• Basic Writing questions is not a crit forum. All crits belong in Share Your Work

Learning to Plot

Sean Craven

VPXIII
Registered
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
28
Reaction score
14
Location
Berkeley
Plot is my weakness, and I've decided to try and tackle it head-on. So I'm asking if anyone has any thoughts on how to learn about plotting.

I've joined a free class that Holly Lisle offers from her website, and I've gathered a stack of books. I'm starting my new story out as a collection of notes on needed scenes and story elements, and today I'm going to print them out and shuffle them about, rather than going through my usual process of simply writing it out and juggling it from there.

But if anyone has any thoughts on specific resources and techniques, I'd be grateful. Frankly, I think I have a lot of virtues as a writer, but without narrative drive, well. It's like having a bunch of chrome and no car.
 

Pied_Piper

Registered
Joined
Nov 17, 2009
Messages
21
Reaction score
0
I want to see what others have to contribute to this question. I know we all have had this problem sometimes. I am sitting next to The Lonely One.
 

Libbie

Worst song played on ugliest guitar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 23, 2007
Messages
5,309
Reaction score
1,094
Location
umber and black Humberland
I use the "write notes on cards, then shuffle them to mess with order" technique and it works well for me.

As for plot, my suggestion is that you write the story -- all of the story; whatever wants to come out of you -- and not worry about plot for now. Once you've finished the story, go back and write a synopsis by summarizing each chapter in a paragraph or less. Then edit your synopsis down into a two-page document. You will have to cut out a lot of deadwood in order to pare it down to two pages. Whatever you cut from your synopsis (because it wasn't important enough to convey the very most important ideas/actions in your story), cut out of the manuscript as well, and then rewrite to make sure all the gaps are bridged.

That should tighten up your plot quickly and easily! That's what I did with my current ms.
 

kaitie

With great power comes
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
Messages
10,995
Reaction score
2,526
This is going to be completely unhelpful, but my first step was making friends with someone who was superb at plot and if I got stuck I'd think, "What would he do?" That got me actually thinking about plot as opposed to just randomly letting things happen.

Since then, I make an actual effort to look at the main points that should happen. First step is usually to figure out what the climax should be, then all the little points in between start filling in. I keep a note file that has character descriptions and plot points in it and add to it as I go.
 

Linda Adams

Soldier, Storyteller
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 2, 2005
Messages
4,422
Reaction score
639
Location
Metropolitan District of Washington
Website
www.linda-adams.com
Plotting has been one of my weaknessnes, too--I used to be a short story writer, and it's been very difficult plotting a longer work.

It is a difficult to concept to understand. It seems like it shouldn't be, but it's awfully easy to launch on an idea, write an entire story, and have no plot. I've done it, and I see it a lot when I critique. I believe it's one of those areas where you have to come into understanding--but once you understand, it's like magic.

How to gain the understanding? Do lots and lots and lots of crits of first chapters. One of the things I learned was that you can tell pretty fast if a story has a plot or not--it's surprisingly obvious once you have a sense of what to look for. That's how come agents request five pages and then give a rejection.

What's a plot? It's basic definition is a series of events that advances the story. But that's deceptive, because you can have a series of events but no plot. My definition is that it's a thread that runs through the entire books and connects everything together. Or a sense of direction. The thread is what I feel--or don't feel--when I crit a first chapter.

The mistake a lot of people make is that they get the idea and launch off the idea. They don't develop the idea further into a plot and end up with a story where the dialogue is forced (characters don't have anything to talk about) or a lot of disconnected events happening. When I was in a critique group, we had a guy who was submitting his novel around and not having much luck. His first chapter was about someone shooting at his main character. No plot thread even hinting of things to come--it was more like a random event. Next fifty pages? Without a plot, he had nothing else to do but have the MC repeat what happened to other characters seven times.

On novel structure, I'd recommend reading The Marshall Plan for Novel Writing. It's written by an agent who reps fiction, and he gives a step-by-step outline of a novel. The outline might not work for you--didn't for me--but it'll give you an idea of where the subplots comes in, when the beginning should end, when the surprises (twists) should happen, etc.

For me, I also will think in terms of each chapter having a specific story-related goal. It can be large or small; it can even have an obvious goal and a more subtle one.

If I introduce a character or place, I also see what else I can do with them in the story. This often leads to additional complications or builds further on the story.

