Damnation Books

Momento Mori said:

This.

Unless anyone under contract with Damnation Books wants to take it to court, no one knows what a judge will decide.

And I think we've established that no one under contract with Damnation has/wants to spend the cash to go to court. And some under contract with Damnation don't want to listen to what their lawyers have told them.

MM

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True enough.

Kensington said:

He probably already has one in the works. Still, it would be hard to simply write off the Damnation novel, and that's what he'd have to do, for a minimum of 5 years.

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Yeah, that's what he'd have to do. Perhaps forever.

Did you know that I keep saying "The only thing worse than being unpublished is being badly published"?

Stories like this are part of why that's true.

The book's dead. Move on.

I would note that not one author from Eternal or Damnation has sent their sales figures to ERECsite. No matter how a press behaves, sales figures speak for themselves.

I think the outrage comes not so much from the kill fee, but the fact that it wasn't in Alex's contract, nor in the contracts of other authors involved with this press. Even those in favor of kill fees, acknowledge they should be in the contract.

It's hard to remain cool, when you know someone is trying to screw you, big time. Publishers like this think authors have no power, and they can use and abuse them as they wish. And if it wasn't for sites like this, they'd be right.

I see Alex's open letter is now going the rounds. I can understand his anger and frustration, but I agree with much of the advice given here. For his own sake, he should forget about this book, it's as good as dead, and move on.

http://www.writers.net/forum/read/1/32024/32024

veinglory said:

I would note that not one author from Eternal or Damnation has sent their sales figures to ERECsite. No matter how a press behaves, sales figures speak for themselves.

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Don't blame the authors for staying silent they're scared witless of reprisals, and that it somehow gets back to Kim (we call her the Dragon Lady) that they've complained. My book hasn't sold anything so far. I'm locked in for five years, unless I pay her $750.00. Although there's nothing about that in the contract, I read it over carefully. I'm disabled, and eking by on a small fixed income, there's no way I can afford to pay her. I explained this to her, offered to pay her part of it, or pay the whole thing, in a series of instalments, from my PayPal account, on the first of the month when my pension cheque comes in, but she won't negotiate. She wants it all right away. She also said that if I wnet ahead and left anyway she'd have me blacklisted as a troublemaker so I'd never find another publsiher.

ERECsite data is taken anonymously and posted only as an aggregate of at least 5 reports. Also some authors have posted there data right in this thread, but I can't use it without their permission. You can also send anonymous reports to piers anthony and Preditors & Editors, the main watchdog sites for publishers. There seems to be something going on with these publishers but until there are specific reports it will not filter through into the public domain. Once that happens being "blacklisted" by them will probably be a badge of honor.

Don West said:

She also said that if I wnet ahead and left anyway she'd have me blacklisted as a troublemaker so I'd never find another publsiher.

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I can promise you, this is crap. There isn't a list like that, and if there was, editors and publishers know to whom they're speaking and how legitimate they, and therefore any complaints they may have about their authors, are.

Write something else and send it to another, better publisher. There are plenty out there. Forget about whatever it is you have with Damnation and move on. You can do it!

I know there's been problems getting honest accounting at Eternal Press. Author, A.C. Katt, bought 45 of her books from Amazon, yet they never showed up on her royalty statements. She sought legal advice about this last year. Here are the details.

“290 days and 1 hours ago.
Reply
She is the publisher, Eternal Press out of Vancouver, Canada. I am the writer to whom she owes royalties, AC Katt. She claims there is a problem with the Amazon accounting and she is waiting until it straightens out.

I had at least 45 sales at Amazon.com because my husband purchased the books to give away and purchased direct to avoid the publishers prohibitive shipping costs. We are Premium Members and get our shipping free. She lists no consumer sales at Amazon.
What can I do short of taking her to court. The contract demands that I pay all costs for an audit. If she is found to be a cheat, do I still have to pay all costs?

As far as Fictionwise, Ally told me in early may that I had sold 1050 copies (downloads) of my book, The Sarran Plague. They approximately three weeks later she said it was a "mistake" and I only sold 600 copies. It smelled funny because the ratio was wrong. Also the only people who had this problem with Fictionwise were Eternal Press's best XXXXXXX XXXXXXX. This kind of computer problem should have affected the whole system or at least everyone at EP, but it seemed to affect only those who had unexpectedly large volume of sales.”

http://www.justanswer.com/questions/2bp52-how-long-can-a-canadian-publisher-hold-back-royalties-my

Ok but once again, unless you all are willing to see a lawyer and possibly go to court, then what else can you really do? I suggest leaving the book and moving on.

Well, I think you can probably do a little more than that. You can find out the maximum time Amazon might take to send the accounting and after that time period send a firm, clear email demanding return of rights. Demonstrable non-payment fo royalties could also be sent to the watchdog groups which would get this press a big red 'not recommended' from most of them.

You may not be able to afford a court battle, but a well organised and factual account of the problems experienced would be a service to other authors who might otherwise submit to this press--and a good many ebook customers would become aware of it too.

If you are a member of the Horror Writers Association, I suggest you bring this to the attention of the Grievance Committee. They were able to get me monies owed to me by a delinquent publisher (without my having to spend my own money for legal expenses).

Don West said:

I had at least 45 sales at Amazon.com because my husband purchased the books to give away and purchased direct to avoid the publishers prohibitive shipping costs. We are Premium Members and get our shipping free. She lists no consumer sales at Amazon.
What can I do short of taking her to court. The contract demands that I pay all costs for an audit. If she is found to be a cheat, do I still have to pay all costs?

