Did Obama Lie About Keeping Your Insurance?

William Haskins · Jun 12, 2010

At the same time -- I just want to be completely clear about this; I keep on saying this but somehow folks aren't listening -- if you like your health care plan, you keep your health care plan. Nobody is going to force you to leave your health care plan. - Pres. Obama, August 2009

Internal administration documents reveal that up to 51% of employers may have to relinquish their current health care coverage because of ObamaCare.

Small firms will be even likelier to lose existing plans.

The "midrange estimate is that 66% of small employer plans and 45% of large employer plans will relinquish their grandfathered status by the end of 2013," according to the document.

In the worst-case scenario, 69% of employers — 80% of smaller firms — would lose that status, exposing them to far more provisions under the new health law.

The 83-page document, a joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services, Labor and the IRS, examines the effects that ObamaCare's regulations would have on existing, or "grandfathered," employer-based health care plans.

http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAna...aul-Probably-Not-Govt-Analysis-Concludes.aspx

whistlelock · Jun 12, 2010

Reading through the link it's not clear why they would lose status, other than this:

However, the source conceded: "It is difficult to predict how plans and employers will behave in the coming years, but if plans make changes that negatively impact consumers, then they will lose their grandfather status."

bolding mine.

Reading through that it is not the government forcing the loss or change but the insurance company or employer making a change in the plan that negatively impacts the customer/employee.

So...no change = keep the coverage you have.

Change = possible loss of coverage.

leahzero · Jun 12, 2010

Did Obama lie? No. Nothing in the health plan forces insurance companies or employers to reduce their coverage. It's entirely their decision, as it has always been, to screw their customers and employees.

What an inane and disingenuous thread title.

Gretad08 · Jun 12, 2010

Perhaps it wasn't a lie, but a mere omission. Perhaps he should have said:

At the same time -- I just want to be completely clear about this; I keep on saying this but somehow folks aren't listening -- if you like your health care plan, you keep your health care plan. Nobody is going to force you to leave your health care plan...for at least three more years, or if we don't like what the insurance company is doing, or, well hell, maybe if I just feel like it okay?!

(this quote can be attributed to President Barack Obama in collaboration with GretaD08, 2009)

MattW · Jun 12, 2010

Would changes that go against the tenets of the Federal plan but still provide better service at lower cost be cause for exclusion?

That will be a very telling example right there.

rugcat · Jun 12, 2010

Leah Raeder said:
What an inane and disingenuous thread title.

Better than the original one:

"Has Evil Obama Been Caught In Yet Another Lie?"

Paul · Jun 12, 2010

Gregg · Jun 12, 2010

Perhaps they had to pass the law so they could find out what was in it. :tongue

billythrilly7th · Jun 12, 2010

Mother of god this is my worst nightmare and I expressed it as exactly that during the health care debate.

Never believed him to begin with though.

Because it would be impossible to force companies to do things like taking on the uninsurable without their being major gack ups and premium hikes to the policies they had already.

FOL

William Haskins · Jun 12, 2010

rugcat said:
Better than the original one:

"Has Evil Obama Been Caught In Yet Another Lie?"

i've never come close to calling obama evil and you know it.

MacAllister · Jun 12, 2010

I'd just like to pre-emptively warn everyone that the much saner and more even-handed Williebee is currently on an unofficial sabbatical to get some writing done, and the other much saner and more even-handed Cranky is taking the evening off with an incipient migraine.

That means I'm the only P&CE mod on duty.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming.

robeiae · Jun 12, 2010

Senorita, come sit by my fire...

blacbird · Jun 12, 2010

MacAllister said:
and the other much saner and more even-handed Cranky

The WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT?

caw

cethklein · Jun 13, 2010

William Haskins said:
i've never come close to calling obama evil and you know it.

No, you've done it in a round-about way so as to not have to actually defend your views. (whatever the hell those are, all I can gather is you obviously don't like Obama, although you've never actually said why.))

But regardless, what's your opinion on the article you linked to? As usual you simply linked to something without a word of your own included.

Don · Jun 13, 2010

cethklein said:
No, you've done it in a round-about way so as to not have to actually defend your views. (whatever the hell those are, all I can gather is you obviously don't like Obama, although you've never actually said why.))

But regardless, what's your opinion on the article you linked to? As usual you simply linked to something without a word of your own included.

Don't you think the juxtaposition of the two quotes, as well as the title, make the position of the poster perfectly clear? I think it's crystal.

Personally, I think the thrillster nailed it this time. It was a sucker's come-on. You won't have to lose your plan, unless the insurance companies find it impossible to continue the plans they have, because of basic economics. Same people that fell for ARMS and interest-only loans fell for this shit. Thank dog for public ~~indoctrination~~ education.

William Haskins · Jun 13, 2010

cethklein said:
No, you've done it in a round-about way so as to not have to actually defend your views. (whatever the hell those are, all I can gather is you obviously don't like Obama, although you've never actually said why.))

But regardless, what's your opinion on the article you linked to? As usual you simply linked to something without a word of your own included.

"as usual"... heh.

oh i can defend my views. as don pointed out, the juxtaposition of the quotes speaks volumes. the thread is implicitly about whether or not we continue to allow politicians to assure us that "want to be completely clear," while misrepresenting the reality of how their policies will impact people.

the beauty of it is that no amount of poutrage about "you just don't like obama" or "your thread title is mean" or "you really think obama is evil" is going to make on goddamn bit of difference in the long run.

either people who like their plans will keep them as the roll out of government benchmarks hit, or they won't. it will be objectively measurable and will not be subject to hysterics of the "it's okay if obama does it" brigades.

rugcat · Jun 13, 2010

William Haskins said:
either people who like their plans will keep them as the roll out of government benchmarks hit, or they won't. it will be objectively measurable and will not be subject to hysterics of the "it's okay if obama does it" brigades.

Sadly, it won't.

In the big picture, if the economy tanks and things get worse, people will point to this as objective proof the policies enacted were a failure.

But if the economy continues to improve and things get better, those same people will talk about natural economic cycles and claim that the improvement came despite those policies.

This phenomenon is seen among all partisans, but i think it's particularly strong among the anti Obama crowd.

William Haskins · Jun 13, 2010

rugcat said:
This phenomenon is seen among all partisans, but i think it's particularly strong among the anti Obama crowd.

also a phenomenon seen among all partisans.

benbradley · Jun 13, 2010

I still haven't got my Obama check and I'm getting poutraged.

astonwest · Jun 13, 2010

I'm waiting for my employer to drop all coverage, and then sit back and laugh as we're forced to pick up the full amount of the bill without penalty, because we make more than the federal limits for government assistance.

Did Obama Lie About Keeping Your Insurance?

William Haskins

poet

whistlelock

Whiskey Rebel

leahzero

The colors! THE COLORS!

Gretad08

MattW

Company Man

rugcat

Lost in the Fog

Paul

Gregg

Life is good

billythrilly7th

William Haskins

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MacAllister

'Twas but a dream of thee

robeiae

Touch and go

blacbird

cethklein

Don

All Living is Local

William Haskins

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rugcat

Lost in the Fog

William Haskins

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benbradley

It's a doggy dog world

astonwest

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment