Treeside Press / Electric eBook Publishing

Reni

Treeside is no more. And that letter, which is clearly dated, lets ALL Treeside authors out. The fact that individual letters were not sent doesn't mean dickety.
I'm already marketing my novels elsewhere, there is no time to waste.

I'm also keeping a printed out copy of the letter, as well as some of the messages on the Treeside Yahoo board relating to the business closure, Brian Matthew's brief tenure etc. Because it's only a matter of time before it disappears too. You may want to do this also, as an added precaution.

Cheers and good luck

Liz

From: "Terry R.L. Williams" <trlwilliams@...>
Date: Thu Jun 16, 2005 11:39 am
Subject: Where is Terry trlwilliams
Offline
Send Email

Hi All,

I have been in the hospital for the last week. I will be out early
next week and will try to get the website back up as soon as possible.
I am unclear what has gone on with Brian, but will pick up the ball
with those who wish to continue with TreeSide/EeB.

My apologies for the turmoil, but I have been going through a
seperation, custody and health issues. Please bear with me while I
heal and I will continue to move things forward.

My belief in all of you is strong. If any of you wish your books
released, please email me at trlwilliams@... and I will accomodate
the release. I will talk more later.

Thanks to you all,
Terry

I am unclear what has gone on with Brian, but will pick up the ball
with those who wish to continue with TreeSide/EeB

Reni

Providing that you did not contact Terry, and indicate that you wanted to continue with Treeside, you are free and clear. But heck, even if you did, I still don't think you have a thing to worry about. The whole thing is just so hinky and mickey-mouse. ;-)

Thanks, Liz. As a matter of fact, I received all the Yahoo posts as email updates and have a full record of the happenings in my saved messages.

Concern about discussion

Hello. I have been following this discussion for some time, and am very concerned about it's tone, especially on the part of one particular contributor. First of all, some of the things said were constructive but the accusation that ALL books from Treeside were unedited...the covers were amateurish....that writers were not really published there, are not only false...they border on slander! There were some books published by Treeside that were edited, professional and of excellent quality. The writers from Treeside have enough problems not only looking for a new publisher but trying to promote their books...talk like this is not helpful at all! If you want to say that some books had problems, then fine, but please refrain from lumping everyones book together. If YOUR book was unprofessional...that's one thing...unless you've seen, and read everyones book from Treeside Press....you are in no position to make these sweeping generalizations. When you do read every one of them, then come back and give your opinion. For example, some authors have had book reviews in such places as Macleans Magizine....some authors have books with other publishers as well. Your accusation that Treeside was an author mill may have some merit but that doesn't mean that every book published (and they were published!!!) weren't chosen, based on merit. The former authors at Treeside press...some of which are legitimate writers trying to make a living from their craft may well consider your accusations a personal attack on them. It's one thing to slam the Publisher...Mr. Williams will have to deal with that himself if he chooses....it's another to lump all writers together in one category and label them all in one way. I would suggest you proceed with caution. If an author is refused a book review or loses sales because of your discussion, they might decide to do more than just write a letter on this forum. I am an author formerly of Treeside Press. I have other books with other publishers. I am a good writer. I am just unlucky with this publisher. It happens. Sometimes we make bad choices through no fault of our own. I alreay have another publisher for my book....in fact, I had several offers. Please give the authors from Treeside a break, as well as Brian Matthews. None of this was thier fault. Take it from someone who really knows what happened. You won't hear any more from me. This is not the time to be having a discussion about this. However, please make sure you qualify what you say and give the legitimate writers their due.
Thanks. Concerned.

Contact, please...

Anyone received this notice from Terry Williams, and having access to the full extent of the email address he can be reached at? I do want to get that release, and I did not get any communication from him since March (at which time he said that Brian was taking over, and we all know that Brian does not want to do it anymore).

I have enabled my email address, so if anyone whishes to write me without exposing Terry's email on the forum, that's is OK.

