Respecting The Fellow Author

I'm not really Welsh, you know...My family were Irish for generations, and as the great Spike Milligan once screamed: 'The blood of KINGS runs through the veins of all Irishmen!'

One of my ancestors actually was a king of Ireland...sadly, a witch cursed him and he went bonkers, believed he was a bird, lived in a tree and wrote poetry. I'm not making this up, Seamus Heaney wrote about him.

Anyway, back on topic: Oh yes, disrespecting authors...Stephenie Meyer...blah blah...Dan Blue Brown etc etc...

StevenJ said:

I'm not really Welsh, you know...My family were Irish for generations, and as the great Spike Milligan once screamed: 'The blood of KINGS runs through the veins of all Irishmen!'

One of my ancestors actually was a king of Ireland...sadly, a witch cursed him and he went bonkers, believed he was a bird, lived in a tree and wrote poetry. I'm not making this up, Seamus Heaney wrote about him.

Anyway, back on topic: Oh yes, disrespecting authors...Stephenie Meyer...blah blah...Dan Blue Brown etc etc...

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Steven I've told you before not to take your life experiences and pretend they happened to other people.

brainstorm77 said:

I know some users feel the need to be nasty quite often ... But I'm talking about personal attacks .. not opinions on if a book is great or not.

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If an author reacts to legitimate criticisms of her book by having public tantrums on her blog, then she's going to be criticized for her behavior. Or if she brags about how little research she did, or how her main character is just a "Mary Sue" for the sex fantasies she has about teenage boys, then yeah, personal criticism is absolutely warranted.

Also, if she poses for a publicity photo wearing lipstick so deep red that her mouth resembles a turkey's ass, then yes, she'll garner personal criticism.

I would point out that if this hypothetical writer's prose was good, she'd be less of a target for personal attacks. (I don't notice anyone talking about how Ewan McGowan looks.) But in the end, we learn more from talking about writing than we do from talking about an author's fashion choices or petulant behaviors. So we should probably try to stick to critical discussion of prose as much as possible.

Jane Austen - dog or kitten?
Charles Dickens - herbert or hunk?
Stephen Hawking - a pretty clever guy
Scarletpeaches - a cross between Gwyneth Paltrow and Kate Winslet

Writers are ugly. Film directors have big hair. Black men have enormous schlongs. The Scots are mean, the Welsh shag sheep. The English play the baddies, the Irish are loopy and the Yanks just love tanks.

Discuss.

Hillgate said:

Jane Austen - dog or kitten?

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Whining chicklit author for the 19th century.

Hillgate said:

Charles Dickens - herbert or hunk?

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Herbert, but still kept whatserface Tiernan dangling. A complete shit to his wife, though.

Hillgate said:

Stephen Hawking - a pretty clever guy

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Typical Brit. A smidgeon of success in his chosen field and he adopts a fake American accent.

Hillgate said:

Scarletpeaches - a cross between Gwyneth Paltrow and Kate Winslet

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As long as I don't have to shag Chris Martin or Sam Mendes, I'm happy with that.

Hillgate said:

Writers are ugly.

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Except me.

Hillgate said:

Film directors have big hair.

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Hmm. Do they? I hope you realise I'll be on the lookout for big hair now.

Hillgate said:

Black men have enormous schlongs.

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*waits for Jcomp to post here*

Hillgate said:

The Scots are mean

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How very dare you!

Hillgate said:

the Welsh shag sheep

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I have photos of StevenJ to prove it.

Hillgate said:

The English play the baddies

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Yup.

Hillgate said:

the Irish are loopy

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Colin Farrell. Case in point.

Hillgate said:

the Yanks just love tanks.

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And blowing stuff up.

Hillgate said:

Discuss.

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I just did!

scarletpeaches said:

Dear god. OFG. You said...you said..."Shite."

My illusions are shattered.

Delete my account. My life on AW is over.

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Huh, you should hear Susie.

brainstorm77 said:

Not talking about the writing being judged people... Talking about the author themselves!

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Ken said:

...clearly not in your own case, but in some others' I believe it does. Jealousy is, after all, a pretty common foible.

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NeuroFizz said:

Just like in science, peer review is an important and necessary part of the writing business. But that review should be on the work, not on the person. A particularly pointed negative review of an author's writing is NOT necessarily an attack on the writer as a person, but rather on that writer's written work. There is a huge difference, and it's a line that is usually pretty easy to spot.

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Devil Ledbetter said:

If an author reacts to legitimate criticisms of her book by having public tantrums on her blog, then she's going to be criticized for her behavior. Or if she brags about how little research she did, or how her main character is just a "Mary Sue" for the sex fantasies she has about teenage boys, then yeah, personal criticism is absolutely warranted.

Also, if she poses for a publicity photo wearing lipstick so deep red that her mouth resembles a turkey's ass, then yes, she'll garner personal criticism.

I would point out that if this hypothetical writer's prose was good, she'd be less of a target for personal attacks. (I don't notice anyone talking about how Ewan McGowan looks.) But in the end, we learn more from talking about writing than we do from talking about an author's fashion choices or petulant behaviors. So we should probably try to stick to critical discussion of prose as much as possible.

