Historical Fiction Readers/Writers:

Carmy said:

It's easier for me to say what jerks me out of reading a (an?) historical--modern jargon. If I read one more "No way" set in the 12th century, I'll barf.

Click to expand...

Witness for the prosecution: Evangelynn Stratton

(Warning: move all drinks to a safe distance from your computer before clicking on the above link.)

Around every large well known event are often smaller ones. They add freshness to details. A bomb might destroy a church, but one man saves many from a fire at the factory around the corner. Or choose a sword type that was available but not used often in battles and make the character the expert etc.

As for romance, men haven't changed much but woman have. I like the history to be layered seamlessly into the character's lives. Otherwise, it causes a mental jolt out of the story.

BardSkye said:

So if I come across a 12th century female who flaunts every rule of her society and doesn't end up with severe consequences, I can't buy it.

Click to expand...

That's too bad because they were there. In the middle ages a group of women were ticked off that only men could participate in tournaments and caused an outcrry when they showed up riding on horseback naked to the waist! I didn't use them in my novel but it was mighty tempting.

Oh, I don't doubt there were renegades. And if the author can point to a specific source, by all means use it. I have myself: the MC of my WIP is a servant who married royalty. I would normally scoff at that, had I not found it documented by Flavius Josephus. You can bet it'll be mentioned in the notes, chapter and verse, because I wouldn't expect anyone else to believe it, either.

What happened to the nude riders after they made their point? Did they settle down to become pillars of the community or were they run out of town?

girlyswot said:

Witness for the prosecution: Evangelynn Stratton

(Warning: move all drinks to a safe distance from your computer before clicking on the above link.)

Click to expand...

I know that one must respect one's fellow writers but could someone please, please, please tell me how she got published?

Am I missing something? It makes me want to throw in the towel, it really does.

I too like the small details and the little-known word tossed in casually. If the language is authentic (and barring any glaring errors), the author generally gains credibility with me. To me, dialogue is very important in establishing an authentic feel to the whole novel.

And speaking of dialogue establishing authenticity....

girlyswot said:

Witness for the prosecution: Evangelynn Stratton

(Warning: move all drinks to a safe distance from your computer before clicking on the above link.)

Click to expand...

I especially like him "furling his eyebrows together in suspicion". Now that just sounds painful...

girlyswot said:

Witness for the prosecution: Evangelynn Stratton

(Warning: move all drinks to a safe distance from your computer before clicking on the above link.)

Click to expand...

"Cute"????? Bwahahahahaha!

(I think I just used up my question mark quota for the day )

Since I am on like my 20th re-write on one WIP, one thing holds consistent on the positive criticism: People like the fact that I throw in little-known tidbits which are strange but turn out to be true. Things which are unbelievable today were perfectly normal in history and therefore unlikely to be remarked upon.
As just one example, people would find it atrocious today that major cities still had in their official procedures requirements for identifying houses owned by “coloreds” AS RECENT AS 1977 when official interaction such as permit inspections or even appraiser visits.
People seem to catch on to these things and go “No way”; I say, “Way” and show them.

I add a small bibliography of sources in the back so people can go check it out. In one case, a friend of mine went to the library to look up an old newspaper article because he argued with me about the authenticity of the claim. He was aghast.

So I kept that theme in my story but I am careful not to overdo it. Since my story has to do with dirty politics and conspiracies, my biggest problem isn’t the supply of atrocious indiscretions and under-handed maneuvering of policies and good-ole-boy deals, I have too much to weed through. I could write a book with no story, just “did you know?” facts.

The rest of my book has been shredded and torn apart and re-written due to complexities of the issues.

firedrake said:

I know that one must respect one's fellow writers but could someone please, please, please tell me how she got published?

Am I missing something? It makes me want to throw in the towel, it really does.

Click to expand...

Nay! Canst thou meanst thus? I'm snorting with disbelief. My face is flaring with indignation. And now I'm turning off my PC and briskly strutting away. I was, like, yeah, that really was cute.

firedrake said:

I know that one must respect one's fellow writers but could someone please, please, please tell me how she got published?

Am I missing something? It makes me want to throw in the towel, it really does.

Click to expand...

She's published through iUniverse. I don't know the difference between self- and vanity publishing but it certainly falls into that sort of area. Don't give up!

cherubsmummy said:

"Cute"????? Bwahahahahaha!