Also make sure you answer any major questions in the story up front. I see people talk about writing a mystery and not knowing who committed the crime until the end. I can tell from experience this will ripple through entire plot and be a major headache to correct.

Another suggestion before you write the book is to do a short synopsis. It should have a begining, middle, and an end. Don't panic! This is not for agents, but merely to give you an idea of what needs to happen.

Outlines may also be worth looking at. Please note that if you think an outline is right for you, shop around a bit. It may take a while to find one that you're comfortable with.
 
Last edited:

EclipsesMuse

Questing
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Messages
422
Reaction score
23
i.e. the villain or antagonist:
What is their goal? Why do they want this goal?
How do they plan to do this?
Then, once I have that, how is the protagonist going to react to this?

More question come from that. The I usually do a short summary and an outline to lay everything out.

Of course, even with this I will turn around and redo 75% of everything after writing it. Like I'm doing now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: adinaluca

Swordswoman

Resilient and kind
Kind Benefactor
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 8, 2009
Messages
687
Reaction score
464
Location
UK
I think E.M. Forster has one of the clearest definitions of plot in his 'Aspects of the Novel'. He famously pointed out that 'The king died, then the queen died' is a story, while 'The king died, then the queen died of grief' is a plot.

A plot cannot be simply a series of events - they need to be causally linked. Yes, the occasional chance event can happen, but only very rarely and only if they're not creating either coincidence or a deus-ex-machina. You can also have limited chance events within a narrative sequence - eg provided you've got a good plot reason to stick your characters in dark tunnel you don't need a reason for all the horrid things that happen to them in there - as long as they could be a natural result of being in a dark tunnel...

However, the basic narrative of a good plot must (I think) be causal. The first event leads to the second and so to the third, which is why the plot creates 'narrative drive' - the movement is always forward, and the better your plot the greater the impetus.

This is one reason why Linda's and Libbie's suggestion of writing a synopsis first is such a good one: a synopsis will immediately make clear whenever you're simply falling into the 'series of events' trap. Watch out for any sentence that could begin with that dreaded word 'Then'. 'This happened, then this happened', is not a plot. Find a way in which the second event arises out of the consequences of the first, then you're moving forward.

Even that is a very, very simple plot structure, and a good one needs to do more. Forster goes on with his original example to point out how you can complicate your basic plot in order to create a novel's shape - eg the king died, and then the queen died, and no-one knew why until they realized it was because of her grief at the death of the king. In other words, you can hide your causal link from the reader if you want to create mystery or intrigue, or perhaps just to avoid a linear structure, but the link still needs to be there in your head and to be paid off in the end.

HOW one turns all this into a strong plot would take several books to discuss. A good basic understanding of narrative structure helps, and while there aren't many books on that dealing with novels specifically, I'd recommend Linda Seger's 'How To Make A Good Script Great' for a strong general guideline as applicable to novels as it is to scripts.

Guidelines are still only guidelines, and everyone has their own way of plotting, which is how it should be. Still, for what they're worth, here are a couple of basic pointers I've used before with new writers, which I often find helpful to remember myself...:(

You know your characters' goals, where they're starting and what they're aiming to achieve. When you're driving, you look for the simplest, quickest way between two points, but when you're plotting you do the opposite. Whenever you can see an obvious way for your characters to achieve what they want, then hurl an obstacle in their path to complicate matters.
BUT here again, if you do this by the 'series of events' style, you'll end up with some horrible plot ninja, or a Raymond Chandler man leaping through the door with a gun - and much as I admire Chandler, he was the first person to admit he had no idea whatsoever about plot and frequently lost track of it completely. No, if you're plotting, your obstacle has to arise out of something that has already happened (even if your characters don't know it). It can be as simple as an attempt to kill them because they have unwittingly already become a danger to a villain, or another woman falling in love with the hero because he just rescued her from a burning building. As long as you have that 'because', you're doing fine.

