The Newer Never-Ending PublishAmerica / America Star Books Thread

Don Davidson said:

In "Ask Your Publisher," no one was invited to ask a single question--it was all propaganda about PA. So why was it titled, "Ask Your Publisher"? A more apt title would have been, "More Lies From Your Bogus Publisher."


These speakers are what you'd expect from a PA authors convention--a total waste of time that sucks up authors' money for PA's coffers.

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I have an idea that these were very carefully edited excerpts, since the presentations were supposed to be over an hour each. No telling what the audience members asked.

PVish said:

I have an idea that these were very carefully edited excerpts, since the presentations were supposed to be over an hour each. No telling what the audience members asked.

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Assuming for a moment that questions were actually permitted, I wonder how many authors were escorted off the premises for asking inconvenient questions, like, "Why do PA books cost so much and have such ridiculously high shipping costs?" or "Why does the BBB of Greater Maryland give PA an 'F' rating?" or "Why does PA's web site say you want our book, not our money, when your emails constantly ask us for money?" It would almost be worth the $29 to see that kind of show.

On the other hand, I fear that people who attend this type of "convention" are PA apologists, not PA antagonists.

I recently gave their forum a look ... and boy is that depressing. I found one post where the author was so happy that he found an agency in NY that will bring his book to the big screen - a fast check here revealed it was another scam organisation.

I just hope that one day they rip off the wrong person - either someone who'll break their knee caps or someone with enough money or access to it to sue them into oblivion.

I'm rooting for it to be an IRS agent.

I had an interaction with a gentleman on one of the firearms forums that I belong to, who was jubilant that his book had just been signed to his TEN year contract. I apologized to him and gave a brief recount of my problems during my seven years with them...he was the usual "I knew what I was getting into when I signed" reply, says that he is in control of his book prices, which I don't think is accurate based on current prices I see on their site. All I could do was sigh and ask him to check back in with us in a couple of months and update.

Gillhoughly said:

I'm rooting for it to be an IRS agent.

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What a great thought. I'm absolutely sure there are some hopeful novelists in the IRS ranks. Though, I don't wish falling into PA clutches on even an IRS agent . In my perfect world the IRS agent would *almost* sign, then realize the truth, back out, and sic his or her co-workers on the miscreants...

Fingers crossed!

B.L. Robinson said:

I had an interaction with a gentleman on one of the firearms forums that I belong to, who was jubilant that his book had just been signed to his TEN year contract. I apologized to him and gave a brief recount of my problems during my seven years with them...he was the usual "I knew what I was getting into when I signed" reply, says that he is in control of his book prices, which I don't think is accurate based on current prices I see on their site. All I could do was sigh and ask him to check back in with us in a couple of months and update.

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I've thought of this. PA could do a Name your own price deal simply charging for the difference. Let's say an author wanted his book to be $10 US. All they would do is contract for 100 books at this set price, and then charge the difference plus some boot for the trouble, say $1700. Then, the poor author wouldn't have to buy any books. he could just send his hundred friends to Amazon and they could get a discount off of his dime. Calling for only ten books at a time would be more affordable at $170 US.

I think they should call this Allen's Name Your Own Price Deal.

It is only fair. I devised the scheme.

Question. While getting some materials ready for my lawyer to deal with these people, I ran into something I found interesting.

For background, the contract on my first book with them supposedly renewed, though to this day I can swear to never signing or seeing anything of this renewal. My ill-advised second book with them comes to the end of its contract this year. I have been working with my attorney to block renewal on the second book, and be released from the first.

The interesting situation I ran into is that when I went to the PA website, neither of my books can be found, even after a long period of searching for them. Now, if they aren't available on the PA website, doesn't that put them in violation of the contracts? They certainly aren't trying to sell them if they don't even have them in THEIR on line store.

jb

It depends on how the contract is worded. If it says they will only attempt to sell books "at their discretion," I'm guessing they could lock your manuscript in a closet for seven years if they wanted and not be in violation. Your attorney could answer this a lot better than me.

-Katrina, who is not a legal type person of any kind

Josh1971 said:

For background, the contract on my first book with them supposedly renewed, though to this day I can swear to never signing or seeing anything of this renewal.

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Some of the contracts stipulate that the contract automatically renews unless one or the other party declines to renew it in writing. If your first book's contract says that, and if you didn't do what the contract says you must do to decline it, that would explain why it was renewed.

Katrina S. Forest said:

It depends on how the contract is worded. If it says they will only attempt to sell books "at their discretion," I'm guessing they could lock your manuscript in a closet for seven years if they wanted and not be in violation. Your attorney could answer this a lot better than me.

-Katrina, who is not a legal type person of any kind

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Nah, the original contracts promise "brick and mortar book stores", available at places like BN.com, their webstore, and so on.

JB

James D. Macdonald said:

"Available" != "shelved."

Technically, anything with an ISBN is "available."

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Of course, you'd have to be able to find me, either of my titles, or any hint that they exist at their website to consider them "available".

I Just want to get this whole mess sorted out. Publish America's continued existence would have to throw into doubt, the concept of karma.