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This is exactly the same thing that happened to me. The print books I purchased from Amazon never showed up in the quarterly statements. And of course, I didn't receive any royalties for them.

"This is the cover that caused all the problems. Alex did not like it. Kim refused to modify it, and insisted it would stand as is. What do you think? Do you like it? Do you think it's got what it takes to attract readers?"

http://www.damnationbooks.com/Covers/9781615720781.jpg

http://www.writers.net/forum/read/1/32024/32024

Ravenwing said:

"This is the cover that caused all the problems. Alex did not like it. Kim refused to modify it, and insisted it would stand as is. What do you think? Do you like it? Do you think it's got what it takes to attract readers?"

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No, I don't like it. It's bland, insipid and colourless. Albino, springs to mind. No wonder Alex reacted the way he did.

I've seen worse.

Alex didn't like the cover, I believe, because it in no way represented his story. Man, that Damnation website, with the black background is difficult to read. Anyone else notice that?

"Blurb: In this supernatural thriller, three aimless souls collide in a tempest of lust, violence and vice in Washington, DC, where the elitist country clubs they call their home can be as cutthroat as the business of staying popular. As their triangle grows tighter, they each battle to hold on to their sanity, one fleeing to Africa, the other two signing up for a cruise to Mexico. But they cannot evade their fate. And as they face down doubles and triples of themselves stalking them wherever they run, they will learn that the demons that haunt them will accept only blood for their final sacrifice."

http://www.damnationbooks.com/people.php?author=71

Ravenwing said:

"This is the cover that caused all the problems. Alex did not like it. Kim refused to modify it, and insisted it would stand as is. What do you think? Do you like it? Do you think it's got what it takes to attract readers?"

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Authors virtually NEVER get a say in their covers. Even top-name authors don't have much power when it comes to a cover. It's typically specified in the contract that the cover is determined by the publisher.

IOW, now you're complaining about something that's common practice with even the largest publishers.

Maybe what you need to do is step away from these threads and educate yourself about how publishing actually works. You appear to know as much about it as you do about law.

Terie said:

Authors virtually NEVER get a say in their covers. Even top-name authors don't have much power when it comes to a cover. It's typically specified in the contract that the cover is determined by the publisher.

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That hasn't been my experience. Perhaps I've just been unusually fortunate, but my publishers have always cooperated with me in creating the cover we're both happy with. Kim's attitude leaves a lot to be desired. Her refusal to negotiate with Alex, unacceptable. She seems to be going out of her way to start wars with her authors by acting in an unprofessional manner. And it's a no win, no win, for her every time. Once a press's reputation is shot, as Damnation's has been, and rightly so, of course, nothing can restore it. And all over a cover dispute and termination fees not specified in the contract, oh dear. (ROFL)

Clementine B:
Perhaps I've just been unusually fortunate, but my publishers have always cooperated with me in creating the cover we're both happy with.

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Okay. Who's your publisher?

Publishers may consult with an author on cover design if you're lucky, but they are not obligated to take the author's comments into account and unless it says otherwise in the contract (which it doesn't seem to here), it's the publisher's decision that's final.

MM

I haven't been published, but I have heard agents say that's one of the good reasons to have an agent, because an agent has a better chance of convincing a publisher to change a hideous cover than the author would working alone.

Kaitie, you're absolutely right. Authors, most often, don't understand the concept of cover design and what they want simply isn't marketable or advisable. Agents, OTOH, are attuned to the industry, and I've always happily listened to their feedback. This is going on the same time we're showing the artwork to store buyers as well.

Terie said:

Authors virtually NEVER get a say in their covers. Even top-name authors don't have much power when it comes to a cover. It's typically specified in the contract that the cover is determined by the publisher.
.

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It's different in epublishing. All of my publishers provide me with detailed cover art forms. A cover artist renders an image and sends it my way for approval or thoughts. Sure, the publisher has the final say in the artwork but they always listen to concerns. I know plenty of authors who have gone back and forth with their cover artists and publishers until they find the right look for their cover.

priceless1 said:

Kaitie, you're absolutely right. Authors, most often, don't understand the concept of cover design and what they want simply isn't marketable or advisable. Agents, OTOH, are attuned to the industry, and I've always happily listened to their feedback. This is going on the same time we're showing the artwork to store buyers as well.

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Found this to be true. An author might have an approximation of what will be truly attractive, but the publisher, who does most often have final say, will enhance on it. Works for titles too. I had a terrible title on my last book. I asked the agent what she thought--she agreed it was misleading and changed it. She NAILED it, giving it a proper thriller title. Mess--over with. Authors don't perform these tasks for a living. Trust your publisher or agent for proper feedback.

Tri

mlhernandez said:

It's different in epublishing. All of my publishers provide me with detailed cover art forms. A cover artist renders an image and sends it my way for approval or thoughts. Sure, the publisher has the final say in the artwork but they always listen to concerns. I know plenty of authors who have gone back and forth with their cover artists and publishers until they find the right look for their cover.

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Yes, and yes. That's the way it's always worked for me. The author always has input. The artist sends you the cover and asks what you think. That's the time to ask for any changes. I feel sorry for Alex stuck with such an atrocious, and inappropriate cover.

Here's another author's thoughts on it:

"I would have been very unhappy to have a cover like this. I realize a writer can't have absolute control over packaging, but come on. A little saleability goes a long way."

http://shocklinesforum.yuku.com/topic/15047?page=3