What you're effectively creating is a train of consequences. If you're very new to all this, one of the easiest ways of designing a plot is to make a chart to see how you get from A to B within your basic story structure. Take your first event, then draw arrows to every possible (interesting!)consequence that could result. Then list the possible consequences of those. You'll soon drop some of the first ones as 'not leading anywhere interesting', and it won't be long before you've got one thread that's moving like a rocket. That's the one you write. It'll almost certainly change as you go along, of course, because as characters grow and develop you suddenly see whole new consequences you'd never thought of ('But if Peter had that childhood memory of being trapped in the Blitz he'll be terrified of underground places, he'll go mad in that tunnel, which will force Bill to take over, which will make Jane impressed, which will make Peter jealous of Bill, which will be why he betrays him, and THAT's how the villains find out where he is'). When this happens for real with a major story strand, it's like one mine setting off another in your head until your brain blows up, and it's one of the best feelings in the world...

Honest. :D

Louise
 

Kalyke

Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
1,850
Reaction score
182
Location
New Mexico, USA
Frankly, I think I have a lot of virtues as a writer, but without narrative drive, well. It's like having a bunch of chrome and no car.

Yup. Story should be your major consideration. I am like you. Lotta talent, no story. Narrative drive: it's not like it is not genetic. If you are normal in any way, the story is very important to how you make decisions. That is the nut-graf. You have a question that will take a few years to answer.
 

Rhoda Nightingale

Vampire Junkie
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Sep 25, 2009
Messages
4,470
Reaction score
658
It's just been pointed out to me that my lack of plotting skills might be one of things giving me problems with word count. (Too short.) I'll be lurking.
 

EclipsesMuse

Questing
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 11, 2009
Messages
422
Reaction score
23
Take your first event, then draw arrows to every possible (interesting!)consequence that could result. Then list the possible consequences of those.

Is it possible for the first event not to be the first event in the story?
 
  • Like
Reactions: kittrick

Kalyke

Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
1,850
Reaction score
182
Location
New Mexico, USA
Walp. If I am pressed I will say that you should pick some intereresting event or thing in non-fiction and study it. Plot is really a rendering of non-fiction.
Story is a reality. Plot is story. Story is what happens ina plot. Story is the summation of the final event really. Plot is a bit by bit chain that leads to whatver the final event is. You are telling me that you are a writer of stories who does not understand what/ how to get to a story. Repete after me, Plot is another word for "story."

Just look at book reports. Look at plot summaries: Some guy falls in Love at first sight but family is srewed up and wants him to do something else (avenge his cousin's death?). No can do, love is a stronger force than revenge, and so-- love is also stronger than death---

Guys this is an author speaking. At the time Shakespeare wrote Romeo and Juliette, no one believed that love was stronger than death or that the power of love was more than stupid kids doing things that were illegal. Marriage may be a constitutional right in the usa, but Love has had a very hard climb to be taken seriously anywhere.

So you really might try play acting: who am I: What am I writing. When I was in writing school I was asked who my writing "parents" were. You don't choose them, other people who read you pick them for you. Sounds like a wine tasting. A bit of Anne Rice with a bouquet of Hemmingway, and a side of Graham Greene.

I mean, I totally think the whole package is about the plots you choose. How do you deal with this information? I give you the bones of any novel and you change the novel. The story will be changed due to the author's inteference.

So start where you want. Shakespeare/ Dune/ Valley of the Dolls. What a wierd combination.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jacksamstag

Swordswoman

Resilient and kind
Kind Benefactor
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 8, 2009
Messages
687
Reaction score
464
Location
UK
Is it possible for the first event not to be the first event in the story?

Yes, absolutely. I'd never do a plan of this sort for the whole book, only when I have a specific stretch of story to cover between two landmarks, eg 'how do I get from the moment they realize he's been framed to the moment they ambush the villain?' These days I don't use a chart at all, I just keep making up Option A, Option B, Option C etc until I find one that takes off. The only similarity to the chart is that I still use arrows as shorthand for which naturally leads to... to make sure the causal link is still in place.

Sometimes I may only know the end-point I'm trying to get to, and in that case I work backwards,ie 'why could this happen, what could make this happen?' and so on back to the point I'm starting from.

Everyone does it differently, it has to be what works for you. If there's a single secret to it, I think it's knowing when to scrap one option and try another. Too often you can see a writer hit a dead end and just try to bulldoze his way through it, instead of going back and unpicking till he finds where he went wrong.

Not that I ever do that myself, of course.....:D

Louise
 
  • Like
Reactions: adinaluca

Kalyke

Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
1,850
Reaction score
182
Location
New Mexico, USA
Every plot needs a starting point. Most storys of a certain level of sophistication have more than one trigger event. And several story threads.