(I think I just used up my question mark quota for the day )

Click to expand...

That was the point at which I had to press the Back button and fast.

girlyswot said:

She's published through iUniverse. I don't know the difference between self- and vanity publishing but it certainly falls into that sort of area. Don't give up!

Click to expand...

Ah, thank God for that. I really was thinking of jacking it all in after I read that.
It was beyond bad.

firedrake said:

Ah, thank God for that. I really was thinking of jacking it all in after I read that.
It was beyond bad.

Click to expand...

It sells for around $20 on Amazon. I do feel like pointing out to everyone who's bought it that you can read fiction that bad on the internet for free. What I most love is this bit from her author bio:

A history buff and founder of the local Canterbury Literary Society, the medieval era has always held a fascination for Evi. "I like to incorporate factual events in my books," she explains. "It gives the stories a sense of reality, and the reader actually learns history." Reading her books, one gets the sense that she really does her homework!

Click to expand...

Ah, come on! There's such a thing as 'so bad it's good'. That just ain't it.

firedrake said:

I agree.
Romance and sex have been around probably before our ancestors climbed down from the trees and started walking upright.
Historical fiction isn't just about the big events or the movers and shakers of history but, to me, it's how events impact everyday lives.

Click to expand...

Also agree! That's why I get upset when I see so many historicals being turned into nothing but the characters' romps in the bedroom. If anything, I like it to be left up to the imagination. I don't need the whole bodice ripper thing; it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

girlyswot said:

Witness for the prosecution: Evangelynn Stratton

(Warning: move all drinks to a safe distance from your computer before clicking on the above link.)

Click to expand...

OpheliaRevived said:

I just spit a perfectly good cup of coffee all over myself.

Click to expand...

I did give you fair warning!

rtilryarms said:

Since I am on like my 20th re-write on one WIP, one thing holds consistent on the positive criticism: People like the fact that I throw in little-known tidbits which are strange but turn out to be true.

Click to expand...

Well some of my readers need to take tips from your readers. It's bothering me that, with one of my books, my little-known tidbits are noticed and talked about, but not in a positive way. They'll say, "Well, I've never heard of this. It makes me wonder if the author has really done her homework." When I protest that, yes, these are all authentic, well-researched details, they sniff and say, "Well, then, you need to establish your credibility or I'm never going to believe such facts." How does one establish credibility apart from...um...giving authentic, well-researched details? Grrr...

PastMidnight said:

Well some of my readers need to take tips from your readers. It's bothering me that, with one of my books, my little-known tidbits are noticed and talked about, but not in a positive way. They'll say, "Well, I've never heard of this. It makes me wonder if the author has really done her homework." When I protest that, yes, these are all authentic, well-researched details, they sniff and say, "Well, then, you need to establish your credibility or I'm never going to believe such facts." How does one establish credibility apart from...um...giving authentic, well-researched details? Grrr...

Click to expand...

I think it is reviewed positivey because of the context. Plus, since I rely heavily on public official records, I bring it in more with dialogue and not a narration.

PastMidnight said:

How does one establish credibility apart from...um...giving authentic, well-researched details? Grrr...

Click to expand...

Citing your source material at the end can help.

PastMidnight said:

Well some of my readers need to take tips from your readers. It's bothering me that, with one of my books, my little-known tidbits are noticed and talked about, but not in a positive way. They'll say, "Well, I've never heard of this. It makes me wonder if the author has really done her homework." When I protest that, yes, these are all authentic, well-researched details, they sniff and say, "Well, then, you need to establish your credibility or I'm never going to believe such facts." How does one establish credibility apart from...um...giving authentic, well-researched details? Grrr...

Click to expand...

I'm with you here, PM. I posted an excerpt of one scene in my Sparta story on a blog where people were critiquing chapter endings, and it just amazes me that readers can challenge the historical accuracy of my story with statements like (paraphrasing), "I always thought that Sparta..." or "Years ago I read that..." where it's clear that they're not experts or even well-read in my era/culture, yet they finger point at details and question my accuracy. I think I'm going to get a fair amount of that, because ancient Sparta is so different from what most people know of ancient Greece, which is probably Athenian culture. Until an author has a well-earned reputation for producing something of quality and accuracy, I suppose there will be these sorts of challenges.

c.e.

BardSkye said:

Citing your source material at the end can help.

Click to expand...

Yes, a bibliography is essential for authenticating claims.