Josh1971 said:

. . . Now, if they aren't available on the PA website, doesn't that put them in violation of the contracts? They certainly aren't trying to sell them if they don't even have them in THEIR on line store.

jb

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You'll still, as far as I know, have to pursue arbitration on their home turf.

--Ken

Oh wow, this thread's still going? I was last here three years ago... too bad PA hasn't collapsed in that time.


I took a look at their forums. There's an author there who paid PA for book signings several weeks ago and hasn't had any contact from them about it... double ouch!

First of all, from what I understand, you shouldn't have to pay your publisher to arrange book signings. (as I understand it, admittedly I'm not a published author, but doesn't that sort of thing come under marketing? which most publishers pay for themselves?) Second off all, paying and not receiving an information at all after weeks? I would be very upset.


I don't know if we're supposed to quote things from their forum but this just breaks my heart:

Sorry about the delay. I didn't recceive an e-mail notice of a reply.


I have been with PA since 2009.

I have never had a book signing or seen my book on the shelves at my local BN or Half Price books.

I tried to set up a book signing on my own, but the worker I talked to was rude. Gave me the impression I wasn't wanted there.

I was hoping PA would be able to set one up, but nothing yet.

My local library, whom I donated a book to, never put the book in their catalog either.

I have been trying word of mouth, and facebook. It doesn't seem to be helping my sales. Most people tell me if they don't see it on shelf at the store, they don't want it. (those were my own friends too).

I have written three children's books "The Wish", "The Wish 2" and "I Want a Panda." I wrote a novel called "Unholy Love".

Good luck on your sales.

Let me know if you do get a book signing.

Seems to me that a lot of new writers fail to believe what's happening to PA authors. If they want to really experience the problem, then they should go to a book store and try to set up a reading while claiming to have a PA book. Bet that gets the brain cells to issue a warning about who to trust and whether to even think about going with PA. And they'll save money, too.

Josh1971 said:

Nah, the original contracts promise "brick and mortar book stores", available at places like BN.com, their webstore, and so on.

JB

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You might want to double check the wording. I have yet to see such a promise in a PA contract. They are very careful with their wording. Most paragraphs end with, "... at PublishAmerica's discretion."

I remember seeing that phrase when I went to publish with them a long while back. Either way, it just says available, and does not say shelved or in stock. They also say places 'like' BN.com, which would be a place to buy books online. Unfortunately the PA website is also a place to buy books online.

I was fortunate enough to dodge the PA bullet by having the manuscript rejected. That manuscript is the one linked in my sig. I wonder what the rejection criteria is?

That makes sense. I sent it late at night (a.m. hours). I forgot that they have to reject some, otherwise they would look suspicious (or more suspicious).

bdarner said:

That makes sense. I sent it late at night (a.m. hours). I forgot that they have to reject some, otherwise they would look suspicious (or more suspicious).

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It's probably because they considered it already published, since you have it online.

It was actually submitted around 2 years ago, long before I bothered to self-publish it. I just randomly peddle it around because it was my first book. If it finds a home, good for it, if not, well my passion is to continue to write new and better things (no reason to dwell on the past).

I just check this particular part of the forum in hopes of reading that PA finally died. They do not like to be called a scam or a vanity press, because they can legally uphold they are neither. I think we can call them a scammity press, since scammity is not a real word.

bdarner said:

. . . They do not like to be called a scam or a vanity press, because they can legally uphold they are neither. . . ..

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PA could be the dictionary illustration of the phrase "vanity press," a publishing company that exists solely to sell books (and ancillary products) to the books' own authors. As for scam . . . well, the variety of very strange offers for sale in PA's "bookstore" speaks for itself.

--Ken

"Vanity of vanities saith the Preacher; vanity of vanities, and all is vanity." (Ecclesiastes 1:2). PA understands the author's vanity as well as the Ecclesiastes writer, which is why they're quite willing to print unpublishable first drafts--expertly create an allusion of grandeur through website ads and a censored writer's message board communicating an appeal to that "vanity"--an appeal to which sufficient writers succumb and open their wallets to purchase their own books, thinking they're only a brick and mortar store display away from immortality. It is the same psychology that causes perfectly sane people to buy magazine subscriptions in hopes of winning the Publishers Clearinghouse Sweepstakes; purchase lottery tickets, and at state fairs pay to throw soft balls at lead-weighted bowling pins, in hopes of winning a stuffed bear. And it works.

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but I am pretty sure that a vanity press accepts every work (no rejection letter). PA does not accept every work (rejection letters). If that reasoning is correct, then PA is not a vanity press.

A second note that I will make is that you can gladly send them a pile of crap (metaphorically) on purpose (I don't recommend this), and you could just let the contract ride while making very little money on a work that you do not care about. Can this make you money? Yes. Is it ethical? No. Of course this option can only be exercised once (and you will be waiting seven years for that measly check).

Combining these two concepts (assuming the first is true), you can rule that PA is not a scam or a vanity press. Hence, they need to be defined as something so it might as well be 'scammity press'.

In no way am I defending PA's practices. I am presenting concepts. Please do not submit to them (unless of course they physically mail you the contract; you could shred that and use it to stuff a pinata).