Each trigger has to set up a cascade of action like dominoes falling. The dominoe that falls has to relate logically to the one directly before it. A plot is simply the story laid out-- "John sees Mary at the soda shop" triggers "John asks Mary out for a date." What coud his obsticles logically be? Several. Mary might be married. Mary might be a cross dresser. Mary might be a KGB agent. Mary's parents might object. This could be a war zone and both could be enemies.

Obsticles control the direction of the plot. Whether you create or choose one or another is really up to the type of writer you are. If you are a romance writer, you would go with a different obsticle than an action adventure writer (or you might not as many genres mix). You can use basic "plots" in any genre. John and Mary's plot can be used in both a romance novel or a action adventure-- only the obsticles would be different. In a love story, you might use "parents object." In an action adventure, you might choose "KGB agent."

What is their Goal? John might want to date Mary in a love story, but in an action adventure he might want to get information about a spy network out of her. The Goal is tightly bound to the choice of obsticles. It also is bound to the "result." Did he or did he not get his way? How did the story conclude?

Yes. He got the information and diverted the threat.
No. He did not get the information, and was captured by the enemy.

If you have the elements of a trigger, a set of obsticles, and a goal, you can generally build a plot.

Obsticles are usually done in 3's each getting a bit "worse" than the last. They don't need to be 3s but that is one of those silly magical numbers people use. I like 5's and 7's too. For some reason symmetry looks fake. Obsticles getting worse and worse is calld "upping the ante" in some writing books.

I feel when your story is absolutely forcing you in some direction you have to set up a new obsticle. Your MC recognizes it, re-groups and tries to figure his way around it. Once he overcomes that obsticle the anti is raised. What does John do if he dosen't have enough change to buy the six pack? Does he go go rooting in the sofa cushions, or you drop the idea and drink tap water. Does he rob a bank? A character who really wants his beer is going to go for the sofa cushions first (in this story). What if there is a black widow spider in the sofa cushions? The MC's hand swells up and he gets the clammy sweats. Does he 1) Die? 2) Call 911? 3) Get a friend to take him to the doctors? 4)Wake up and realize it was all a dream (don't use this option). 5) get really high and see a magical elf who gives him instructions to some secret door that links two worlds? (Hmmm)

While plotting keep asking yourself "what happens next?"

As the author, you know (or should know) the end of the story. It is not as fun as reading the story-- and that is the difference between a reader and a writer. I've always thought a writer writes backward what the reader reads forward. This is just cryptic advice, but might come in handy on day.

Once I figured out these "rules" so to speak, I started to read for plot, and watch movies for the plot. Read/ watch drama with a pencil and paper at hand. When you see a plot point, write it down.
 

zornhau

Swordsman
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 21, 2005
Messages
1,491
Reaction score
167
Location
Scotland
Website
www.livejournal.com
This was my weakness also. The most useful book was Techniques of the Selling Author.

I think a plot is really just your story reduced to a simple pub yarn, with lots of "..but...", "...however..." "...even worse..." (i.e. reversals, twists, or complications).

Start by coming up with one sentence plots in which you're very clear about the character's motivation:
Broken-hearted Mary seeks solitude in a sleepy fishing, but finds true love instead.

Determined to win the battle, Colonel Smith tries to beat his new unit of conscripts into shape, but ultimately wins by working with their strengths and weaknesses.
Then move into writing something longer, but still framed as a simple present-tense narrative...
John Smith gets promoted, but to command a unit of volunteers. They try to impress him, but make fools of themselves. He...
 

Ruv Draba

Banned
Joined
Dec 29, 2007
Messages
5,114
Reaction score
1,322
Here's a cut-down version of an approach I use in various ways to try and create plot. It's actually part of a bigger method that I use with themes, but this is just the plot bit.

Core Ingredients:
  1. An interesting main character that readers will want to learn about. It is either about to lose something big or want something big, but either way this will change the character's life;
  2. An adversary who might or might not be villainous but must get in the way of what the main character wants;
  3. Other complications and distractions as required.
Stage I - Develop Loglines

For the adversary, create a logline in the following form: In situation1, adversary wants objective1, but something about main character creates obstacle1. Can adversary achieve objective1 or will disaster1 befall?

