Undocumented immigrants and health care

Pretty easy. Put him on a plane to his nation of origin. They'll be happy to treat one of their citizens, I'm sure.

Aargh is a good way of describing this situation. It sucks for all involved. In the article they mentioned a restaurant charging more to patrons if they hired legal workers and paid them more.

Wouldn't the University Hospital operate under that same principle? If someone doesn't pay, that cost will roll downhill to other patients.

It's not fair that he can't get the treatment he needs, but is it fair to force others to pay for it since he can't?

dclary said:

Pretty easy. Put him on a plane to his nation of origin. They'll be happy to treat one of their citizens, I'm sure.

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The problem is who pays for the ticket? But I agree. This kind of refutes the claim that illegal immigrants only help the US. While there are more than a few American citizens who also burden the healthcare system, there are at least some ways to go after them,such as ruining their credit when they don't pay. An illegal immigrant gets off for free with no repurcussions.

These facts aren't ever discussed as anyone woh even mentinos them gets deemdd a racist and a bigot (mark my words, i'll be called that over this post).

But the fact remains that illegal immigrants abusing healthcare ARE part of the cause for high prices. not the sole cause, but part of it. A good friend of mine works in the ER. They illegals bring their kids in to the ER for things as simple as a stuffy nose because they know by law they cannot be turned away and that a doctor's office would turn them away.

This is another reason why I turn my nose up to those who claim illegal immigrants are treated unfairly. They get free healthcare at the expense of others (along with being able to just walk into the conutry and then get advocated for, unlike say a person from Ukraine or Cambodia who has to wait in line).

If anything, they get treated better than other immigrants yet want to act like victims. Sorry, but that shit doesn't fly and I don't care if it offends anyone. If peopel from other impoverished natinos have to wait in line for visas, why shouldn't people from Mexico? What makes them so special? Someone explain this to me please.

I'm for calling up their home nation and making them either foot the bill or take back their citizen. I'm sorry but we gotta fix our own problems before we can take on the world's. It's why the US is so screwed up right now. We're focusing too much on everyone elses problems and not enough on our own. Not saying we shouldn't help others, but ignoring our own problems to the point of implosion is ridiculous.

The UK has a problem like this too. The media here call it 'health tourism' because our NHS has neither the time nor the inclination to ID everyone who comes through the door, but if someone turns out to be illegal they have to report them to immigration. People come here from Africa and the Middle East to have operations they could never possibly afford in their home countries. The NHS bills them, all right, but you can't get blood out of a stone, and the NHS doesn't have the resources to chase people round the world looking for a payment.

I agree with cethklein - it's almost impossible to have reasonable debate when there's always going to be somebody shouting 'Racist!' as soon as they hear anything that sounds remotely like a suggestion that the UK should be a lot tougher about who it lets in. Personally, I don't begrudge anyone wanting to make a better life for themselves, but ignoring it means we now have two BNP MEPs.

cethklein said:

The problem is who pays for the ticket? But I agree.

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Who pays the ticket? You mean the airline ticket? Who cares? A $300 ticket to mexico city compared to the $100,000 medical bill? Is this even a valid comparison?

Does anyone remember the man a few years ago who crossed the border in California and got hit by a semi on the highway? He lived in a vegetative state for years on Medi-Cal because they had to treat him (as it was obviously an emergency) and they couldn't move him.

It's just like women who wait until they're in labor to cross the border, because it's not legal for a hospital to turn them away no matter what. It's desperation.

Could you honestly see someone who was in dire need of medical attention and NOT take them where they could get help? I couldn't.

Cyia said:

Could you honestly see someone who was in dire need of medical attention and NOT take them where they could get help? I couldn't.

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You're right...when someone in front of you needs immediate medical attention you'd have to have a special heartless existence to turn your back.

The problem is instead of a "special circumstances", once in awhile, kind of thing, this is happening all the time. As CethKlein mentioned people go to the ER for colds b/c they can't be turned away.

If a pregnant, uninsured woman was vacationing in the US and happened to go into labor, then it wouldn't be such an issue. When people troll for medical treatment, then it becomes a huge issue.