Thanks

I stand behind everything I've said - one hundred percent. Treeside wasn't a publisher, it was a "printer." The books were not chosen on merit, they weren't even read by Terry Williams. Treeside was an author mill. The books were third rate quality - just awful. The cover artwork simply atrocious. Just because you don't want to believe something, Concerned WRiter, doesn't make it not so.

And if you think what's been said so far is "slanderous" (LOL) stay tuned. For instance, what hasn't even been touched on yet, is whatTerry Williams told authors prior to them signing contracts. He said that he was getting a grant from the government to promote Canadian authors. That the first print run would be 3,000, and that the books were distributed throughout several different countries, including the U.S., the U.K. and Spain. Anyone else have that experience?

And whilst on the subject of legal action - which you brought up - ever heard of something called "fraud?"

Cheers

P.S. I just wanted to add here, that Terry Williams has behaved abominably. And health problems and marital woes are no excuse. It was incumbent upon him to send a personalized release letter to each author - or if he is too ill to do that - make sure that it was done by someone else.

If you are going to make all these sweeping statements, I think you should come out and state where you are getting your information from. You must have been working at Treeside Press to know all this for certain. Thats the only way you could you tell that Terry Williams didn't read any of the books he chose to publish. Did you work there? If you did, I guess you are responsible too. If you were one of the authors, why don't you say so? Either you're an author or a member of Treeside Press or...it's possible that all this information is coming from second hand gossip. So, which is it? If you are correct in your information, what are your sources? I can tell you personally that what you said about Government grants was never told to me. So, in this case you are mistaken. Perhaps it was said to some one else but unlike you, I am not about to speak for everyone else unless I truly know what I'm talking about.

I also wanted to add here that I am in no way defending Terry Williams or Treeside Press. On the other hand, I have no interest in wasting my time talking about a defunct publisher. So, you don't need to push your point about this subject to me. On many levels I agree with you. However, I think you should concentrate your critique on what you know for sure. Stick to the facts, and stop generalizing.

Goodness. I was interested in this discussion, but now I see it's going to get ugly. So, for my final note: I can't afford a lawyer. If somebody finds out what's really going on and what we can do, please email me and let me know. I would appreciate it immensely.

Thank you Liz for your posts. It's been really interesting. I have been reading all the posts. Although what you say is interesting, I'm afraid on some levels that Concerned author is making a very valid point here. My friend was published at Treeside and got fried like a lot of people. I assume you were an author there too. I happen to know that my friends book is of excellent quality and was edited by someone T. Williams hired to do the editing...so oops...you are off base there. I know some weren't, but my friends book was. I feel sorry for all the authors there..I also find it sad that you seem to want to take all the authors down with the ship. You have to remember that your book was there too, so what are you saying about your own book? It won't do to damage your own rep. Anyway, just my opinion. The point the other poster made about "generalizations" is valid. YOu can't say "ALL" books unless you personally saw and read "ALL" Books. There must have been some good ones among the bad apples. I can say personally that my friends book was one of them. Picking the wrong publisher doesn't necessary mean the person can't write. It means they made a bad judgement call. My friend is published with two other publishers....six or seven books in all...can't remember. This person can write. Why don't you try supporting each other a bit more instead of bickering? Cheers, Eddie.

HI Reni. Liz is correct here. YOu don't need a lawyer. Start looking for another publisher. The company is down and Williams is in breach of contract. He sent a release for your book already. To make yourself feel better, send a letter to Williams last known address with a copy of the letter. Given his breach of contract, I doubt any problems will occur. Cheers Eddie.

I can tell you personally that what you said about Government grants was never told to me.

I believe this was only told to Canadian authors. Authors outside of Canada were charged several hundred dollars to have their books published. So for them, Treeside was truly just a vanity press, as compared to an author mill. And Treeside didn't have any staff members. It was just Terry Williams.