Now for the main character do the same: In situation2, main character wants objective2, but something about adversary creates obstacle2. Can main character achieve objective2 or will disaster2 befall?

Now think about how situation2 might lead to situation1 or vice-versa. Think about how the characters might create obstacles for one another.

Example:

This is a crime story. Our adversary is the murderess Cora, a wealthy young heiress with the ear of the local mayor, and the investigator is a librarian Therese Elliot. Here are their log-lines. (I generally find that it helps to do the antagonist's first.)

Cora: When Cora's brother Ralph discover that his sister is actually adopted, he makes secret plans to remove her from their father's will. Cora plans a perfect murder, but when the local librarian comes close to discovering her secret, can she thwart the investigation or will she go to jail?

Therese: When librarian Therese Elliot tries to recover some rare books that Ralph borrowed from the library, she begins to suspect that Ralph has been killed -- but is she mistaken? Can Therese recover the books and uncover a possible crime before Cora gets her fired -- or worse?

Stage II -- Create a Basic Step Plan

Now we need to write out in steps each of the key decisions the characters make. Each decision must be made in response to something another character does (i.e. stimulus/response), and should be consistent with their motives and personalities and meet the descriptions of the log-lines above. It should be obvious from the log-lines that the first step is Cora's.
  1. According to her father's will, Cora stands to inherit a big sum of money at age 25. However rifling through her brother's bureau she discovers that she is adopted and that her older brother Ralph is secretly trying to cut her out of her inheritance. When her brother prepares to go interstate to a rock concert, she drugs him and runs his car into a deep part of the local lake, then burns the documents that show her adoption and her brother's plans. (This is backstory)
  2. Unknown to Cora, Ralph had borrowed some rare collector's rock books from the library on short-term loan. Therese and Ralph share a love for the same band, and Therese bent some rules to loan Ralph part of the library's collection. Now she needs them back -- and she goes to Cora's house personally to collect them.
  3. When Therese comes to Cora's house about some library books, Cora makes the mistake of telling Therese that her brother posted them before he left. (In fact he did no such thing -- they are in the trunk of his car.) She little reckons though with Therese's doggedness.
  4. Relieved at the news, Therese waits two more days but the books don't arrive. The Head Librarian is beginning to ask questions, so Therese goes to the post office and discovers that Ralph was never there.
  5. ...
This step plan goes back and forth like a game of chess. Therese makes a move; Cora notices and makes a move. Therese responds and makes another move. Each reacts to the other without necessarily realising who they're dealing with.

Each is trying to get what they want; each starts unaware of the impact on the other. Over time though, the stakes must rise... Therese must begin to suspect that Ralph is missing... perhaps dead. Cora begins to realise that Therese won't give up -- she'll start trying to discredit Therese then perhaps hire someone to threaten or hurt her.

Stage III -- Complicate Things

At the moment all the moves are being made by Therese and Cora. But what if there were other characters with other goals? Suppose that Ralph's lawyer suspects Cora's complicity and Cora has to kill him off? Suppose that unbeknown to Cora, her adoptive mother lives in town and knows her secret? Suppose that the library is facing cut-backs and Therese's job is up for review? Suppose that Ralph owed some money to a bookie, and pawned one of the rare books to help pay him off?

You can give each major character in the story their own logline and let them contribute complications, distractions and red-herrings as you see fit.

Stage IV -- Build to Climax

For a story to have satisfying tension, it needs to work its way toward a climax for the main character. The climax is built around the main character's disaster -- so, it's about Therese losing her job. Perhaps she loses it? Perhaps she's suspended? Perhaps she's accused of theft herself? The more excruciating we can make the climax the better.

Or perhaps there's more than one climax -- perhaps there's a false climax (in which the bookie is arrested on suspicion of murder) but Cora is still out to kill Therese?

Stage V -- Resolve Things

In the resolution, every outstanding log-line must resolve. A character either gets what it wants or must see disaster... if it's the former then the disaster may be averted; if it's the latter then we need to know how the disaster changes the character.

