading? There actually are a few of us here who don't think like that. We salute you for a wise and reasoned post.




    I just had to try that role on, since it's so popular.
    I wrote a blog.
    Economics puts parameters on people’s utopias. ~Peter Boettke
    The 'social contract' is to the politician what 'original sin' is to the priest. ~Don
    The vision of the helpful and protective state is the most pervasive and counter-productive ideology in the world today. ~Don

    I tend to blame the Feds for Don, actually.
    If they'd get it right, we wouldn't need Don pointing out that they'd gotten it wrong.
    ~ Medievalist

  19. #19
    Mostly annoying Hallen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by backslashbaby View Post
    I think the axes are confusing you becuse they aren't exactly what we usully call right vs left in US politics. For instance: Hitler was most certainly a socialist and should be nearly the same place as Stalin shows up yet he appears on this graph as being slightly right of center.

    Right of center speaks to Hitler's economics, which were more laissez-faire than you must be thinking. Etc.

    I know; it's confusing because it's quite different!

    As far as Bush being less authoritarian than Biden, etc? You'd have to cite me somethin'
    I understand the graph. Yet Hitler's party was the National Socialist party. He may have been more free-market oriented than Stalin, but he was still most emphatically a socialist. He should be on the far left of the scale.

    Which is one of the reasons this graph doesn't work. Hitler was a dictator which can be viewed as the ultimate form of Authoritarian. On the other hand, a complete communist style government is also 100% authoritarian since there is no balancing of the powers of government. Anyway, the whole thing is pretty flawed and should be taken with a grain of salt the size of Montana.

    It depends on how you define authoritarian, but in political terms and by using Libertarian as the opposite scale, it indicates a strong central government that controls most things rather than relying on personal responsibility. The simple support of Biden for the US's attempt at 'universal health care' is evidence that Biden supports a strong, controlling central government which is the antithesis of libertarianism.
    Last edited by Hallen; 07-04-2010 at 01:05 AM.
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  20. #20
    All Living is Local Don's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hallen View Post
    I understand the graph. Yet Hitler's party was the National Socialist party. He may have been more free-market oriented than Stalin, but he was still most emphatically a socialist. He should be on the far left of the scale.

    Which is one of the reasons this graph doesn't work. Hitler was a dictator which can be viewed as the ultimate form of Authoritarian. On the other hand, a complete communist style government is also 100% authoritarian since there is no balancing of the powers of government. Anyway, the whole thing is pretty flawed and should be taken with a grain of salt the size of Montana.

    It depends on how you define authoritarian, but in political terms and by using Libertarian as the opposite scale, it indicates a strong central government that controls most things rather than relying on personal responsibility. The simple support of Biden for the US's attempt at 'universal health care' is evidence that Biden supports a strong, controlling central government which is the antithesis of libertarianism.
    No rant this time. A simple "well said" will have to do.
    I wrote a blog.
    Economics puts parameters on people’s utopias. ~Peter Boettke
    The 'social contract' is to the politician what 'original sin' is to the priest. ~Don
    The vision of the helpful and protective state is the most pervasive and counter-productive ideology in the world today. ~Don

    I tend to blame the Feds for Don, actually.
    If they'd get it right, we wouldn't need Don pointing out that they'd gotten it wrong.
    ~ Medievalist

  21. #21
    ~~~~*~~~~ backslashbaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hallen View Post
    I understand the graph. Yet Hitler's party was the National Socialist party. He may have been more free-market oriented than Stalin, but he was still most emphatically a socialist. He should be on the far left of the scale.

    It depends on how you define authoritarian, but in political terms and by using Libertarian as the opposite scale, it indicates a strong central government that controls most things rather than relying on personal responsibility. The simple support of Biden for the US's attempt at 'universal health care' is evidence that Biden supports a strong, controlling central government which is the antithesis of libertarianism.
    I do find the graph off, too, fwiw. I turned out more leftist than I expected compared to most of their democratic examples.

    The role of the centrl gov't is split in the two dimensions. You mention healthcare, and I agree with you about Biden. I'm thinking gay marriage or Gitmo when I think of Bush!

    We need yet another axis for what kind of social liberalism we're talking about, lol...
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  22. #22
    Mostly annoying Hallen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don View Post
    [rant]
    You realize that's all heresy around these parts, don't ya, stranger? Because while The Enlightenment happened for those of us who are smart enough to hang out here, everyone knows the rest of society is composed of pickpockets and thieves, gangstas and crooks, out to rob us blind and leave us dying by the side of the road. Except for politicians and bureaucrats, who are angels sent from heaven to guide those lesser beings on the path to righteousness.

    We know all that, because we learned it in government financed, government controlled schools, from textbooks written on government grants, from teachers paid by the government. And amazingly unbiased.

    So take your "people are capable of acting like grownups" routine somewhere it would be appreciated, like fantasy land.
    [/rant]
    Oh, and if you're still reading? There actually are a few of us here who don't think like that. We salute you for a wise and reasoned post.




    I just had to try that role on, since it's so popular.
    lol, yeah, it's dangerous ground, I know. I'll always keep it civil and I try very hard to never attack the person. I shouldn't be here anyway. You can't convince the world by posting on a forum.
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  23. #23
    Mostly annoying Hallen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by backslashbaby View Post
    I do find the graph off, too, fwiw. I turned out more leftist than I expected compared to most of their democratic examples.

    The role of the centrl gov't is split in the two dimensions. You mention healthcare, and I agree with you about Biden. I'm thinking gay marriage or Gitmo when I think of Bush!

    We need yet another axis for what kind of social liberalism we're talking about, lol...
    Exactly. It needs about 3 more dimensions to work properly.
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  24. #24
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  25. #25
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