You know I used to scan the messages on the Treeside/Yahoo board, and was simply appalled by the level of gullability there. "When will the penny drop?" I would ask myself. And now, finally, it has. But hey, don't shoot the messenger. ;-)

There was a discussion about this publisher on another writer's board last year. Lots of good facts about the fees it was charging U.S. writers etc. I'll try and dig it up later and provide a link.

You might also want to check out the Piers Anthony site re Internet publishing. Treeside got a terrible review there as well.

Whoa, hold your horses.

Liz James said:

I stand behind everything I've said - one hundred percent. Treeside wasn't a publisher, it was a "printer." The books were not chosen on merit, they weren't even read by Terry Williams. (...)

Click to expand...

While it could be true that he didn't read ALL of them -- and who is to know? -- he most certainly did read *some* of them, since he was able to quote parts of my story when I spoke to him last August, prior to the contract. As for the other allegations, he did quote a run of 5000 copies, and he mentioned his "contacts" in other countries... which may be false, but could also be true how could YOU know? -- but I had a saying on the cover art even if at the end, he reserved the right to accept it or turn it down. Which means if my book would have come out last December like originally planned, with my concept on the cover, approved by me, if it would have been "atrocious" that would have been at least partly my fault and my lack of taste.

And Terry supplied me with a "homework" of sort, to list contacts in media around my area to arrange for future book signing and such. Why would that be a hollow request if he was just a vanity printer? He could have claimed that he already had all the contacts just the same.

As for the other statement, that the book were full of mistakes and such, well, I can at least vouch for the good job that was done on my galley, by Brian Matthews, mind you.

Seems to me you had a particularly bad experience, perhaps this does not mean it was that bad for everybody.

Eddy

Why would a publisher turn out some excellent quality books (such as your friend's)and others that wouldn't past muster as target practice in a shooting gallery? Unedited, with covers so thin and tacky that they won't lie flat. Terrible "artwork" - looked as if it had been done by a fifth grader - truly the type of thing that gives POD a bad name.

I'm interested in your explanation for this.

Cheers
Liz

And Terry supplied me with a "homework" of sort, to list contacts in media around my area to arrange for future book signing and such. Why would that be a hollow request if he was just a vanity printer?


(LOL) Sorry Cleats, but this was all just part of the "patter." It should teach us all to be a lot more cautious in future, and not so quick to sign on the dotted line. Better luck next time.

Here are the links...happy reading folks

http://www.writers.net/forum/read.php?f=6&i=7796&t=7762

http://www.writers.net/forum/read.php?f=6&i=7742&t=7679

http://www.hipiers.com/publishing.html#E1

Book Surge is a Vanity Press...hello! ;-)

From: "Shannon Mobley" <shannon.mobley@...>
Date: Mon Jun 21, 2004 4:52 pm
Subject: Introduction & Greetings! shannonmobley
Send IM Send Email

Hi groupies!

Terry asked me to participate in this group. Many of you are already familiar with me; others are not.

Please allow me to introduce myself. My name is Shannon Mobley. Terry
Williams and I started Electric eBook Publishing back in 2000 after one of
my first novels was accepted for publication by a major publisher here in
Canada. (Not only has Terry been my business partner, but he's also my
husband. Together we have a rambunctious life full of books and children!)
When we took at look at the publishing contract, Terry and I looked at each
other curiously and decided to publish the book ourselves.

More than 60 titles later, my book is yet unpublished...but it is in the
queue! One of these days I will get to the final edit...

October 2003, I moved out of the publishing business and into an
ownership/sales and marketing position with BookSurge Canada. So any time
your books are ordered (either retail or wholesale) and printed in Canada, I
see them cross the divide between PDF and paperback. I generally will see
the final product even before Terry!

Through BookSurge, I can also provide marketing opportunities to any of you
either on an individual basis or as a group. For example, I've just returned
from two industry trade fairs---Book Expo America and Book Expo Canada---in
which we provided representation of authors' and publishers' titles to the
book trade. Not only are these shows a great opportunity to showcase your
titles to bookbuyers, but they're also a lot of fun!