Building the Drama

While the steps above are enough to create plot, to create compelling plot we need five critical things:
  1. Internal conflicts -- especially in the main character, but potentially in every major character. A plot that forces a character to make hard choices is more compelling than a character whose choices are always easy.
  2. Adversity -- more is better. Give the character challenges to overcome, and setbacks to suffer -- but make them all consequences of choices previously made.
  3. Surprises -- especially with complications and revelations. The more surprises, the more a reader will want to hear more
  4. Extremes of situation -- it's not enough that Therese's job is threatened; it has to be threatened at a time when she's behind on rent and lent money to her sister. It's not enough that some thug menaces her; he should break her car, trash her grandmother's heirloom crockery, nail her cat to the door.
  5. Pressure to change -- A main character suffering internal conflicts will either remain steadfast or change. Sometimes remaining steadfast is the better outcome; sometimes it's better to change. But characters don't always make the right choice. Readers care very much whether a main character changes and whether its decision to change or not is good. To make this interesting it's important that our main character has strengths and weaknesses, virtues and vices, and that these are tested in the story.
When Do We Have Enough Plot?

It really depends on how many scenes we want, and also the viewpoint we write in. If we write from just the MC's viewpoint, then the reader will only see the scenes that the MC sees -- at most the MC will hear about the other stuff later. But if we write from multiple viewpoints then you will see scenes for each step in each viewpoint.

A step will normally expand to at least one scene, and sometimes as many as four or five. A short story might have a six to 12 scenes; a novel might have 80.

Recently in my WIP I wrote 'After consoling himself over a fight with his girlfriend, the hero catches a train to meet an old member of his army unit who can exonerate him. But after saving his squadmate's life from local criminals, he discovers that his squadmate has been bribed to keep his mouth shut -- and won't open it for anyone.' I originally thought that would be two scenes, but so far I've written four and it might end up needing six.

So I think we're better off writing less plot to start with, then adding complications to make it interesting. Plot that looks blindingly simple on paper can end up being rich and complicated once we add action, dialogue and internal dilemmas.

Outline or Wing it?

I do a bit of both -- sometimes in the same story, and I've found that it doesn't matter. Often I'll break a story into its key steps and then wing some scenes and plan others. Sometimes I'll just plan the early steps and leave the later steps unplanned as I did above. Sometimes a scene will persuade me to change steps -- so I will. There are no rules as how early we need to do it. Likewise, if we have a partial manuscript in development that we've been winging, we can break it down into the sort of stimulus/response steps above, and from there try to work out what the log-lines are. From the log-lines we then can get ideas for more steps and more scenes.

There are no rules, but I've found that the log-lines and the stimulus/response steps are key to working out plots. We can do them early or do them late, but eventually I think we need them there.

Hope that helps.
 

Swordswoman

Resilient and kind
Kind Benefactor
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 8, 2009
Messages
687
Reaction score
464
Location
UK
I think a plot is really just your story reduced to a simple pub yarn, with lots of "..but...", "...however..." "...even worse..." (i.e. reversals, twists, or complications).

This is really excellent advice from zornhau.

He (sorry if that's wrong, I'm going by 'swordsman'!) is pointing out all the key ways of avoiding the 'and then' trap. The but/however/when technique is not only invaluable in working out one's own plot, it's also the best way to get a synopsis query past the gatekeepers.

Yes, zornhau's sig says s/he's unpublished - but if s/he can write a plot on these principles, that's not going to be the case for long...

Louise
 

Jamesaritchie

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 13, 2005
Messages
27,863
Reaction score
2,311
Plotting just confuses and bores me, so I take the Ray Bradbury/Stephen King approach, both of which say that plottiong is a bad thing. Get an idea, stick an interesting character in an interesting situation, and tell the story of how the character gets out of the situation. You get plot as a byproduct. The idiom "Well begun is half done" means everything.

Bradbury, with his usual elequence, says, Remember: Plot is no more than footprints left in the snow after your characters have run by on their way to incredible
destinations. Plot is observed after the fact rather than before. It
cannot precede action. It is the chart that remains when an action
is through. That is all Plot ever should be. It is human desire let
run, running, and reaching a goal. It cannot be mechanical. It can
only be dynamic.

So, stand aside, forget targets, let the characters, your fingers,
body, blood, and heart do.


King, with his usual bluntness, says, Plot is the good writer's last resort and the dullard's first choice.

King believes the story is already there, so you don't plot it, you just excavate it. I feel the same way. Your milage may vary.
 