Dclary's nailed this one. Put 'em on a plane. If they're in labor, deliver the baby, then put them on a plane with a bill to the parent government. Same with dire condition patients. Bill their government, just like a guardian. Parent governments in arrears get cut off of whatever current welfare foreign aid we're handing them. We give away so damn many carrots we might as well start using them as sticks.

What hospital are they going to? Hospitals are only obligated to provide emergency medical care. Even county hospitals. If the kid has a runny nose, no hospital here would treat them, they'd tell them to see their primary care physician.

Can anyone please identify his wife in this photo??


Gustavo Rodriguez Adulfo is shown with wife Mindy and daughters
Gabriela, 10, Alicia, 7, and Saturnina, 2.



.

She's the woman in red sitting next to him on the couch.

The story is more interesting

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090606/NEWS/90606010/-1/archive

Cyia said:

She's the woman in red sitting next to him on the couch.

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Thank you.

Plot Device said:

Can anyone please identify his wife in this photo??

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Why is that even relevant?

dclary said:

Pretty easy. Put him on a plane to his nation of origin. They'll be happy to treat one of their citizens, I'm sure.

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cethklein said:

The problem is who pays for the ticket? But I agree. This kind of refutes the claim that illegal immigrants only help the US.

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Don said:

Dclary's nailed this one. Put 'em on a plane.

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Just so I'm clear, are the three of you completely comfortable with the position that you should let a guy die of a treatable condition because he's here illegally? No internet snark, you really actually mean this?

shawkins said:

Just so I'm clear, are the three of you completely comfortable with the position that you should let a guy die of a treatable condition because he's here illegally? No internet snark, you really actually mean this?

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Absolutely not. I want him to get the very best medical treatment his nation of origin can provide, which is all any citizen of any nation should ask for.

shawkins said:

Just so I'm clear, are the three of you completely comfortable with the position that you should let a guy die of a treatable condition because he's here illegally? No internet snark, you really actually mean this?

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The problem is it isn't one guy, and it's a very risky procedure that doesn't even have a 50% chance of being successful.

The problem is there's millions of people looking for healthcare they aren't paying for and cannot even remotely contribute enough to the system to take care of it.

Lets put this another way. I'm fairly poor. I want free healthcare, so I'm going to cross the border to Canada illegally so all the Canadians can support me because well by golly I deserve free health care and it doesn't matter whether or not I'm a citizen, it's their job to provide for me. I refuse to learn their language, I demand a translator be provided and all documents in my native language be provided for me because learning a language is so hard and it's so unfair to demand that I learn the national language I am now living in.

I also demand that they give me a job despite the fact I have no education, and I demand full benefits for my whole family. If you disagree with my demands you are a heartless racist.

So let's assume that his nation of origin is unable to treat him effectively, as is very likely the case here. What then?

dclary said:

Absolutely not. I want him to get the very best medical treatment his nation of origin can provide, which is all any citizen of any nation should ask for.

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Exactly. He should go to the nation he's actually a citizen of and get healthcare, and if they're willing to pay for him to get healthcare they can provide, by all means, ship him back and pay the bill.

shawkins said:

So let's assume that his nation of origin is unable to treat him effectively, as is very likely the case here. What then?

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Sucks to be him. There's diseases my nation of origin can't treat effectively, and I'm fucked if I get them. Why should this guy be any different?

So you're all completely comfortable with the idea of letting a guy die of a treatable condition because he can't afford treatment? No reservations, however slight?

shawkins said:

So you're all completely comfortable with the idea of letting a guy die of a treatable condition because he can't afford treatment? No reservations, however slight?

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Umm I don't know about you but I don't have a hundred thousand bucks in my back pocket. Chances are if I had his condition I would die from it because I couldn't afford it and I am a legal citizen.

If you believe that strongly that we should pay for everyone's healthcare around the world, start opening your wallet because it's going to get expensive fast. Until money is no longer the currency and people are just out to help each other, it's going to cost...a lot.

shawkins said:

So you're all completely comfortable with the idea of letting a guy die of a treatable condition because he can't afford treatment? No reservations, however slight?

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Yeah, because I have to live in reality. I can't afford to live in pollyannaville.