Anyway...the reason for my email today (in addition to introducing myself),
was to invite any interested parties to a free web seminar to be held
tomorrow evening (Tuesday, June 22, 2004 at 9:00 PM EST) "How to Market Your
Book and Achieve Greater Sales Success." More information can be found
online at: http://booksurgepublishing.com/bsuniversity.php

I look forward to working with each and every one of you.

Best regards,

Shannon Mobley
VP Sales & Marketing
BookSurge Canada
online bookstore: http://www.booksurge.com
Publishers, learn more about our services: http://www.booksurgeb2b.com
email: shannon.mobley@...
toll-free phone: 1-866-333-8305

cleats17 said:

And Terry supplied me with a "homework" of sort, to list contacts in media around my area to arrange for future book signing and such. Why would that be a hollow request if he was just a vanity printer? He could have claimed that he already had all the contacts just the same.

Click to expand...

Just because a publisher is a "vanity" one, it doesn't mean they want you to fail. Most give you plenty of advice about things like this. Many charge for additional services like press releases, reviewer lists, etc. Some of the most expensive vanity presses even include sending out press releases in their package, as well as taking out ads in local papers, etc.

Regardless, such a request is a "red flag" that indicates you are dealing with vanity press. But if you know that's what you've got, and it's what you want...well, it's a somewhat useful suggestion.

Rob

Except this came AFTER I signed. I did not even know about it before the contract was drafted, in fact it came along with the signed copy.

So why "patter" then?

And I was *not* contractually required to buy copies of my book either. The fact I never reached the publishing point may have some relevance, I admit; but it looks like some over-resentment on the part of some people here.

And as the contact request, it may not be that much of a stretch, since I am *not* from BC, and clearly those contacts for my immediate area would have been of some help. Call me naive if you wish, but allow me to call you overly-one-sided.

Now, if someone could supply us with the URL to that web site where the letter from Terry was taken out of, so we can go check what else is there, that would be a positive action.

reni said:

Liz,

Here's my question. Is this letter valid, since none of us ever received the actual letter pertaining to each individual author and work?

Just for the record, it's now been two weeks since I sent my correspondence to the publisher. Nothing. Nada. Not a friggin' word. And mysteriously, it seems all the TreeSide authors have vanished as well. Anybody in the Victoria, British Columbia area want to drop by Selwyn Road and see if there's any sign of life? LoL!

Click to expand...

Selwyn Road may have just been a mail-receiving address, Reni. You could also check the Criss-Cross, or City Directory for Victoria (Public Libraries have them - call the reference department and they'll look it up for you over the phone) All the properties and owners on Selwyn will be listed, (get a copy faxed to you). Then give the next door neighbours a call. They might know what's been going on at the particular premises that you're interested in.

Good luck
Liz

Treeside/Yahoo Message Board

Cleats

Sorry about that. I just assumed that everyone knew where it was, or I would have provided it earlier. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/treesidepress/messages

Better copy it though, I don't think it will be up there for much longer. There hasn't been any action in almost a month. Terry is the moderator of the Board, so all messages have to be screened by him, before they are posted.

Cheers
Liz

Unaccessible. It looks like one had to be a member BEFORE just to get access, and there seems to be no way to join:

Description
This is a private group for authors published by TreeSide Press and Electric eBook Publishing and by invitation only.


Since I was *about* to be published, it looks like I was never "invited".
Interestingly, published authors were offered to get their rights back, but unpublished ones with a valid contract are more stuck. That sucks...

cleats17 said:

Unaccessible. It looks like one had to be a member BEFORE just to get access, and there seems to be no way to join:

Click to expand...

I just filled out the request for membership; it looks like you can still apply to join. The question is: is there a moderator to approve your app.

Rob