Lady Ice

Makes useful distinctions
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Sep 11, 2009
Messages
4,776
Reaction score
417
Narrative drive is essential. If there's no drive in the story, no one will read on. Not even your friends.

First of all, create something concrete. The stuff around it might change but this concrete is what keeps your story from crumbling apart and becoming all random. The concrete element could be the setting (it happens in the 1970's in a small Yorkshire town), the genre (it's a romance), a character (Mac the complex character will appear somewhere in the story)...anything that gets to the heart of what your story's about. If you get confused, look at what you set as the concrete. Does it leave enough room for a good story to happen? Does it work? If not, you'll have to demolish it and find yourself a new concrete. The concrete is your drive as a writer to keep writing this story.

Make sure all your characters have proper motivations and are properly filled out. Something is going to happen and it's going to be their fault. If Mary gets hit by a bus, that may not be her fault but if she's resposible for nothing in the story, it makes it very boring and run of the mill. As a reader, we want to know Mary's story, not the story of someone who got hit by a bus.
If the characters don't have proper motivations, it won't be believable if they suddenly start doing very different things from what they've always been doing.

A story is basically 'How did we get from A to B?' So if you start by creating A and B, you can fill in the rest. You may decide that actually you want to go to C, but at least the novel starts off by going in some direction.

A is the opening balance. All the options are open for your characters. Where does the MC live? Is it in a house,flat, on the street...? How big is the house? Is the MC in love with Betty? As a writer, you decide what the opening balance is. Let's say MC lives in a big house with his love Betty.
B is the closing balance. How are things as the novel ends? An easy way to do an ending would to be invert A- so the MC lives in a small flat, without Betty.
Then of course, you have to show how the MC came to lose his house and Betty.
 

RJK

Sheriff Bullwinkle the Poet says:
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 6, 2007
Messages
3,415
Reaction score
440
Location
Lewiston, NY
I just submitted my NaNo novel :hooray: and printed my winner certificate, so I can goof off for a while.
When I start out trying to develop the plot for a new WIP, I follow Jack Nicholson's advice. I think about how a guy smarter than me would do it, then I do that.
I think you need the old 5 W's to develop plot Who, What(how), When, Where, and Why.
If you've covered these elements from the protagonist's and the antagonist's POV, you should see the plot.
I write Crime Suspense. My detective must find out how the crime occurred (What). When it happened, Where it happened (if the body was moved). Why it happened, and most important, Who did it.
The antagonist (and others) must divert him from his quest, throw false leads in his path, lie to him, destroy evidence, tamper with witnesses, physically fight him off, possibly sacrifice minor partners to save himself.
All these are ways to twist the plot to make the story interesting, but the basic plot is a simple one, A crime is committed, the detective must solve the crime and bring the perpetrator to justice.
 

Z0Marley

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
666
Reaction score
52
Location
United States of America
Website
www.youtube.com
There's a couple things that I do:

1. Get your basics down. Who is the main character? What does he/she want or do? Why do they do it? Who helps them accomplish their goals? Now, answer all of those questions for the antagonist.
2. Build your supporting characters -- I love to write not just my MC's stories, but others as well. Why do they help your MC or antag? Write something for each one, even if it is because they're a good person, learn what made them a good hearted person in the first place.
3. Take about a week away from your skeleton. Come back and as AS MANY questions as you possibly can. (I know some people that sit down with a friend that likes to argue and make them as a billion questions). Once you've got about 30-50 questions, answer them and tie them together. By the time you've done this your plot should be at least 80k words full of story.

Remember to have fun the entire time ^_^
 

sunandshadow

Impractical Fantasy Animal
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 17, 2005
Messages
4,827
Reaction score
336
Location
Pittsburgh, PA, USA
Website
home.comcast.net
Plot is my weakness, and I've decided to try and tackle it head-on. So I'm asking if anyone has any thoughts on how to learn about plotting.
Interesting. I decided this exact thing about 6 years ago. Here's what I studied:

- How to write books (the obvious one). Freytag's Pyramid, Dramatica, Vector Theory, Snowflake Method, Scene Sequel and MRUs, Writer's Journey, Circular 4-act plot diagrams, Fortunately/Unfortunately plot snakes, 7-act theory, Truby's 20-point plot, and yes Holly Lisle's Notecards.