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A person has to reach a certain level of emotional maturity to be able to differentiate between criticizing someone's work or behavior and criticizing the person. Saying "I don't like this book" is not the same thing as saying "I don't like the author." It's pretty easy to tell when you are dealing with someone who doesn't know the difference. They usually become very defensive about their work or they make statements about the author instead of about the work or the behavior. They also switch the difference in meaning between "I" statements and "you" statements. (I still haven't figured out the why of this one, yet. )

I tend to ignore or avoid talking to people who have demonstrated this lack of emotional maturity. I've butted my head against that wall too many times to continue doing it.

However, a successful author who hasn't reached this level of emotional maturity is in deep doodoo, there is no way for them to avoid criticism of their work or their behavior if they blog or otherwise show themselves publicly. It doesn't matter how something is said, they are going to get their knickers in a twist.

brainstorm77 said:

Wow, I cannot get over the many threads that often turn into author bashing.
What happened to the rule of respecting the fellow author?
Its fine not to like a book.. But when it gets down to making personal attacks on the author or calling the book s*i*, personally I think thats a tad much or talking about the authors personal life and looks. Just my opinion but would like hears yours on it.

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That rule only applies to forum members including known authors who frequent this site.

Everyone else is fair game for bashing.

Hillgate said:

Black men have enormous schlongs.
Discuss.

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Pics?

If/when I'm published I welcome all bashing, because you have to learn to take it if you dish it out.

As long as - and here's the main point - such bashination is genuine and not merely a knee-jerk response to any criticism I have doled out.

"You are teh badz writar, you dissed Stephanie u iz just teh jealouss!!!!!!!111one!!!1"

You mean it just can't be my normal bashing of you?

I have to be original now?

Beach Bunny said:

However, a successful author who hasn't reached this level of emotional maturity is in deep doodoo, there is no way for them to avoid criticism of their work or their behavior if they blog or otherwise show themselves publicly. It doesn't matter how something is said, they are going to get their knickers in a twist.

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Exhibit A: Anne Rice.

scarletpeaches said:

If/when I'm published I welcome all bashing, because you have to learn to take it if you dish it out.

As long as - and here's the main point - such bashination is genuine and not merely a knee-jerk response to any criticism I have doled out.

"You are teh badz writar, you dissed Stephanie u iz just teh jealouss!!!!!!!111one!!!1"

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When you get published I'm going to make a myspace page on how jealous u iz of leik everyone!!!

Beach Bunny said:

However, a successful author who hasn't reached this level of emotional maturity is in deep doodoo, there is no way for them to avoid criticism of their work or their behavior if they blog or otherwise show themselves publicly. It doesn't matter how something is said, they are going to get their knickers in a twist.

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Hmm. Well, first, I'm not successful, so I haven't reach that level of maturity yet.

Second, if I were to become successful, I'd just avoid reading any opinions of my work, totally, and I'd probably resign from this site as well.

I'm as thin skinned at they come.

I'm with DonRoc. Buy the book. Say whatever the hell you want about me.

Just buy the book.

Williebee said:

I'm with DonRoc. Buy the book. Say whatever the hell you want about me.

Just buy the book.

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You wrote a book?

Who knew.

Is it any good?

*ducking and running*

I'd love to have people make fun of my writing.

Because then they'd have to actually buy the book.

I know you guys are mostly kidding, but I would hate to have any significant portion of the readers out there write me off as a naked emperor.

I know very well that everyone won't like what I write, but if too many people form the opinion that I'm the talentless spawn of media whoring and poor taste, then I would be miserable.

Williebee said:

I'm with DonRoc. Buy the book. Say whatever the hell you want about me.

Just buy the book.

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Amen!

Perks said:

I know you guys are mostly kidding, but I would hate to have any significant portion of the readers out there write me off as a naked emperor.

I know very well that everyone won't like what I write, but if too many people form the opinion that I'm the talentless spawn of media whoring and poor taste, then I would be miserable.

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I'm just talentless hack. I know that, but I don't want to hear it. And I leave the media whoring to others.

IdiotsRUs said:

When you get published I'm going to make a myspace page on how jealous u iz of leik everyone!!!

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And I will TOTES go Anne Rice batshit on your ass!!!

Someone criticised one of her books on Amazon and she SERIOUSLY flipped out. I mean, REALLY. Personal insults, calling the intelligence of the reviewer into question, saying, "You just don't understand me! You're not clever enough!"

It was so funny it was borderline, "WTF?"

I'll see if I can find a link anywhere because I think she subsequently took the rant down from Amazon but someone, somewhere is bound to have screenshotted it.

Bloody hell, while I appreciate that that Nuttymadam person is perhaps overzealous in her love of all things Meyer, I thought the Youtube comments about her (NM) were really hurtful & unnecessary.

She set the benchmark for online flip-outs. Even Stephenie Meyer couldn't measure up to that.

It was...well, a sight to behold.

I'll stop there, and go find a link if I can.

ETA: Was replying to brainstorm77, not the sockless Welshman.