- Narratology and structural analysis of fiction and myth (graduate-level literary theory with a bit of sociology/anthropology/psychology thrown in). Vladimir Propp and Claude Levi-Strauss are the two big names, but I went to the local university library and read my way through the literary theory section. I remember seeing a particularly interesting vector plot diagram of... King Lear, I think?

- Interactive fiction. This probably isn't useful to the average novelist, I'm just interested in video-game design, but this did contribute to my understanding of plot segment modularity, and the idea of the world as a character controlled by the 'game master' and capable of taking action within the plot. Also video games are a good place to study villains and have a lot of classic hero monomyth elements, if you're interested in that type of story.

- Actual novels (and movies, anime, manga, etc). I did an analytical synopsis of Pride and Prejudice and one of Clan of the Cave Bear; I really ought to do more of these. I also bought some books where each volume had 100 brief plot synopses of classic novels. I also made some lists: all the basic romance plot shapes I could think of, typical plot shapes for other genres like mystery and adventure, types of beginnings, types of endings, types of thematic character arcs and the archetypes of characters who go with each theme.

- I got into the habit of outlining my own story ideas. I use a variant on the snowflake method, because I don't really care for notecards. I have a rather large documents of outlines and partial outlines, and I learned more about my own writing by noticing what cropped up in several of my outlines.


What was the result of studying all this? I certainly learned a lot about what plot is. I find it much easier to analyze other people's plots and can suggest fixes to their plotting problems. On the other hand I did not really develop better instincts about creating my own plots or get my subconscious to produce more plot-related inspirations. I still run into the problem that if my original story idea did not include an idea for the climax, I will probably never come up with one, although I did find some good techniques for working my way through the beginning and middle of the plot.

I reluctantly came to the conclusion that I tolerate a wide variety of plots/types of conflict in other people's fiction but only like a very few of them enough to write about. Also, the fact that a plot is like a thematic question, with the climax being the answer; but if I already know the answer the question doesn't interest me enough to write about, and on the other hand if I don't know the answer there probably isn't any good answer I could figure out in the process of writing it. So, gaining knowledge didn't solve the problem because the problem is part of my personality.
 

TrickyFiction

Who?
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Mar 23, 2006
Messages
1,123
Reaction score
146
Location
on the precious Pacific.
Bradbury, with his usual elequence, says, Remember: Plot is no more than footprints left in the snow after your characters have run by on their way to incredible
destinations. Plot is observed after the fact rather than before. It
cannot precede action. It is the chart that remains when an action
is through. That is all Plot ever should be. It is human desire let
run, running, and reaching a goal. It cannot be mechanical. It can
only be dynamic.

So, stand aside, forget targets, let the characters, your fingers,
body, blood, and heart do.
.

I love this. Beautifully put. Another way of describing this technique was used by an old professor of mine. She said it's like driving down a winding country road at night, and all you can see is what's just ahead, illuminated by your headlights. Sometimes you don't even need to know your destination, although it can help. Just focus on the next turn, then the turn after that.

This is how I have to write. I'm not so good at mapping the whole story out beforehand. However, I find that if my characters are well-developed, they will drive the story on their own. I'm not one of those who believes this is the only way to write, so I suppose I disagree with King on that. But if plotting the story beforehand is not coming naturally to you, this may be a better option.
 

zornhau

Swordsman
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 21, 2005
Messages
1,491
Reaction score
167
Location
Scotland
Website
www.livejournal.com
[Bradbury: ]So, stand aside, forget targets, let the characters, your fingers,
body, blood, and heart do.

King, with his usual bluntness, says, Plot is the good writer's last resort and the dullard's first choice.

King believes the story is already there, so you don't plot it, you just excavate it. I feel the same way. Your milage may vary.

The first Indiana Jones film was built using brainstorming and outlining. It all depends on how your brain works. Telling stories in outline can be a good way of practicing, even if you actually never outline when writing full length stories.

The difference between plot and story is nebulous. Suspect the latter includes the scenes you'd relate in detail if telling the story in the pub...
Plot: Hero gets lost in woods, but good elf helps him. Villain springs trap, but hero cleaves his way out.

Story: So Olaf gets lost in the woods, but the good elf pops up and guides him to a village. He walks into an inn, and every single drinker pulls a knife or axe and goes for him. Olaf throws off his cloak, unhooks his sword and cuts the first man in two. That gives them pause...